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Old 02-27-2012, 11:05 AM   #31
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I don't get how are you going to study on an uncomfortable screen,

and why don't you choose something which is less pricey, has a better readability and smoother performances.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:10 PM   #32
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Lorenzoens: Do you actually own the device? I don't get why you would say it has an uncomfortable screen when you have never even tried it!
I have ordered it, hope it will arrive in a week or two, and review my opinion on it, largely from the perspective of someone who needs a pdf viewer.

One thing I do think it's a pitty is, that it's been advertized as a learning device, and by other sites as a comic device; but it does not support the comic book formats CBR and CBZ.
I hope they will address this in the future too!
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:21 PM   #33
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About the screen:
I've owned an Asus dr900, had to return it because it's Sipix screen was too hard on eyes to study on it (plus, it did 30% of what it was supposed to do). Since I'm an e-reading enthusiast I did take lots of pictures to it.

Basing on these pictures + all the pics and videos I've seen about the JBC so far + the ereaders I still own and have known, I'm quite sure this screen is not suitable for studying hours on it (at least with a standard home/office lighting).

Even if you have the eyes of an eagle, there's a 100% certainty about the big difference in readability between this and the pearl of other 9,7".

Firmware: it can't even annotate, and there's no certainty it will be able to do it. When it comes to commercial stuff, I believe when I see, not before. I know how things went for all the other 9,7" touchscreen devices: none of them has been fully developed, none of them has had all the capabilities promised from the beginning, some of them remained very far from reaching them. I think it's enough to decide that waiting is wise, especially since the high price.

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Old 02-27-2012, 12:32 PM   #34
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You start with the false assuption SiPix and Triton are the same. I should not so sure if I were you
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:33 PM   #35
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I disagree with every one of these statement so much it's not even funny. Have you even used one?



Quote:
Originally Posted by lorenzoens View Post


BASING ON WHAT I'VE READ AND SEEN from other users (I think it's enough for a first idea), here's what I think:
Ok so you haven't even used one yet. Yea, that's credible.

Quote:
[*]Hard on eyes
it seems HARDLY readable at home, unless you like to use a very strong white lamp straight over your head, pointed to the reader's screen. Like the one used for the video review. It'll be good under sunlight, no doubts. But to my eyes, this background results probably darker than the most crappy Sipix, although the black is very intense. How are your eyes supposed to stand hours of reading on this?
Unless you live in the 1800's and are reading by candlelight (or have a problem with your eyesight) it works just fine. eInk has prided itself as being easy on the eyes especially compared to LCD. It is a researched fact that LCD screens cause eye fatigue. As for clarity, this thread says it all http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=167778

Quote:
Lost opportunity
If it sported a pearl without the colored layer on it, with this resolution and a maximum of 350 dollars price, it could run to become the best 9,7" currently in production.
New technology comes with a cost, that's the way it works.

Quote:
Which developement if sales don't go?
This is a project with a high risk to be dead soon. All the hype is about the "color", but when people will understand what are they talking about, sales will decrease and developement will stop, so people who bought it will only have complaints about it.
It's spelled 'development'. They have established a firm credibility with 5-10k sales in Russia before the device was even released in the US. This is an interesting speculation but is not based in research. Also, anyone with a jetBook or JBL knows they make good on their promises for firmware updates.

Quote:
Price too high for the risk (and is this real innovation?)
500 dollars in a device which may be never developed is a too high risk. This does not feature anything new for the educational sector*, I'm an IT teacher for kids and a researcher on digital literacy. Even the Entourage Edge, a way more advanced idea, failed with sales (although after 2 years, despite being discontinued, it's being adopted in a few russian schools). The huge Amazon never developed the DXG, a 9,7" which can't even do a reflow on pdf, and still is sold at 379 dollars. Pocketbook left the 903, Asus treated his dr900 like a prototype, etc. This is a delicate field, no one big e-paper reader had a real success on the market. Why should Jetbook win?
They won one of the most credible awards in innovations in the world and you are questioning whether or not it is an innovation? The 30 or so programs on it are for education, no one else has that. And it is open source so their is a larger range of places a book can be obtained.


Quote:
It's slow!
We know how much can a software be developed, but hey: this is still TOO slow, for a device which goes out in 2012. An owner even described it as slower than the DXG and my jaw dropped: believe me (I have it) the DXG is one of the slowest 9,7" reader out there, on pdf managing.
Compared to what? I read it is faster then DGX in all aspects but one. I will wait an extra second so i don't have to strain my eyes on a computer screen or iPad.

Quote:
I'm very sorry but I'm not able to see any future for this. I didn't see any brilliant, innovative ideas behind it. The readibility is a too big problem, combined with the huge selling price and all the uncertainties about its developement, which is very far from being mature (Yes everyone can swear it won't ever stop, but if sales are weak, developement dies).

* See also one of his competitors for russ schools, plastic logic 100
*Readability. *Development. (Ah spelling, who needs it)This 'competitor' where can we buy one? Where can anyone buy one?

I think in order to look to the future you must first have a firm grasp on the present. They have won awards, made large contracts with entire governments and from what i see a lot of people want one. Actions speak louder than words.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:49 PM   #36
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I think in order to look to the future you must first have a firm grasp on the present. They have won awards, made large contracts with entire governments and from what i see a lot of people want one. Actions speak louder than words.
This is pop philosophy - you can see the present state of this device on the video test by goodereader.com.
Right now, without serious software improvement, we are talking about an experimental reader.
It could become good or even very good - but right now ...
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Old 02-27-2012, 01:01 PM   #37
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I disagree with every one of these statement so much it's not even funny. Have you even used one?
The message is not addressed to me but it has so many mistakes (though PERFECT spelling, I guess that is what matters here)

No
Send me a sample and I will use it.
Or you expect us to spend 500$ to find out that it is not usable??

Quote:

Ok so you haven't even used one yet. Yea, that's credible.
Sure, I am telling you that this device is better than...I do not know what other device. Since you have not used that device you can not talk argue with my statement. The spell checker fixes the grammar but what can one use to fix the logic???


Quote:
Unless you live in the 1800's and are reading by candlelight (or have a problem with your eyesight) it works just fine. eInk has prided itself as being easy on the eyes especially compared to LCD. It is a researched fact that LCD screens cause eye fatigue. As for clarity, this thread says it all http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=167778
I suggest we should all drop our monitors and TV sets. Buy JetBookColor instead. (Like in "put some Windex")

Quote:
New technology comes with a cost, that's the way it works.
Like this is the argument to buy it!
It can cost an arm and a leg but it can be as useless as this one is. It is not any better than B&W ereaders. That is what the JBC fans fail to explain


Quote:
It's spelled 'development'.

Quote:
They have established a firm credibility with 5-10k sales in Russia before the device was even released in the US. This is an interesting speculation but is not based in research. Also, anyone with a jetBook or JBL knows they make good on their promises for firmware updates.
I don't know why they bothered to put any software on it. Should have released the device with no software, Put a sticker on it "Software coming". "Trust us"


Quote:
They won one of the most credible awards in innovations in the world and you are questioning whether or not it is an innovation? The 30 or so programs on it are for education, no one else has that. And it is open source so their is a larger range of places a book can be obtained.
Let it go to the Education market then.

Quote:

Compared to what? I read it is faster then DGX in all aspects but one. I will wait an extra second so i don't have to strain my eyes on a computer screen or iPad.

Quote:
*Readability. *Development. (Ah spelling, who needs it)This 'competitor' where can we buy one? Where can anyone buy one?
Here we go again

Quote:
I think in order to look to the future you must first have a firm grasp on the present. They have won awards, made large contracts with entire governments and from what i see a lot of people want one. Actions speak louder than words.
We would like to see some action. So far these are just promises and advertising. Many concept cars won awards but they never reached the market.
I can't wait to see how good the new firmware is.

Let' me tell you something: a good product does not need much advertising. This one seems to need. I detect some efforts to convince the community that the device is good. I detect the efforts but I do not see the arguments

(please, for the sake of fluidity of the discussion send me the typos and the errors in a PM. I have no problems with learning more English this way. Try to attack the arguments not their shape.... old and good rule!)

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Old 02-27-2012, 01:51 PM   #38
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I think PF4Mobile is just trolling...

PF4Mobile:
You've had SOME valid arguments, but most of your conversation seems to be based on always wanting to be right in every detail, often with details that are off topic!

Though many of your arguments are not thoroughly based on facts, or valid evidence, but based on reviews; which is ok, but you're basically telling the guys who DO own a device like this, that they are wrong in their reviews in some of your points.


So far I've heard nothing but praise for the JBC from those who own it, and the only real issues are that the background isn't as white as hoped for (which does not make it unusable or in most cases might still be very readable).
In fact, those who own it, merely mention it, they don't seem to make it a big of an issue as some who don't have it.
In fact, I've seen a reviewer compare the background to 'news paper-grey'; so if you can read newspapers, you can read JBC (even in low light); but more on that once I receive mine.

The other is that some people complain about the slowness of turning pages. It seems a common denominator for all e-ink devices that page flips go slower than LCD, especially on larger (+9")screens. But in my experience, any page flip shorter than 2 seconds is not slow at all! You can easily click next page, while you're finishing the last 3 to 5 words of a sentence, and before your eyes are focused at the top of the page again, the page would have flipped. Something you learn getting used to over time.
What would be slightly annoying is if one page takes a second to load, while another takes 4 seconds to load! Then you'd think the device hasn't registered your page flip,and click again, only to see the device doing 2 pageflips. This in combination with the next issue: unresponsiveness of the stylus could be a slightly annoying issue!

The unresponsiveness of the stylus is a negative, together with having only 1 stylus, and not being able to use your finger.

Anyone knows if there exist aftermarket styluses out there to replace this one with (in case you lose yours)?

So the stylus, and missing CBR/CBZ support, as well as a missing browser/wifi connection are cons.
Perhaps the first can be improved upon by newer firmware, the second would be great to have in an additional firmware (Comic Book Reader soft),the last is almost guaranteed to have a FW update on it!

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Old 02-27-2012, 02:13 PM   #39
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I will not feed the troll just above this post. I'll just leave these early reviews here:


Quote:
Originally Posted by andyh2000 View Post
Having used it a bit more now my fondness for it is growing. I think the main weaknesses are the darker screen and lower contrast than I'm used to from the latest E-Ink Pearl screens, the slightly slow page flip speed (although that varies with the document), the missing web browser and the under-featured document viewers (especially not being able to page forward or back when you're zoomed in to a PDF). Of those, the last two are definitely fixable by a firmware update, the speed might be tweakable a bit, and we're stuck with the screen. For a first generation of a brand new (to commercial devices) technology I think it's not bad at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate the great View Post
I've only had it for a couple hours t this point but I'm not happy. The screen is so gray that I plan to call it Dorian.

LuBiB has a pretty good summary elsewhere of the menus, features, and so on, so I won't repeat his work.

But I will note that the software is not anywhere near being done. It doesn't have the annotation options I would have expected with a textbook platform. I also cannot find the web browser or a way to enable Wifi. (I don't think they work yet.)

And I can definitely say that as a textbook platform the iPad offers more options for the same price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mexmike View Post
I have a Jetbook Color and also a Daily Edition PRS-950 so far, I am disappointed with the Jetbook compared to the Sony. I bought the Jetbook so that I could use it for PDF electronic schematics. Not good for that I've discovered.
1)I know the Jetbook is twice the screen size but the Sony is so much faster; about twice as fast to turn pages.
2) The screen is grey almost a cement green like colour. The Sony screen is much lighter, so reading the Jetbbook is more like black text on grey/green compared to black on almost white. This makes reading in poor light a strain
.

Some pics:
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...6&postcount=35
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/att...8&d=1328464299
http://www.mobileread.com/forums/att...1&d=1328464299
http://i44.tinypic.com/2j1jy8m.jpg

Since reading is at present the only thing you can do with this device, It'd be enough to see some pics under standard lighting of a JetBookColor just near a Kindle DXG or a Boox M92 or any other 9,7" with Pearl display.

Last edited by lorenzoens; 02-27-2012 at 02:37 PM.
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Old 02-27-2012, 02:48 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by ProDigit View Post
The unresponsiveness of the stylus is a negative, together with having only 1 stylus, and not being able to use your finger.
The EMT technology for the touchscreen is one the things I always dreamed: when (and if?) Ecato will enable the note-taking feature many people will see how confortable is writing something without your finger/hand interference (as it happens using regular pen & paper!)

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Old 02-27-2012, 02:58 PM   #41
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I think PF4Mobile is just trolling...

PF4Mobile:
You've had SOME valid arguments, but most of your conversation seems to be based on always wanting to be right in every detail, often with details that are off topic!

Though many of your arguments are not thoroughly based on facts, or valid evidence, but based on reviews; which is ok, but you're basically telling the guys who DO own a device like this, that they are wrong in their reviews in some of your points.
If that is the case then I have nothing to say
I think think that I am going to stop posting at all
I do realize that I have spent to much time on these forums. Way too long if I look closer to my time budget.
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Old 02-27-2012, 03:40 PM   #42
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If it is of some value, I quote PF4Mobile's post and I don't think he was trolling. This is a forum where people can exchange experience and.... even feelings.

I want thank everyone (even PF4Mobile and lorenzoens) has partecipated to jetbook color threads because they have make me think on problems I didn't thought before.
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:02 PM   #43
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Well I guess I will weigh in here.

I have been using a Jetbook color for a few days and while this should not be considered a review let’s call it my first impressions.

I was expecting SLOOOOOOOOW. It’s not really. I mean it’s not as fast as other 9.7" devices but neither is it the slowest Eink reader I have seen. It’s very much dependent on the document of course.

The color is as I expected and what I remembered from seeing it in Hanvon's booth at CES although I do not remember the background being this gray. I have a feeling that might be a software issue and I’m going to try something later to see. I’m going to create some text which are on a white colored background to see if the device will actually show the whiter background or if that is as white as it can be.

The amount of educational stuff on it is astounding. Really you couldn’t put this much information and learning tools on any other device this size at this price. I’m not sure yet if it’s all great stuff though. The language learning seems to be very good but I looked at the geography stuff on board for a moment this morning and it was just a big wall of text. All of that color ability wasted.

The dictionaries work well and the audible dictionary is included so you can hear the pronunciations as well as see the definitions.

The problem overall with the device is that it’s very much incomplete. The ePub reader is straight adobe and so the ability to manipulate the ePub is minimal compared to Onyx and Pocketbook for example. There are no margin settings, no rotation, no line spacing, no font changing etc.

The page numbers appear in the margin , at times obscuring part of the last word as most digital readers will have seen in the past, but there is no way to turn that off.

Changing the font size is even somewhat difficult. You have to choose a zoom percentage AND choose "fit page" or the text won’t fill the whole display. That is very cumbersome.

PDF reading is straightforward with nearly no customization available. There is no mark up capability at all, besides marking a passage for summary. I know the scribbling and highlighting is supposed to be coming in the update but this was working at CES LAST YEAR (2011). Why doesn’t it work now when they are shipping?

There is no way to choose your refresh rate. This is bothersome, much more than I have experienced elsewhere. Mainly due to the choices they have made as to when a full is done and when a partial is done. For instance, go to the science bits and choose the Periodic Table of Elements. It pops open without a full refresh. This leaves colored ghosts from the menu obscuring parts of the table.

There is no way to choose to rotate to a different screen orientation that I can find. For PDFs, I have found this to be essential sometimes in order to make looking at tables easier.

The Hanvon device has Hanvon's own finger and pen touch tech. The Jetbook has only Pen. This leaves you with awkward navigation at times when you think you can choose something with your finger but you can’t so you then have to select the right button.

There is no column reading as with the PocketBook devices and as mentioned by others there is no Persistent zoom reading for PDF. You can’t change page when it’s zoomed in. In fact, once zoomed you can’t even open the menu for dictionary etc. You have to exit the zoomed mode back to "fit page" in order to open the menu.

Panning is with the buttons only and not with the stylus; with Onyx for example you can "drag" the page around with the pen.

There is no "selection zoom" like with Irex, Onyx and a few others so you can just select a particular diagram or picture to zoom in on to full screen.

As far as I can tell, there is no text to speech for reading the text aloud to you. I find this peculiar because of the other wonderful speech recognition and text to speech available in the language learning sections.

There are other odd choices like the options in the right edge menu. Why isn’t font size available there? Why can I only open the main "menu" with the button, why can’t I bring it up with the stylus? Why can’t I change page with a swipe or tap of the stylus?

In short, the educational side of thing seems to be fairly fleshed out. Especially the language training which you would expect from Ectaco, although I can’t say anything about the adequacy of the educational references included for each subject not being an educator. However, they do appear to be extensive.

The reader side however is woefully inadequate. It has none of the capabilities for customization you would expect in an ePub reader this year and its PDF capabilities amount to being able to read a pdf full screen. It doesn’t recognize the comic formats at all.

There is currently no point to having the emr pen. It’s an expensive component currently only used to touch points on the display that could have done with other less expensive tech

The speed and color issues are minor comparative to the other issues.
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:45 PM   #44
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Thanks for shredding more light on the software side of the Jetbook.
Mobile read has dug somewhat into the hardware of the device, but not so much into the software.

I have seen video's where TTS works on selected text though...

The educational side of the JBC basically are programs transported from their other devices, Ectaco has plenty other hardware specific learning devices. I guess they hired some programmers to do some quick software changes to port it to the Jetbook Color.

The pen could indeed be changed to a capacitive touchscreen, which would cost about as much (you don't want a resistive touchscreen on a reader that already has a darker background); or a 4 way pad with an enter, which could bring the price down a bit.

I'm less fond of having a layer on top of my reading surface. They could also equip the device with a fingerprint mouse,like found on some mobile devices; it would help clicking on hyperlinks, but one would lose the ability to make hand annotations.

They could also equip the reader with two analog bars on each side, where you can slide your finger to scroll through the paper, and tap to flip pages (kind of like what JVC did with their everio (if I'm correct) camera's.

Last edited by ProDigit; 02-27-2012 at 05:51 PM.
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Old 02-27-2012, 06:02 PM   #45
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well thats actually one thing im disappointed about. Hanvon's Dual-Touch puts the whole capacitive and pen touch layer below the display. they could have easily left it in, dropped at least 2 buttons and all would have been good. but for Ectaco to drop the finger touch, neuter the pen and leave a mish mosh of UI controls is a bit of a strange decision.

edit- of course it's possible that it could still be there and just not enabled as with the notation abilities.

edit the second- have you seen videos of TTS on the Jetbook or on Hanvon's original device?

Last edited by Dulin's Books; 02-27-2012 at 06:05 PM.
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