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Old 05-28-2012, 08:36 PM   #31
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Thanks, Dale. I will certainly visit your wiki! But be careful when you disagree. i just got a warning from a Net Nannie when I responded to an ill-mannered poster who sent a sarcastic post to me.
Now that's some funny stuff.
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Old 05-28-2012, 08:42 PM   #32
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Thanks, Dale. I will certainly visit your wiki! But be careful when you disagree. i just got a warning from a Net Nannie when I responded to an ill-mannered poster who sent a sarcastic post to me. and now i will probably have this post deleted also. Oh well!
I have an advantage in that I am a moderator! It is the MobileRead wiki and it contains lots of useful stuff.

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Old 05-28-2012, 08:50 PM   #33
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Well this has certainly turned into a tempest in a teapot! What started out as a question to see if by using sigil, I could place the book title on every page. it turned into the question that an OP had the right to ask a question in what ever forum he chose. They won, they took their football and went home. quite frankly, I'm tired of the whole mess. I don't even have the right to close the thread. Since i don't frequent this forum at all, till now, I will bid you adieu for I do not expect to see you again.
Thanks,
Paul

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Old 05-29-2012, 03:21 AM   #34
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Well this has certainly turned into a tempest in a teapot! What started out as a question to see if by using sigil, I could place the book title on every page. it turned into the question that an OP had the right to ask a question in what ever forum he chose. They won, they took their football and went home. quite frankly, I'm tired of the whole mess. I don't even have the right to close the thread. Since i don't frequent this forum at all, till now, I will bid you adieu for I do not expect to see you again.
Thanks,
Paul
The tempest--and its associated teapot--is all yours. You posted in a forum not likely to get you useful answers, for, as I endeavored to explain very politely, the query has to do with the overall ePUB format and devices, NOT Sigil, nor how the ePUB was created-only how the CSS is used, which is universal, not "epub-maker-specific." When the mods moved it, it wasn't a "spanking;" they moved it so that MORE people with expertise in ePUB could answer the question. It's your perception that you were somehow "disrespected" or "net-nannie'd" that's the issue.

What is this, two posters we've had in the last month, with this type of vitriolic reaction, no matter how many people have endeavored to help? Man, it's turning into an epidemic. It's unfortunate that so many people seem to have this acrimonious, instant response to any attempts by those who DO know the answers to help them.

Frankly, makes me want to say--why bother? If this is going to be the norm, I'd rather just chat with the others here who are serious, and can spit-ball answers, than take or read abuse from those that don't. What's the upside for answering noob questions, if this is what to be expected?

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Old 05-29-2012, 05:48 AM   #35
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There are supported in the ePub 3 specification so I suspect they are here to stay. They are easier to control than PDF and are much cheaper to build than buying Acrobat from Adobe.
But PDF gives truly fixed layout, while fixed ePub is only semi-fixed (you don't control exact font size and linebreaks, I suspect), which has the potential to look awful.

As for creating a PDF, there are tons of free tools, and anything that can print can give you a PDF. My preferred tool would be the TeX family.
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Old 05-29-2012, 05:49 AM   #36
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Old 05-29-2012, 01:00 PM   #37
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But PDF gives truly fixed layout, while fixed ePub is only semi-fixed (you don't control exact font size and linebreaks, I suspect), which has the potential to look awful.

As for creating a PDF, there are tons of free tools, and anything that can print can give you a PDF. My preferred tool would be the TeX family.
Well we are drifting off topic but of course I would agree PDF is truly fixed format. You can force fully fixed in ePub fixed layout if you wish. I believe the main difference is that ePub is aimed at eBook devices while PDF is aimed at a piece of paper. While it is possible to adjust PDF to the eBook size this is very seldom done while it is required for fixed layout ePub. I really like the ePub 3 method of allowing the user to mix fixed layout and floating layout within the same document. I see real value in this. ePub three also allows you to force the portrait/landscape orientation for a particular page. This opens lots of possibilities.

Most available PDF tools make lousy electronic documents without metadata or TOC, they are truly intended to be printed IMHO.

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Old 05-29-2012, 11:22 PM   #38
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Well we are drifting off topic but of course I would agree PDF is truly fixed format. You can force fully fixed in ePub fixed layout if you wish. I believe the main difference is that ePub is aimed at eBook devices while PDF is aimed at a piece of paper. While it is possible to adjust PDF to the eBook size this is very seldom done while it is required for fixed layout ePub. I really like the ePub 3 method of allowing the user to mix fixed layout and floating layout within the same document. I see real value in this. ePub three also allows you to force the portrait/landscape orientation for a particular page. This opens lots of possibilities.

Most available PDF tools make lousy electronic documents without metadata or TOC, they are truly intended to be printed IMHO.

Dale
We ARE off-topic, but the original topic turned tedious, anyway. We use "fixed-format" for iBooks, Nook (where it's called "ePIB," mind you, and "secretly" made with a clone of iAuthor) and the Fire, for children's books, and for that, I really like it.

I also think it could be useful for LOTS of books we get in here that I just stare at, knowing we'll never get them to work in a reflowable format. Who am I to say that so-and-so's book isn't worth publishing? Fixed-format, reflowable...guys, what's important, what we have to think about and care about, volunteers at DP or disgusting scummy commercial slaves like moi, is that unlike the paper books that we all so painstakingly proof at DP, in an attempt to preserve our written past (and lord knows, they are not all "worth" saving)--is that what we do HERE and now should and will be preserved forever. 100 years from now, barring disaster, no one at DP will have to wonder if that fixed-format kids' book I just did says "fox" or "fix." ;-) Just a thought.

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Old 05-29-2012, 11:38 PM   #39
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A 100 years? Better print them on paper. Hopefully ePub 3 will standardize the mess or maybe just adopt iBooks method since it is cloned by B&N and officially supported on the Kobo Vox. I wondered what the B&N format was. And it isn't supported by their own authoring tool.
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Old 05-30-2012, 12:05 AM   #40
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I think it's a simple issue with reading app.
There's author and book title on every page in iBooks,
Why ePub file itself?
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Old 05-30-2012, 12:24 AM   #41
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I think it's a simple issue with reading app.
There's author and book title on every page in iBooks,
Why ePub file itself?
Certainly the reading app can add whatever it wants to the screen. Apple iBooks can display all kinds of things and you can click and it will go away. But this is not under the authors control which may be ok. But then everybody doesn't own an iPad.
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Old 05-30-2012, 02:40 AM   #42
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A 100 years? Better print them on paper. Hopefully ePub 3 will standardize the mess or maybe just adopt iBooks method since it is cloned by B&N and officially supported on the Kobo Vox. I wondered what the B&N format was. And it isn't supported by their own authoring tool.
No, it's not. It's called the "NookKids'" tool, but it's iAuthor. So a) you have to have a later-model Mac to run it; b) you have to be an approved NookKids' production house to upload it (an author can't make one and upload it at PubIt, in other words), and c) it's obviously not transportable across platforms.

My comment about the 100 years was really meant to reference the fact that we're all here proofing old texts at DP, because of the degradation. Sure, the standards in ePUB, etc., change near-weekly; but data is data, and I believe it will still be easier 100 years from now to decipher Jellby's Prince and Pauper than to try to scrape it off of the paper the old copies are on now! I've nearly gone blind trying to infer some of that stuff at DP.

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Old 05-30-2012, 07:41 AM   #43
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Most available PDF tools make lousy electronic documents without metadata or TOC, they are truly intended to be printed IMHO.
So... because there are defective tools with defaults that have to be changed, we invent a new format? In spite of the fact that there are other very good tools? It doesn't look very intelligent to me.

The only advantage I see to fixed-format ePub is that the source code is easily seen and modifiable (something like the difference between compiled and interpreted programming languages). But as soon as you mixed fixed and "flexible" content, you're playing with fire. And this may happen by simply letting the user (or reading app) to change the font face or size, which can break alignment and cause havoc in a fixed layout.

(sorry for continuing the off-topic)
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Old 06-01-2012, 10:35 AM   #44
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I think it's a simple issue with reading app.
There's author and book title on every page in iBooks,
Why ePub file itself?
A very short-sighted approach of yours.
What if the author intents to display other info than the title, as header or footer?
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