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Old 08-28-2007, 02:12 PM   #16
Adam B.
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If you're familiar with Debian, than you should have no problem making Gargoyle work on your iLiad with other IF titles.

You'll need the iLiad Shell access package: https://myirex.irexnet.com/user.php/developer

After you get that, download this gargoyle package, and edit run.sh.
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Old 08-30-2007, 03:41 AM   #17
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Thanks! This works great, now!
For now, I am probably going to create a separate manifest (with "../" style paths to the executables) for each game file I want to have on the iLiad, that seems like an easy way to get started.

I have a couple of questions, though:
1. How can I get the window to run full screen, as in your June 1 blog post? I'm thinking I might be happy with the keyboard partially covering it since I can choose to have it at top or bottom of the window.
2. It's a bit awkward to save or load files now (try typing "save" or "restore" at the prompt -- a gtk1-style save/load dialogue pops up behind the interpreter window), and it would be even worse if the window is full screen.
3. Are your patches (if any) or sources available or is this just a plain recompile?
4. (slightly ot to the topic of gargoyle, but...) How do I get started with porting to, or developing for, the iLiad? Is there a nice collection of links available or is searching this forum my best bet? I'd love to just RTFM but I'm scared that I'll find obsolete information since things seem to be moving quickly.

Thank you so much for you time and for this port!
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Old 08-30-2007, 09:54 AM   #18
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1. To get it to run full screen, you'll need to recompile it. I'm probably the worst person when it comes to keeping modifications and revisions to the source.
2. I haven't tested saving... But since the main window is made to act as a dialog, it could be causing a problem with a new dialog popping up. If it was full screen, it may pop up on top like normal.
3. This was mostly a recompile with a few modifications for screen refreshes built in. I wipe my development area clean every month or so to start fresh, and I'm afraid I haven't kept the changes.
4. The best place to start is with the VMWare development image here. Read the links at the bottom of the first post for a quick how-to. A good tutorial for screen refreshes and other info can be found here.

Not much on the development side has changed since the beginning. It's just a lot easer to get started, and now that you can unbrick your device, you don't have to worry about breaking it.

Let me know if you have any problems or questions. I'm always willing to hlep out where I can. Especially if it means more iLiad developers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunn Sunn View Post
Thanks! This works great, now!
For now, I am probably going to create a separate manifest (with "../" style paths to the executables) for each game file I want to have on the iLiad, that seems like an easy way to get started.

I have a couple of questions, though:
1. How can I get the window to run full screen, as in your June 1 blog post? I'm thinking I might be happy with the keyboard partially covering it since I can choose to have it at top or bottom of the window.
2. It's a bit awkward to save or load files now (try typing "save" or "restore" at the prompt -- a gtk1-style save/load dialogue pops up behind the interpreter window), and it would be even worse if the window is full screen.
3. Are your patches (if any) or sources available or is this just a plain recompile?
4. (slightly ot to the topic of gargoyle, but...) How do I get started with porting to, or developing for, the iLiad? Is there a nice collection of links available or is searching this forum my best bet? I'd love to just RTFM but I'm scared that I'll find obsolete information since things seem to be moving quickly.

Thank you so much for you time and for this port!
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Old 08-31-2007, 12:07 AM   #19
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"Interactive Fiction" is the term that's been the standard one for the last 20 years or so, Jon. It's gone way beyond the original adventure games; take a look at the IF archive site - many of the modern "games" are more like novels. There are active Usenet newsgroups "rec.games.int-fiction" and "rec.arts.int-fiction", reflecting the original "game" and the "literary" types of IF.
The original name for this category of games was called Adventure games. People changing the name won't help as it's really still Adventure games. Always has been, always will be. I find the term interactive-fiction to be crud. It's so much nicer to say Adventure game. And it means more too even if the games themselves have evolved (the genre is still the same). The IF such as Colossal Cave and Zork were originally Adventure games. Now why change the genre name and call them something that sounds silly when the name they had (and always will have for those of use who know better) was perfect for them?
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Old 08-31-2007, 01:12 AM   #20
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I've only had my iLiad for a couple of days and I don't really know what "unbricking" and so on means.
I don't have an iLiad, but "bricking" means you tried something that left your device unusable -- IE, a brick, and "unbricking" is the recovery process.

A bad firmware update is a good way to brick a device. Reverting to previous known good firmware unbricks it.
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Old 08-31-2007, 01:19 AM   #21
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The original name for this category of games was called Adventure games. People changing the name won't help as it's really still Adventure games. Always has been, always will be. I find the term interactive-fiction to be crud. It's so much nicer to say Adventure game. And it means more too even if the games themselves have evolved (the genre is still the same). The IF such as Colossal Cave and Zork were originally Adventure games. Now why change the genre name and call them something that sounds silly when the name they had (and always will have for those of use who know better) was perfect for them?
They are indeed Adventure games, but those are a category of the larger class of Interactive Fiction.
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Old 08-31-2007, 10:09 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
The original name for this category of games was called Adventure games. People changing the name won't help as it's really still Adventure games. Always has been, always will be. I find the term interactive-fiction to be crud. It's so much nicer to say Adventure game. And it means more too even if the games themselves have evolved (the genre is still the same). The IF such as Colossal Cave and Zork were originally Adventure games. Now why change the genre name and call them something that sounds silly when the name they had (and always will have for those of use who know better) was perfect for them?
According to Wikipedia, the term "Adventure Games" refers to graphical games as well as text-only (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventure_game). I've called the latter "interactive fiction" for the past two decades, and I started with ADVENT on the PDP-11. As far as I knew, "Adventure" was the name of a specific game, and IF was the general category. I can see extending "Adventure Games" to cover this wide range of both text and graphic games like Zork and Myst, but some IF isn't really about "adventure." I think for text games, IF is the standard term these days.

Then again, as a linguist, I'm usually more interested in how people actually use words and phrases than in how they are "supposed to" use them. Maybe a poll would be a good idea.
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Old 08-31-2007, 03:09 PM   #23
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*sigh*

Contrary to what JSWolf would like this genre to be called the "industry" that makes and supports IF calls it IF. Shouldn't those people decide what there work is going to be called?
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Old 09-01-2007, 12:08 AM   #24
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Contrary to what JSWolf would like this genre to be called the "industry" that makes and supports IF calls it IF. Shouldn't those people decide what there work is going to be called?
They did decide. They decided to call them adventure games.
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Old 09-01-2007, 04:07 AM   #25
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... just as the Victorians called novels like "The Woman in White" and "The Moonstone" "sensation novels". Today we'd call them "thrillers". Names do change, Jon. Today this category of item is called "interactive fiction" whether you "approve" or not . Language usage does change over time. Much modern IF is not a "game" at all - it's "interactive literature".
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Old 09-04-2007, 07:50 PM   #26
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Could Gargoyle be added to the iLiad sw wiki page?
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Old 09-05-2007, 08:37 AM   #27
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Could Gargoyle be added to the iLiad sw wiki page?
Done.
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Old 09-05-2007, 11:23 AM   #28
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... just as the Victorians called novels like "The Woman in White" and "The Moonstone" "sensation novels". Today we'd call them "thrillers". Names do change, Jon. Today this category of item is called "interactive fiction" whether you "approve" or not . Language usage does change over time. Much modern IF is not a "game" at all - it's "interactive literature".
I'm not buying this name change to IF. That's just pure BS. It's been Adventure Games for as long as there have been computers to run them on. And yes they are games. Adventure games are a form of puzzle games.
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Old 09-05-2007, 12:27 PM   #29
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Interactive Fiction is a subgenre of adventure games. The term is most commonly used for text-only games driven by typed commands, though sometimes there can also be some static pictures.
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Old 09-05-2007, 12:29 PM   #30
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I'm not buying this name change to IF. That's just pure BS. It's been Adventure Games for as long as there have been computers to run them on. And yes they are games. Adventure games are a form of puzzle games.
Jon,

With the greatest respect, it's not up to you to dictate what other people choose to call things . I would suggest that you try your suggestion in the "rec.games.int-fiction" Usenet newsgroup and see how far you get .

If it makes you happy to call them adventure games then go ahead and call them that; it's a free board .
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