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Old 08-12-2011, 03:39 PM   #61
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I am a lawyer and I use an ipad, but not a laptop, all the time. There are law firms, major ones in fact, that distribute ipads rather than laptops to all their personnel. Many people, like me, use ipads as laptop substitutes, and claims that ipads cannot be used professionally, but are simply media devices, are simply wrong.
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Old 08-12-2011, 04:15 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by radleyp View Post
I am a lawyer and I use an ipad, but not a laptop, all the time. There are law firms, major ones in fact, that distribute ipads rather than laptops to all their personnel. Many people, like me, use ipads as laptop substitutes, and claims that ipads cannot be used professionally, but are simply media devices, are simply wrong.
Do you write briefs on it?

Tablets are useful for limited annotations, chat & email communications, and basic record-keeping. They're not useful for business management or document creation/production.

Are there law firms that distribute iPads instead of laptops to the secretaries/exec assistants?
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Old 08-12-2011, 07:43 PM   #63
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I am a lawyer and I use an ipad, but not a laptop, all the time. There are law firms, major ones in fact, that distribute ipads rather than laptops to all their personnel. Many people, like me, use ipads as laptop substitutes, and claims that ipads cannot be used professionally, but are simply media devices, are simply wrong.
Yep, and people who work for firms like Salesforce and other Fortune 100 and 500 companies have been using iPads in lieu of laptops for their traveling workers.

Again, there are many different ways people use laptops. Flatly claiming that an iPad, or Playbook, or Netbook, or even a smartphone can't replace a laptop, without knowing HOW people use them, is just silly.

Just curious, CommonReader, fjtorres, and Elfwreck-have you all made serious attempts to replace your laptops with an iPad?

I've owned an iPad and iPad 2 since both were launched, and no longer travel with a laptop. I access my desktop at work with an iPad 2, but before the iPad, I did the same with a laptop.

But I will be the first to admit that I probably underutilized the features of my business laptop over the years

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Old 08-12-2011, 08:03 PM   #64
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Just curious, CommonReader, fjtorres, and Elfwreck-have you all made serious attempts to replace your laptops with an iPad?
Is there a FineReader app for the iPad? If not, I'm not interested.

In addition to FineReader for OCR, I regularly use Acrobat Pro, Word & Excel 2003 (could switch for Open Office or similar, and possibly something as simple as AbiWord, if that's available), Photoshop, and PixEdit. I often have four or more of those open at the same time. I have no use for a computer that can't support all of those or close equivalents.

I don't doubt the iPad has some good business uses. A lot of good business uses--in the same way that an email program alone has a lot of good business uses.

Tablets don't, at this time, support advanced document creation & management, and don't support business accounts management (Peoplesoft & similar programs); they allow media consumption & easy communication, not production work.

Are there authors writing novels on their iPads? Lawyers drafting trial briefs on them? Accountants tracking sales records & issuing invoices? Video technicians editing animation, clipping in stills, and managing sound to create a marketable track? Can you use an iPad to convert from mobi to epub-with-dropcaps?

From what I've heard, I'm not even sure you can copy text out of a PDF and paste it into an email.
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Old 08-12-2011, 08:17 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post

From what I've heard, I'm not even sure you can copy text out of a PDF and paste it into an email.
See, if you had an iPad, you would be sure

Quote:
But if America is to change its eating habits—and Pollan is ex-cellent at documenting the urgent need for such change—it is farmers, not writers, who will have to lead the way.
Just pasted that in from the PDF book I'm reading in GoodReader
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Old 08-12-2011, 08:19 PM   #66
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Well just for starters, there's a little known artist called David Hockney creating original artwork on an iPad...

I no longer carry my Fujitsu-Siemens notebook as I find an Android tablet easier and lighter... it gets used for notes, article writing, email, editing and other uses as well as being handy for comics and other relaxation... and I use it more than I did my notebook...

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Old 08-12-2011, 08:28 PM   #67
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See, if you had an iPad, you would be sure
Had I $500 lying around for a video-game-and-email device, I'd have one. But iPad doesn't support the majority of what I use a computer for--document scanning, OCR, conversion & editing. It's too bulky to be comfortable ebook reader for me, and the battery doesn't last long enough.

I know that the iPad has plenty of business-usable apps, and those are enough for a lot of people. Doesn't work for me (Acrobat Pro, FineReader, & a word processor are my baseline minimum), and doesn't work for other people who rely on a standard computer's flexibility.
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Old 08-12-2011, 09:57 PM   #68
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Every new computing device goes through three stages of acceptance by the experts:

*" This is just an expensive toy"
*"This has some uses, but Serious People will use (device I like) for real work. "
*"This device is essential to have. I have always said so."

Let's review:

" The personal computer is just an expensive toy. Serious people , who do serious work, will use a mainframe".
"The Mac is just an expensive toy. Serious people , who do serious work, will use a PC with a command line interface".
"The smartphone is just an expensive toy. Serious people, who do serious work, will use a Windows PC and a cell phone"
"The Iphone is just an expensive toy. Serious people, who do serious work, will use a Blackberry"
The experts keep making the same mistake. Just because THEY can't imagine business cases for the Ipad doesn't mean others can't. In the meantime, lawyers, doctors, salesmen, musicians, artists, and many other creators and businesspeople carry on using their Ipads.

Last edited by stonetools; 08-12-2011 at 10:01 PM.
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Old 08-13-2011, 05:09 AM   #69
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Only if Apple moves to Redmond :P

I've said this for years: Apple gets special treatment. Microsoft OTOH get "un-special" treatment :P

Apple is CLEARLY ANTI COMPETITIVE NOW, and has been for sometime. Yet we never heard any complaints. None that reaches the DOJ anyway :P



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I wonder if anyone can bring a lawsuit against Apple for this?

For years, Microsoft had to deal with a multi-million dollar case against them in the EU, because it was claimed that their bundling of Media Player and Internet Explorer with Windows was 'anti-competitive' as they were taking advantage of the fact that their OS was the dominant market player.

Could someone bring a similar case against Apple and the iOS?
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:29 AM   #70
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People are still going on about Apple's anti-competitiveness, probably because they didn't click through and actually read the linked article, so let me put out another excerpt:

Quote:
There was no ebook business to speak of until Amazon delivered the Kindle device, put massive muscle behind selling it, and used the ability they had then to sacrifice margin to create a powerful commercial proposition that was the catalyst to create the market. There was no serious competition for Amazon until Barnes & Noble’s new management delivered the Nook with an equally powerful commitment to establishing it, using their presence in stores to introduce ebook reading to new audiences and, with further innovation of the devices, contributing to the explosive growth of reading in digital formats.

There was no restraint on Amazon’s ability to use their deep pockets to discount publishers’ content in pursuit of their own market share growth until Apple’s new device, the iPad, created a whole new sales model that forced price stability in the marketplace and, at the same time, handed publishers a new capability to maximize revenue and to use price as a marketing tool.

There was no effective way to introduce book readers to the convenience of digital reading without the investment in a dedicated device until the iPad put the capability into millions of hands that didn’t know they wanted it.

There was no great motivation for ebook retailers to introduce interoperability across devices until many ebook device owners also became iPhone and iPad owners.
Mike's analysis is spot on, and it blows apart Mobile Read mythology about how Amazon's ebook pricing policy 2007-2010 was "right", what was the point of agency pricing and who benefits, and whether Apple's policy is any more "anti-competitive" than the other booksellers . On the contrary, Apple's establishment of the Ios platform, creation of the Ibookstore, and support for agency pricing has made the ebook marketplace deeper and MORE competitive.
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Old 08-13-2011, 03:52 PM   #71
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Apple is CLEARLY ANTI COMPETITIVE NOW, and has been for sometime. Yet we never heard any complaints. None that reaches the DOJ anyway :P
Actually, "we" have heard complaints, and they did reach the DOJ:
Here are just a few:
2011:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...669475800.html
Quote:
The Justice Department and the FTC are both interested in examining whether Apple is running afoul of U.S. antitrust laws by funneling media companies' customers into the payment system for its iTunes store—and taking a 30% cut, the people familiar with the situation said. The agencies both enforce federal antitrust laws and would have to decide which one of them would take the lead in the matter
2010:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/26/te...y/26apple.html
Quote:
The Justice Department is examining Apple’s tactics in the market for digital music, and its staff members have talked to major music labels and Internet music companies, according to several people briefed on the conversations.
2009:
http://www.businessinsider.com/henry...-iphone-2009-7
Quote:
In recent weeks lawmakers and regulators have raised questions about deals such as AT&T's exclusive right to provide service for Apple Inc.'s popular iPhone in the U.S.
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Old 08-13-2011, 05:14 PM   #72
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The OS licenses predate the Apple license; those apps should never have been approved. I don't consider the OS supporters to be bad guys for saying, "no, you can't keep distributing our work in violation of the license by which it's made available." It's not difficult to comply with an OS license; Apple refused.
I was just addressing your original post "I just know that Apple has booted out a number of open source apps (some open source licenses clash with Apple's TOU), and Apple puts strict constraints on its apps.", which I read as suggesting that Apple had decided to remove (boot) the apps because of their open source nature, which is not the case, they were requested to remove them by their copyright owners.

Not sure how it is ok for X device to be distributed with Linux installed, and I be unable to install it on any other devices, but not ok for an app to be downloadable to only 5 iOS devices, but then I think the developers were just making a point really, weren't they?
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Old 08-13-2011, 06:29 PM   #73
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I was just addressing your original post "I just know that Apple has booted out a number of open source apps (some open source licenses clash with Apple's TOU), and Apple puts strict constraints on its apps.", which I read as suggesting that Apple had decided to remove (boot) the apps because of their open source nature, which is not the case, they were requested to remove them by their copyright owners.
Technically, the copyright owners could've sued Apple instead of requesting removal--Apple was selling & distributing works for which it did not have copyright. OS advocates being willing to settle for "remove it" instead of "get sued for up to $150,000 for every copy you've illegally sold or given away" is the polite reaction on the part of the copyright holders.

Apple was in violation of copyright by offering to sell those apps in the first place.
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Old 08-13-2011, 10:27 PM   #74
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Apple was in violation of copyright by offering to sell those apps in the first place.
Was Apple in violation or were the developers?

Re: use of tablets - I think that the whole content creation/content consumption meme should be dropped; it's really not that helpful.

I do several different things at work, many of which can be better done with an iPad than with a laptop. And some of which cannot be done with an iPad.

One part of what I do is write complex documents that may eventually be made available to the public. This I can't do on an iPad - my part is written in WordPerfect (because we have a lot of complex legacy macros) and requires access to some internal databases. When I complete my initial draft it is logged and version checked and transmitted to a proofreader and then an editor. It then comes back to me and is then usually sent (in PDF) to our in-house printers. All of these steps are documented and time stamped internally. So I do this on my desktop. I could do it on a laptop instead...but only at my desk, as I would need to be connected to the ethernet cable that is at my desk.

Another important part of what I do is discuss these documents in meetings. For this, the iPad is perfect, as I can pass it around to show a copy of any particular document from the past 10 years or so, and I can also pull up relevant rulings and cases if necessary. Of course everyone at the meeting has paper copies of the documents on the agenda, so I don't need the iPad for them (and paper is better in this context anyway)..but it's not uncommon for someone to ask about a similar document from, say, 3 years ago, and it's nice to be able to pull it up, look it over, and talk about any relevant differences.

A laptop would work for this, but it would be much less convenient - typically I'll only need to look something up every second meeting or so, so I can just keep the ipad flat on the table and closed - but if I need to look something up, it's nice that it is instant-on, and that I can pass it around.

Another important thing I do is answer e-mails; sometimes by writing a short response, sometimes by writing a 3 page response, and sometimes by making a phone call. While I'll usually write the longer responses at my desk, the short ones are easy enough to do on my iPad (or phone, for that matter).

In addition to the instant on, it also helps that it is so light and small - I tend to just stick carry it in an expandable file rather than carry a laptop, case, and power supply along.

I think that there are a *lot* of jobs similar to this, where the iPad would be as good as or superior to a laptop, since many people do not do work requiring a laptop's full power.
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Old 08-14-2011, 10:16 AM   #75
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Again, there are many different ways people use laptops. Flatly claiming that an iPad, or Playbook, or Netbook, or even a smartphone can't replace a laptop, without knowing HOW people use them, is just silly.
Just curious, CommonReader, fjtorres, and Elfwreck-have you all made serious attempts to replace your laptops with an iPad?
I have said that an iPad isn't nearly as capable and powerful as a laptop. Nothing I have read here makes me retract that statement. Obviously, if you only require a fraction of the capabilities of a laptop the iPad may work very well for you. However, this does not enhance the abilities of the iPad.

Some colleagues use iPads for reading papers and documents and for receiving mails. However, the very moment productive work has to be done they are reaching for their laptops. I require a full Java runtime library for some of the business applications I have to use and the iPad doesn't offer that.

For private use it would be nice to take something like the iPad along on vacations for web surfing and for reviewing and backing up films and photos. Without expandable storage space it isn't fit for that purpose, though. During the recent short vacation my Sony DSLR produced over 60 GB of data. No problem to back that up with a cheap € 250 netbook but too much data even for the top of the line iPad.
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