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Old 08-29-2012, 06:48 AM   #46
DiapDealer
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Originally Posted by shidunce View Post
I am not going to make discussion here.
And yet you continue to do exactly that.

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

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I am sure, that in more 20-40 years (and maybe earlier) all wireless technology will be out of law. Its just a matter of time. And then all the talks will be done without me and you will be just notified: "Tadammm, from now wireless is something not legal!"
That's just a silly, silly prediction. No radios? No satellite communication? No cell-phones (or even cordless land-lines)? No cordless battery recharging? All current research/improvements on cordless electricity abandoned? Not only abandoned, but actually made illegal in 20-40 years. How will law enforcement officers keep in contact? How will search and rescue teams coordinate to save lives? How will air traffic controllers keep aircraft in patterns? You're talking about a total regression of civilization/technology as we know it inside of 40 years. Barring apocalyptic events ... that's just plain fantasy. There will be even less corded devices in 20-40 years. Guaranteed.

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Old 08-29-2012, 09:23 AM   #47
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Quality post! I won't need to go relaxing in the Lounge forum today. Thanks to all for the facts and the FUD.

The bacon video was slightly difficult to watch to the end : maybe should I change my "Custom User Title" right now.

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Old 08-29-2012, 11:24 AM   #48
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My EMF Measurements

Since this topic came up, I placed a 9V battery inside my Lutron EMF 822-A detector to run these tests:

1. Background EMF level in PC room: 00.3 Gauss
2. Kindle 3 turned on 1 inch away: 00.5 Gauss
3. Kindle Fire turned on 1 inch away: 01.1 Gauss
4. ATT Residential Gateway (Router) 1 inch away: 01.7 Gauss
5. ATT Residental Gateway (Router) 6 inches away: 00.5 Gauss
6. Dell Studio XPS PC 1 inch away from back: 33.5 Gauss
7. Dell Studio XPS PC 1 inch away from front: 01.0 Gauss
8. Dell Studio XPS PC 15 inches away from front (usual sitting distance): 00.6 Gauss
9. Motorola DVR 1 inch away: 05.5 Gauss
10. Motorola DVR 35 inches away (usual viewing distance): 01.0 Gauss

My LCD Monitor and TV did not add to the PC or DVR measurements.

Thus, the only real danger would come if one sits one inch from the BACK of one's PC or less than one inch from the DVR. Kindle 3 has almost no EMF radiation and the Kindle Fire has a little more roughly equal to the reading when watching TV at the normal viewing distance.

EMF detectors come at a low price (under $ 100). Geiger counters come at a price exceeding $ 350 and would not pay to purchase unless we are near a nuclear disaster or explosion. Lots of them have been sold to Japanese buyers by Amazon after the Fukushima disaster as noted from the reviews on the Geiger counter pages there. In addition Geiger counters must be recalibrated annually and run the risk of contamination after which they are USELESS.

Last edited by sirmaru; 08-29-2012 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:53 AM   #49
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Since this topic came up, I placed a 9V battery inside my Lutron EMF 822-A detector to run these tests: ...
But those tests do not take frequency into account, and different frequencies have different penetration and absorbsion characteristics, and different biological effects.

It can also be important to take into account whether the EM radiation is a broad spectrum source (like heat or sunlight) or a coherent beam (like a laser or a radar beam).

And for biological effects, the MODULATION of the carrier wave can also be important (and especially aperiodic/syncopated pulse rates), but amplitude attack and decay, and frequency variations, can also be important when studying biological effects.

It is not as simple as turning on a meter and reading some magic numbers, like the Scientologists like to do with their fancy E-Meter.

Holding an EMF detector too close to an RF source does not give valid measurements unless you use an antenna/detector probe designed for that. The typical log-periodic antenna used on these devices is primarily effective for measuring background EMF and not nearby point-source EMF.

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-29-2012 at 11:53 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:07 PM   #50
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Dental X-rays worse than Kindles for radiation

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Originally Posted by geekmaster View Post
But those tests do not take frequency into account, and different frequencies have different penetration and absorbsion characteristics, and different biological effects.

Holding an EMF detector too close to an RF source does not give valid measurements unless you use an antenna/detector probe designed for that. The typical log-periodic antenna used on these devices is primarily effective for measuring background EMF and not nearby point-source EMF.
See this link:

http://www.webmd.com/brain/news/2012...d-brain-tumors

It appears annual dental X-rays can cause benign tumors in one's brain. That is based on a medical study. Kindles have no where near that risk.

Folks should only have dental X-rays every three years but most still go with the annual X-rays.

Its true the Lutron is a primitive EMF detector but it can be purchased at a reasonable price. High grade Geiger counters sell at Amazon for $ 550 and up and require an annual re-calibration at additional cost. I'm sure ownership of a Kindle does NOT warrant that cost.

When the nukes start flying, I'm sure all of us will buy a high grade Geiger counter just to test our food before we buy it. They do that right now on the East Coast of Japan after the Fukishima disaster affected their food supply.

Finally, the HUGE reading one inch from the back of my PC is significant. A special polnting device is NOT required to see that. On the other hand, how many folks sit one inch from the BACK of their PC every day?

Microwave ovens generate huge amounts of EMF waves. Thus, my wife never uses our microwave oven at all. I've seen studies relating their use to an increased frequency of eye cataracts.

Folks, who wear defibrillators or pace makers, have a much lower tolerance of EMF and gamma radation. Perhaps those folks should buy a high grade Geiger counter and a high grade EMF detector. They should consult with their doctors on their tolerance for all the varieties of radiation and govern their lives accordingly.

Last edited by sirmaru; 08-29-2012 at 12:25 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:27 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by sirmaru View Post
See this link:

http://www.webmd.com/brain/news/2012...d-brain-tumors

It appears annual dental X-rays can cause benign tumors in one's brain. That is based on a medical study. Kindles have no where near that risk.

Folks should only have dental X-rays every three years but most still go with the annual X-rays.

Its true the Lutron is a primitive EMF detector but it can be purchased at a reasonable price. High grade Geiger counters sell at Amazon for $ 550 and up and require an annual re-calibration at additional cost. I'm sure ownership of a Kindle does NOT warrant that cost.

When the nukes start flying, I'm sure all of us will buy a high grade Geiger counter just to test our food before we buy it. They do that right now on the East Coast of Japan after the Fukishima disaster affected their food supply.

Finally, the HUGE reading one inch from the back of my PC is significant. A special polnting device is NOT required to see that. On the other hand, how many folks sit one inch from the BACK of their PC every day?
Don't confuse EM radiation with ionizing radiation.

Any EM radiation with a frequency higher than long-wave party black-lights, including that from tanning beds and X-ray machines, has enough photon energy to damage DNA. Wi-fi and cellphone frequencies are FAR below that threshold.

But Extremely Low Frequencies (ELF / audio-frequency EM) are know to trigger biological effects such as hormones release and endocrine disruption, but then so is exposure to chemicals (especially food microwaved in proximity to plastic food containers which can trigger premature body changes in pre-adolescent females). Even common pesticides have been shown to trigger female organ growth in male frogs.

The EM effects from the RF wavelengths used by our technotoys are nothing to worry about compared to biologically active chemicals in the food we eat and the air we breathe. Even so, we live much longer than our ancestors.

I have two geiger counters, which show that the granite stones surrounding my house do emit significant ionizing radiation. I would suggest that you avoid sleeping on a granite pillow.

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-29-2012 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:32 PM   #52
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TWO geiger counter?

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I have two geiger counters, which show that the granite stones surrounding my house do emit significant ionizing radiation.
Do you live near Tokyo?

I'm way into my old age. Nothing of any sort can change my shortened future longevity other than an accident.

The AMA recently issued a notice that those over age 75 should not even bother to test or treat prostate cancer. They are SURE to die of another cause at that age.

If our worst risk is a Kindle, then we will all live to age 120 at which point human cells stop dividing.

Our life expectancy has grown dramatically in the last 100 years mainly due to better sanitation. Life expectancy FROM age 85 onwards has DECREASED in the last 20 years from more medical attention, more wars and more violence. See this link for that study:

http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/29/1/140.full

Last edited by sirmaru; 08-29-2012 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:37 PM   #53
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Do you live near Tokyo?
That depends on your definition of "near". Considering the fact that radioactive dust can travel across the globe, I would consider living in the USA (as shown under my avatar) as "near Tokyo".
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirmaru View Post
If our worst risk is a Kindle, then we will all live to age 120 at which point human cells stop dividing.
Unless you can reset your telomeres to restart cell division (like they do in cloning experiments by exposing the cells to an electric field). Then you can live forever.

Also, *some* ionizing radiation exposure seems to be good for longevity, as shown by anecdotal statistical studies where people who live in areas with high levels of natural background radiation live longer, and in industrial exposure studies:
http://www.aps.org/units/fps/newslet...r/a5oct01.html
The theory is that exercising your immune system is good for you. And it has been proven in scientifically controlled cell culture experiments too:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiation_hormesis
But anecdotal evidence about the effect on humans does not eliminate the fact that they may live longer because of better diet and exercise, rather than radiation exposure. But I *like* the immune system exercise theory.

So, it appears that "moderation in all things is good for you" even applies to ionizing radiation. This is GOOD news.

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-30-2012 at 10:14 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:49 PM   #54
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Near immortality?

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That depends on your definition of "near". Considering the fact that radioactive dust can travel across the globe, I would consider living in the USA (as shown under my avatar) as "near Tokyo".
Unless you can reset your telomeres to restart cell division (like they do in cloning experiments by exposing the cells to an electric field). Then you can live forever.[/QUOTE]

Personally, I believe life spans of 1,000 years or more are possible but the vegetative state will be required for that. The Red Wood Tree now lives an average of 1,000 years without any medical attention.

The question then would be how many would really want to live 1,000 years in the vegetative state? I'm sure our present technology is close to that possibilty.
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:52 PM   #55
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Personally, I believe life spans of 1,000 years or more are possible but the vegetative state will be required for that. The Red Wood Tree now lives an average of 1,000 years without any medical attention.

The question then would be how many would really want to live 1,000 years in the vegetative state? I'm sure our present technology is close to that possibilty.
In our culture, the broadcast media that feeds our brains assures that most of us stay in a (mentally) vegetative state most of the time. That helps them tell us what to buy and who to vote for. Perhaps that is why our lifespans are increasing. Thinking too much can kill you.

But redwood trees do not have wi-fi (they use low-bandwidth chemical aerosol communications): http://discovermagazine.com/2002/apr/featplants

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-29-2012 at 12:57 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 01:26 PM   #56
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Two geiger counter?
Two different types. One is a sensitive "Uranium Prospector" geiger counter which can measure low-level background radiation, but would overload near a nuclear "event". The other is a much less sensitive "civil defense" geiger counter for use during a nuclear emergency, to determine if an environment is safe for human exposure. And I have a bunch of non-film reusable radiation dosimeters too.
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Old 08-29-2012, 01:33 PM   #57
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But redwood trees do not have wi-fi (they use low-bandwidth chemical aerosol communications)
Redwood = The Invisible Government
chemical aerosol communications = chemtrails
wi-fi = low level mind control

Am I reading this correctly? How deep does the rabbit hole go?

Last edited by Serpentine; 08-29-2012 at 01:34 PM. Reason: derrrr
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Old 08-29-2012, 01:34 PM   #58
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More scary radiation "sickness" (The Radioactive Boyscout Strikes Again):
http://www.dangerouslaboratories.org/radscout.html

This longer version of the original story contains a lot more radioactive fun:
http://www.harpers.org/archive/1998/11/0059750

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-29-2012 at 01:44 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 02:04 PM   #59
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Others are profiting from these scary wifi FUD claims too. This one is just too funny.

EarthCalm OMEGA WiFi & Scalar Home System (2 Part Home Protection System):
http://www.emfnews.org/Earthcalm-Ome...rotection.html
Quote:
When the OMEGA WiFi is inserted into a laptop or router, the hazardous field is transformed into a beneficial field of protection that will protect you throughout the day and while sleeping at night. It does this by modulating a grounding pattern into the EMF microwave field of the laptop or router, which allows your body to dissipate the hazardous radiation.
Finally, somebody is selling wifi with claimed medical and health benefits so good that your health insurance company should pay for it. And for about $200USD, it is only 40 times as expensive as this "unhealthy" $5 wifi: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-150M-Wir...item2a21649daf

What were they smoking when they came up with all this pseudo-science B.S. anyway?

Last edited by geekmaster; 08-29-2012 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 08-29-2012, 02:14 PM   #60
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Tumors is something that happens because of real abuse of cellphones.
Hogwash. The radiation from cell phones and wi-fi devices is non-ionizing radiation, also known as heat. You receive far more radiation from the sun, or even the cosmic microwave background radiation that has bombarded our planet since its formation.
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