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Old 06-09-2010, 05:10 AM   #1
Nick_Djinn
Edge User
 
Dual boot Linux?

Is it possible to dual boot linux, at least on the tablet side if not on the e-reader side? By Linux I mean regular Linux with an X desktop, not Android Linux....Regular Linux

I tell you, if you want to score big points with a niche market, offer support for some of the regular open source distros of Linux. They only have 1.5% of the market of NEW devices, but I think that there is an undocumented 15% who dual boot both Windows and Linux....but its difficult to know for sure. There is no easy way to moniter it, but every techie I know at least has a copy of Knoppix for diagnosing windows problems without booting into Windows, if not a copy of Ubuntu or Open Suse.

I think that an option for dual booting would score you big points and its a pretty loyal niche market that likes to promote and offer free advertisement for companies that offer hardware and software support for their platforms.


Another idea would be to team up with System 76

http://www.system76.com/

They sell computers with Ubuntu Linux preinstalled. I think that if you supplied the hardware and cooperated with them on developing the tools to run the device on Linux with a native X desktop you would see an incredible amount of free development from the hacker community....Ubuntu and its offshoots (Mint, MoonOS, GOS, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Edubuntu, Ubuntu Studio, ect). Also, there is already a much richer database of free software for Ubuntu than there is for Android....features that are geared for computers and netbooks and tablets and not just phones. The amount of free software available for Linux boggles the mind. I think it would pair nicely with this device.

I would suggest maybe using a more user friendly Ubuntu based distro like Mint or GOS....there are quirks with Ubuntu that make it appealing to hackers, but the lack of codecs can be an issue for people watching to watch certain video and audio formats.....its easy to install, but people want it out of the box...so either you have to install Medibuntu and use Ubuntu, maybe with a special add-on CD just for the edge, or you can start with Linux Mint or GOS and everything will work out of the box with no additional tinkering.....you wont have to pay off microsoft and the functionality might resemble a notebook a little more so.

I would suggest something that uses the Enlightenment desktop environment....any distro can, but Mint and Ubuntu use Gnome by default. Enlightenment is better for touchscreen IMO. It has more of a Mac OSX feel and the animated icons work great for intuitive touch based interface. It would not be difficult to hire somebody to make a special distro of Linux or Mint or GOS (which already uses Enlightenment) to make a unique distro just for your product, downstream from Ubuntu with free access to the Ubuntu repositories of free software.



Anyway, I feel like a salesman. Im not getting paid for this I am just brainstorming. I would really like to see Linux enter the mainstream and offer some competition for Microsoft. Android is doing it but they chose not to make it compatible with all the linux software that already exists which is unfortunate. There is also less free software for it.




Anyway...any chance of booting Ubuntu/Mint from a flash drive?
 
Old 06-09-2010, 07:42 AM   #2
robot
Edge User
 
It's possible to do double boot by yourself. But it's very risky, 'cos U need to change EE's boot loader to custom one and there probably may be incompability with update mechanism used by EE.
On the other hand, I don't think that EE tech will make double booting (or even allow to use custom firmware\os) due to marketing plan. It's the same reason why many hardware manufactors officially support only one OS (making you to buy new hardware in order to keep modern OS), or restrict the use of VoIP (making you to use expensive mobile calls instead of cheap skype), or limit the compability (in order to buy e-book only from their own store). e.t.c. It's stupid marketing, but it's reallity. The only way to get what you want -- to do it by yourself, or with the help of people who also has an interest in it.

Previously I asked if there's some people who interested in custom developing for EE, but didn't get much response. Also as far as I see there's no many people with needed level of expirience to make custom firmware for EE. And I, by myself, also don't so good to make custom firmware alone, and not so reach to pay several thousand dollars to hire people who can help write what I'd like to get for EE.
 
 
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Old 07-08-2010, 02:40 AM   #3
Melkor
Edge User
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by borisb View Post
Just a note that the two sides are running just one OS. There's only one CPU. The eInk side in some ways is acting as a second monitor, not a second device.
And actually that's what I want it to be - even though this statement comes from a computer lamer...

We all keep on asking questions about other OS not because we don't like Android so much or because we love Linux (or Windows) more than anything else in the world, but because... For me it's the Office Suite. Any decent suite.

I need to be able to:
1. Open & Edit MS Word as well as OpenOffice documents.
2. Open & Edit MS PowerPoint as well as OpenOffice presentations.
3. Open & Edit MS Excel as well as OpenOffice spreadsheets.

And that's it. Being able to edit/anote ebooks & pdfs on E-Ink is a marvellous breakthrough, but... I still need to carry my notebook around to do the rest of my academic work...

I know there is Documents to Go app, but don't even mention it as a counterpart to any usable office suite.

As I said, I'm not an IT specialist and I have no idea how to solve the problem. I'm an end user and I know what I need. I need to edit documents. All sorts of those. And they have to stay in the original format either for MS Office (which I hate but my employer pays for the license) or OpenOffice which I support personnaly.
 
Old 07-08-2010, 03:20 AM   #4
walt526
Edge User
 
As the market for Android tablets expands (and it's going to start growing really quickly later this year), then I imagine that a more robust and capable office suite will be developed. I agree that Doc2Go is too limited in its present form to offer a complete substitute to Office.

Of course it's anyone's guess as to when that will be released, how many features it will have, and whether it will be possible to purchase it without access to the Android Market (hopefully that will be forthcoming later this year as well).

But even with better software, I'm not sure that a 10.1" LCD offers enough real estate to do extensive work, particularly with data. I often find my laptop's 15.6" screen to be too small when working with a large spreadsheet.
 
Old 07-08-2010, 04:59 AM   #5
robot
Edge User
 
Melkor, you can probably try online editors like google docs zoho.com e.t.c., or use RPC client to connect to an computer with needed software installed.

walt526, I don't think that any progress will be done fast. Android market is really small (compare to windows and even to iPhone OS), but developing cost much more.., so at first android market must to grow and find a way to protect apps from piracy.
 
Old 07-08-2010, 05:12 AM   #6
Melkor
Edge User
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by walt526 View Post
But even with better software, I'm not sure that a 10.1" LCD offers enough real estate to do extensive work, particularly with data. I often find my laptop's 15.6" screen to be too small when working with a large spreadsheet.
Well, yes and no... I use my notebook at work and edit everything more extensively using my desktop. I want the same here. Do everything I need to do on the way using eDGe, and do everything I want to at home on a larger screen. So far eDGe is the bottleneck here, not the 10" screen.
 
Old 07-08-2010, 05:20 AM   #7
Melkor
Edge User
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot View Post
Melkor, you can probably try online editors like google docs zoho.com e.t.c., or use RPC client to connect to an computer with needed software installed.
I can't try online editors. Not on the go, and that's a hefty part of my academic job.
3G is way too expensive unless your company is paying for that, and WiFi coverage is still not reliable enough.
As far as RPC is concerned I don't even know what that is... but again if this means being connected to another computer (via 3G, WiFi, Bluetooth, etc.) it's not going to work.

So what I need is (even a simplified version of) an office suite that can handle docs, presentations, and spreadsheats without altering the original formatting of MS Office or OpenOffice.

I mean, eDGe can already handle pdfs with annotations! That's fantastic!! But there is a bit more to editing texts than pdfs...
 
Old 07-08-2010, 05:32 AM   #8
walt526
Edge User
 
FWIW, personally I find Google Docs to be even more frustrating to use than Docs2Go.


Quote:
Originally Posted by robot View Post
walt526, I don't think that any progress will be done fast. Android market is really small (compare to windows and even to iPhone OS), but developing cost much more.., so at first android market must to grow and find a way to protect apps from piracy.
I'll have to respectfully disagree based on discussions that I've had with a variety of acquaintances that work in the industry. There's a benefit to establishing a market presence early--particularly on a platform where MSFT won't be entering--that will encourage a mid- or large-sized developer to put together something more substantial, particularly since the design is known (i.e., it needs to look and function as similar to the Office apps as possible).

There isn't much money to be made in developing PC or even Mac productivity software that simply replicates functionality of existing--and well-entrenched--software, so all of the attention is on mobile. Since WP7's biggest selling point is it being relatively easy for developers to port existing software to the platform, it will likely be dominated by the same group of firms who dominate PC's. There is still a lot of interest in iOS, but it's maturing quickly and is no longer "virgin soil" as it were. At least among the people that I know, the great potential--as well as the greatest risk--is seen to be with Android. To date, the firms that have invested in the Android hardware (HTC and Motorola) have hit homeruns, now it's some software developers turn to try to take advantage of it. But any venture into Android will be costly and risky.
 
Old 07-08-2010, 11:31 AM   #9
robot
Edge User
 
walt526, yes. there's meaning in your words. But...
I work with company which develop software for different platform. After some research and testing we allmost completely switch to iPhone OS. As for android, we continue to do some FREE programs, but only for "market present". Nothing serious. If you know what RPI is (the way how we calculate where we can earn more cash) iPhone, and some social networks currently the king of the game and even windows can't come close.
 
Old 08-13-2010, 03:05 PM   #10
supermarkitos2004
Edge User
 
I want dual-boot with Ubuntu too! and Openoffice! and connect my edge with a wall-projector and other devices (external Harddisk, scanner, printer, tv card...) ... and i want mouse-pointer... and to open more formats in the e-ink side (MSWord, fictionbook, html, txt, drm, mobipocket, lit...) an a better zoom-tool...
please you make it, i need it. thank you
 
Old 08-13-2010, 04:27 PM   #11
supermarkitos2004
Edge User
 
please, fast, i want it for tomorrow, on my desk. you have enough time tonight
thank you
and now let´s work
 
Old 08-18-2010, 08:33 AM   #12
Melkor
Edge User
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermarkitos2004 View Post
I want dual-boot with Ubuntu too! and Openoffice! and connect my edge with a wall-projector and other devices (external Harddisk, scanner, printer, tv card...) ... and i want mouse-pointer... and to open more formats in the e-ink side (MSWord, fictionbook, html, txt, drm, mobipocket, lit...) an a better zoom-tool...
please you make it, i need it. thank you
Most of it sounds like wishful thinking of an insane client who wants everything, here and now! But actually wouldn't Ubuntu solve most of the software issues for EE? No problems with printers, projectors, etc. No problems with editing all possible documents in any format.
I just installed Ubuntu Netbook Remix on my Dell 2100 and it works like a charm.
Maybe some IT savants could tell us - is it possible to have Ubuntu on EE or not? And how much work actually would it require to make it work better then Android?
 
Old 08-18-2010, 09:18 AM   #13
MichaelV
Edge User
 
I thinks is possible but issues are with the way edge boot. also I do not think there are any eink drivers for ubuntu
 
Old 08-19-2010, 05:59 PM   #14
supermarkitos2004
Edge User
 
Melkor, you understand me, friend! we want the same!
Many e-ink readers work with Linux, this means that there are linux drivers for e-ink display. And when there are linux drivers, there are ubuntu drivers too!
I am not an insane client who wants everything (only a bit crazy client ha ha ha), i want to obtain the maximum of my edge entourage. And I think that Edge Entourage is conceibed for books, documents and website reading on the e-ink side (all formats) and productivity, file management without neverending fingering (compressing too), internet, a little bit music+video on LCD---> I don´t need anymore!!! ehem, support for mouse pointer and other hardware too. I am 31 and touchscreen-fingering is difficult and stressing for me (i want to move the screen and mistakely i click on the false link)
I am a doctor and I bought an Edge Entourage because i wanted an e-ink reader for my books, medical documents, and at the same time look for information in internet. I wanted to work with an Office suite with quality and Outlook to control my calender. And no more! No games, no Biorythm-app, no Car-gastank-control-app...
It´s nice when a developer wants to test machine´s capabilities and watch video on the e-ink display... but, ehem, have you noticed that e-ink display is white and black??? Maybe this idea is good for Charles Chaplin´s old films, or Eisenstein´s ... but, would you see Avatar on the e-ink side??? ha ha ha
Sometimes i think that a lot of users of this forum don´t really need an Edge Entourage, they bought it to play with it. How many complete books or complete documents have they read on the e-ink side of their Edge Entourage???

Last edited by supermarkitos2004; 08-19-2010 at 06:06 PM.
 
Old 08-19-2010, 08:14 PM   #15
Chubulor
Edge User
 
The PDF annotation is the big draw for a lot of users, supermarkitos. I confess to not having read any books on the Edge -- I have a little Kindle for that.
 
 

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