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Old 11-23-2007, 04:13 PM   #16
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Perhaps it is like the story about a Camel. It has been said that a Camel looks like it was designed by a committee.

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I think the joke is: "A camel is a horse designed by committee."
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Old 11-23-2007, 04:28 PM   #17
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I think the joke is: "A camel is a horse designed by committee."
Thanks, I knew it was something like that.

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Old 11-23-2007, 04:31 PM   #18
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"An elephant is a mouse built to government specification."
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Old 11-23-2007, 04:45 PM   #19
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"An elephant is a mouse built to government specification."
So, Is the Kindle designed by a committee or the government?

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Old 11-23-2007, 05:00 PM   #20
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So, Is the Kindle designed by a committee or the government?
Yes.

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Old 11-23-2007, 05:55 PM   #21
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Actually yes, I believe it's ugly (as far as ebook readers go) and I really dont like the idea of a keyboard .. if i want to go typing I have my laptop! ..

IMHO the reason that many people 'the public' are raving about it is because it's the first time most have seen an ebook reader 'in the flesh' and it's exciting! .. it's a very new technology (unless you're here at mobileread!) so everyone wants to try it ..

I do find myself feeling sorry for Bookeen and iRex in all this tho as the Kindle will sell (at least in part because it's 'amazon' and a known quantity) and yet there are probably gazillions (that's a number right?!) of people in the states who would be better suited to the iRex or Cybook but who havent even heard of them ..

Would be very interested to know if there has been any advertising stateside of any kind by Bookeen and iRex technologies? .. sorry, I know that's off topic but really curious here ..

All said tho *grin* if the Kindle arrived in the UK the thing that tempts me is the totally wireless/computer-less download capability .. sounds very cool ..

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Old 11-23-2007, 06:14 PM   #22
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Loopy,

I've never seen any advertising for the irex or the bookeen. I haven't seen any for the sony reader either, but I know there is some out there.

The best thing for this industry is several companies all making competing ereaders. I hope Sony and the others stay in this game.
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:10 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate the great View Post
I think the joke is: "A camel is a horse designed by committee."
In that case, if ever you see an ebook device called The Platypus run, don't walk,...away!

Cheers,
Marc
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:24 PM   #24
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I find it amazing that some people try to rationalize the Kindle's 'ugly' design by saying it is like a worn book or somesuch. Pshaw. (Can't believe I typed that!) Both the Sony Reader and Bookeen are ebook devices that have a sleek, simple, attractive design. Amazon has no excuse for designing a klunky, cheap-looking (white plastic!) device that is not aesthetically appealing. (I don't buy the wedge shape either--I never fold pages back behind a book, and my books lie flat when read.) As nice as many of the features may be, and as well as it may work, they could have designed a nicer-looking product. There's no reason to justify a poor design.
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:39 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrMoze View Post
Amazon has no excuse for designing a klunky, cheap-looking (white plastic!) device that is not aesthetically appealing.
I thought aesthetics were mostly a matter of opinion. What absolutes are you appealing to here?

I personally like the Kindle design. A keyboard so I can search for terms in a book is an awesome feature, and I think the Kindle's implementation looks better than the Librie's.
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:50 PM   #26
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I thought aesthetics were mostly a matter of opinion. What absolutes are you appealing to here?

I personally like the Kindle design. A keyboard so I can search for terms in a book is an awesome feature, and I think the Kindle's implementation looks better than the Librie's.
I have one; he's right. It's ugly.

Amazon made several interesting design decisions in the shape of the Kindle (the way it is thicker on the left, the beveled lower corners, the tapered right edge). Each was a practical feature, but when assembled together on such a small device make the Kindle look ugly.
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:59 PM   #27
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I find it amazing that some people try to rationalize the Kindle's 'ugly' design by saying it is like a worn book or somesuch. Pshaw. (Can't believe I typed that!)
It's not about "rationalisation", or at least, not in the "amazed" pejorative sense you appear to intend. For some of us it is about figuring out why they would design it "ugly". Amazon are not stupid - any assumptions of stupidity are too easily applied to be helpful. It is somewhat about figuring out why they would take it down that route (and, for some, why that would appeal).

You can say "Pshaw" until the cows come home, but it doesn't change that Amazon have brought it out with that design, that some folks don't find it "ugly" (or at least they might find it "ugly" in that idiosyncratic away that has us call the wrinkled up little turd-on-legs known as E.T., "cute"), and that the thing seems to be selling quite well despite its rampant "ugliness".

Quote:
Both the Sony Reader and Bookeen are ebook devices that have a sleek, simple, attractive design.
They are...nice. In the same way that the iPod is...nice. Yep, they're sleek, yes they're simple, yes they're "attractive" in a conventional kind of way. It's a whole lot of "pretty" going on following a current trend. Like folks who buy family sedans regardless of what they look like, and in colours that are selling cheap, or folks who buy Saab's and Volvo's in bright, screaming yellow because of the "Viva la UGLY" factor (apologies for the pseudo-French), some people just don't want to buy into the latest design "trend" or just don't care.

Quote:
Amazon has no excuse for designing a klunky, cheap-looking (white plastic!) device that is not aesthetically appealing. (I don't buy the wedge shape either--I never fold pages back behind a book, and my books lie flat when read.) As nice as many of the features may be, and as well as it may work, they could have designed a nicer-looking product. There's no reason to justify a poor design.
Correct, there isn't. However, since you have defined "poor" as being "not aesthetically appealling", and since aesthetics are almost entirely subjective, and since the aesthetics of this device have not dissuaded them being sold in large numbers, your statement is only correct for a limited value of the word, "correct". You've provided good reasons why you, literally and figuratively "don't buy it", but they don't invalidate those of others.

You would appear to be trying to convince folk that it is ugly, and that if they differ in their opinion to you, they don't just have different opinions, but that they are wrong, and Amazon is wrong. That's an interesting ideological tact to take - good luck with that. You might want to consider that "worn book" observations and analogies have just as much value, and just as little, as your "clunky" observations.

I like the Sony Reader, and the Cybook, and the Iliad - their aesthetics follow current convention as to what constitutes an attractively-designed technological gizmo. I like the Kindle because it would appear to be differentiating itself from being just another attractively-designed technological gizmo; with devices merging towards the same thing and design (phones, UMPCs, MP3 players, PDAs, GPS units, tablet PCs), I don't mind a device coming out with the "I'm not one of them" idiosyncrasy. I'd rather see a "clunky"-looking device than something that looks like another iPod, for instance.

In the end though, it's another device that works well to read books on, and has practical features that appeal (even if it will never make its way to Oz). Not perfect, but none of them are. Appearances, to many, are secondary.

Cheers,
Marc
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Old 11-23-2007, 09:38 PM   #28
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(edited a whole lot of irrelevant crud posted due to insecurity). Essentially, it was "DrMoze is cool, and I might be ranting".

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Old 11-23-2007, 10:26 PM   #29
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Actually yes, I believe it's ugly (as far as ebook readers go) and I really dont like the idea of a keyboard .. if i want to go typing I have my laptop! ..

IMHO the reason that many people 'the public' are raving about it is because it's the first time most have seen an ebook reader 'in the flesh' and it's exciting! .. it's a very new technology (unless you're here at mobileread!) so everyone wants to try it ..

I do find myself feeling sorry for Bookeen and iRex in all this tho as the Kindle will sell (at least in part because it's 'amazon' and a known quantity) and yet there are probably gazillions (that's a number right?!) of people in the states who would be better suited to the iRex or Cybook but who havent even heard of them ..

Would be very interested to know if there has been any advertising stateside of any kind by Bookeen and iRex technologies? .. sorry, I know that's off topic but really curious here ..

All said tho *grin* if the Kindle arrived in the UK the thing that tempts me is the totally wireless/computer-less download capability .. sounds very cool ..

Loopy
A lot of people in the USA have no idea bout iRex of Bookeen. They may know of Sony, but given how easy it is to use the Kindle to get books, I think they'll go for the Kindle.
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Old 11-23-2007, 10:27 PM   #30
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I don't find the Kindle ugly. What I do find is that a number of people have said it's ergonomics need fixing as the page turn buttons are very easy to hit.
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