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Old 01-15-2011, 05:08 PM   #46
JSWolf
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I just took a look at Sony Style's website and the 650 is showing as in stock for black and out of stock for the red.
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Old 01-15-2011, 07:30 PM   #47
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I guess it's just the irresistible urge to become just one more mooing member of the massive Kindle herd. All hail the cult of Kindle
No, it's not just being a "member of the massive Kindle herd." It also depends on an individual's reading habits. What's important to one person may not be equally important to another person, based on how each individual plans to use their device.

I also have both a K3 and PRS-650, and while I love the touchscreen on the Sony, the main advantage of the Kindle for me is the syncing of reading locations across devices. When I got my first reader (a Sony 505) and was only reading on the one device, being able to quickly find my reading location wasn't a very big deal. But now I switch devices while reading on almost a daily basis, and in that regard there is no comparison between the two. It's the main reason I purchased a Kindle when the prices dropped this summer. For me, it's pretty much a draw between the two... which is why I use both devices almost equally.
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Old 01-15-2011, 10:48 PM   #48
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No, it's not just being a "member of the massive Kindle herd." It also depends on an individual's reading habits. . .
yes, it's really nice that kindle can "sync" so I can also read my kindle book on that tiny 1.4 inch screen on my smart phone, not to mention on my microwave oven, toaster, and other assorted really useful 'book reading' appliances.

Hell, without that 'sync' I might actually have to remember a page number . . .

Of course, I will be the first to admit that this is a bit more useful for Kindle owners, since remembering 'page numbers' on the Kindle a real pain, since it uses that non-standard multi digit mishmash instead of EPUBs more normal looking number range.

Sorry I can't be more enthusiastic about Kindle, but I have just had a seemingly never ending series of experiences that have convinced me, "Friends don't let friends buy Kindles." (at least not if they have already seen what a book reader SHOULD BE)

In a moment of weakness, I relented and did not object when a close family member bought a kindle instead of the Sony that other family members use.

They had been proselytized by some friends who were obvious Kindle pod-people. These folks were just soooo proud of how they had become hi-tech masters of the Internet, and could, are you ready for this? - ACTUALLY 'download' and READ A BOOK! (insert proud tittering giggle here)

I have been dealing with the fallout ever since . . .

To help out, I take Kindle out of box, connect it up and download a book and hand Kindle to proud new owner, who looks at the book title on Kindle's home screen.

Proud new Kindle owner - "How come there's no pictures?" reaches up and taps book title with finger, "it's not working!"

Me - "Sorry, it's not a touch screen, like the Sony" I take Kindle and show them how to open the book.

a little while later -

"Could you show me how to download this book to the Kindle?"

Thinking they just want help with the kindle store, I follow them back to the computer to find they have downloaded a book to Adobe ADE from the local library's Overdrive page, and now want to send it to the Kindle -

Me - "Sorry, that doesn't work with Kindle"

Concerned Kindle owner - "It's ok, see? I downloaded it ok! I can see it right here!" pointing to the book cover icon.

Me - "Yeh, you downloaded it just fine, you have it right here, I see - " I open the book in ADE on the PC, "but you will have to just read it on the computer, you CAN'T send it to Kindle."

"Huh? but, we do that all the time!"

"Yep, but that's with the Sony, it doesn't work with the Kindle"

Trying to placate this poor wretch, I show them that the library does have some un-encrypted plain vanilla MP3 audio books that can be downloaded, and help them load one of these onto the Kindle.

A few Days later -

"Could you show me something on the Kindle?"

"Sure, what's the problem"

"Well, sometimes I nod off while listening to my audiobook, and then I have to start over."

At this point I try to explain how they can conveniently jump to the middle of an 80 minute long MP3 audio book track, only to discover that THERE IS NO WAY TO DO THIS ON THE KINDLE.

Because the Kindles built in MP3 playback is only really designed to work with 'Audible' content, and for generic MP3's your track positioning can only jump 30 seconds at time (pretty much the most useless piece of garbage I have ever seen in my life).

And so on, and so on . . .

Sure if all you want to do is pay Amazon 10 bucks and read a book, Kindle is fine.

Other than being a good way to help Amazon's cash flow, I can't say I'm very impressed with the Kindle.

Last edited by delphin; 01-15-2011 at 11:23 PM.
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Old 01-15-2011, 11:01 PM   #49
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I don't know how anyone can listen to Audio books on an ereader of any sort. If you have to hold a "book" and sit, unless you have eyesight problems, it's so much easier to put it on an mp3 player and clip it to my collar with short wire ear buds. MP3 on my readers are for reading music only.
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Old 01-15-2011, 11:19 PM   #50
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I don't know how anyone can listen to Audio books on an ereader of any sort. If you have to hold a "book" and sit, unless you have eyesight problems, it's so much easier to put it on an mp3 player and clip it to my collar with short wire ear buds. MP3 on my readers are for reading music only.
Aside from the things you mentioned, I don't like to put the extra cycles on the ereader rechargeable battery that the higher load of audio playback generates. The Lithium Ion battery should be good for hundreds of cycles, but with lot's of MP3 playback you could be hitting that point after only a year or two.

But occasional MP3 playback is fine, and when traveling I invariably take the PRS-650, and it's nice that it's built in MP3 player works so well because that's one less thing to have to tote around.

Background music is indeed nice, especially while flying, and even nicer when you can actually CHOOSE which album you would like as background music from several on your reader (which can NOT be done on the Kindle, but CAN on the Sony)

But in general, I agree that most of the time a dedicated MP3 player is a much better choice, in the case of the Kindle this choice is made for you because the built in MP3 player is pretty much USELESS.

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Old 01-16-2011, 12:14 AM   #51
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I have to say, i can never understand the "mine is better than yours" attitude some folks here at MR seem to have toward their ereaders, whether it's Kindle people looking down on others, or Sony people looking down on Kindles, Nook people looking down on Kobo, Pocketbook people looking down on whatever, Apple people looking down on ereaders, etc., etc., etc. Nor do I understand the defensive stance that some take when someone makes negative comments about their particular device. Do not self-identify with your ereader - negative comments against it are not negative comments against you.

There is no perfect ereader, people. There's only ones that meet our particular needs at a particular point in time. Just because someone chooses a different ereader than the one you love doesn't mean that they chose poorly, or that they were duped, or that they are dumb. People get what works best in their particular cirumstances.

/end rant
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Old 01-16-2011, 12:26 AM   #52
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Tsk, tsk... be careful, that's sounding like common sense... very dangerous...


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I have to say, i can never understand the "mine is better than yours" attitude some folks here at MR seem to have toward their ereaders, whether it's Kindle people looking down on others, or Sony people looking down on Kindles, Nook people looking down on Kobo, Pocketbook people looking down on whatever, Apple people looking down on ereaders, etc., etc., etc. Nor do I understand the defensive stance that some take when someone makes negative comments about their particular device. Do not self-identify with your ereader - negative comments against it are not negative comments against you.

There is no perfect ereader, people. There's only ones that meet our particular needs at a particular point in time. Just because someone chooses a different ereader than the one you love doesn't mean that they chose poorly, or that they were duped, or that they are dumb. People get what works best in their particular cirumstances.

/end rant
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Old 01-16-2011, 08:32 AM   #53
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I have to say, i can never understand the "mine is better than yours" attitude some folks here at MR seem to have toward their ereaders, whether it's Kindle people looking down on others, or Sony people looking down on Kindles, Nook people looking down on Kobo, Pocketbook people looking down on whatever, Apple people looking down on ereaders, etc., etc., etc. Nor do I understand the defensive stance that some take when someone makes negative comments about their particular device. Do not self-identify with your ereader - negative comments against it are not negative comments against you.

There is no perfect ereader, people. There's only ones that meet our particular needs at a particular point in time. Just because someone chooses a different ereader than the one you love doesn't mean that they chose poorly, or that they were duped, or that they are dumb. People get what works best in their particular cirumstances.

/end rant
Well, that *was* the point I was trying to make when I said "It also depends on an individual's reading habits. What's important to one person may not be equally important to another person, based on how each individual plans to use their device." And then pointing out what I liked about each device as an example of why someone might choose one device over another. But apparently that point was totally lost as someone then proceeded to make fun of the one example that might be important to others because it was not important to him personally.

ETA: I have also seen many people post that they do not want a touchscreen on their reader. Now, me, I love the touchscreen on the Sony, but if others don't want a touchscreen, that's fine and I would never belittle them because they don't like the feature that I like best. I just wouldn't recommend a Sony to them (unless it was an older Sony without the touchscreen). Likewise, if someone says they mainly want a reader so they can read ebooks from the library, which is something that is not that important to me since my local libraries don't have a good selection, I wouldn't make fun of someone for wanting to have a reader compatible with Overdrive library books. I just wouldn't recommend the Kindle to those individuals.

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Old 01-17-2011, 04:45 AM   #54
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. . . Likewise, if someone says they mainly want a reader so they can read ebooks from the library, which is something that is not that important to me since my local libraries don't have a good selection, I wouldn't make fun of someone for wanting to have a reader compatible with Overdrive library books. I just wouldn't recommend the Kindle to those individuals.
Funny, what you said above about "not that important to me since my local libraries don't have a good selection."

This was almost word for word EXACTLY what my local Kindle pod-person said, when I inquired if perhaps SHE knew how to get the Kendle working with Overdrive so we could transfer library books.

The Overdrive section of my local library currently lists 685 Epub titles, which may not sound like much, but it includes a really nice selection of both New York times best selling authors and popular works from lesser known authors.

Do Kindle owners think it makes them seem worldly and important if they imply that they just couldn't possibly live for even a minute without access to such popular world shaking titles as "Farming Practices of Western Siberia 1645 to 1840" ?

So I asked to see what she had on her Kindle.

No Farming Practices from Siberia (or anywhere else as it turns out), nothing special or exotic at all in fact, just a couple James Patterson, a couple Dean Koontz, and a Dan Brown. Out of the measly six books on the device, EVERY ONE WAS AVAILABLE IN OUR LOCAL LIBRARY.

Now in fairness, only ONE of the titles that she had on her Kindle (I Alex Cross) was available for immediate checkout, but when titles are already checked out, you can request to be wait-listed and the library will happily email you when your ebook title is available.

I noticed that a second of her titles, Dan Brown's - The Lost Symbol, became available only two days later (even without being wait-listed), so I went ahead and grabbed it myself. I didn't find it to be my cup of tea, which highlights a HUGE benefit of using the library - Not having to pay 10 bucks to find out you won't like something.

Overall, I have found the Overdrive service to be quite useful, so I wish folks wouldn't dismiss it so casually.

If you really must have some screaming hot title that you either can't find, or get wait listed for, then BY ALL MEANS YOU ARE FREE TO BUY IT !

With the PRS-650, you can buy books from Kobo, Borders, and Google Books, as well as the Sony Book Store (plus others that are coming on line with Adobe EPUB titles).

That's what I like about the Sony - LOT'S OF OPTIONS.

So getting back to the topic at hand -

As has been very wisely stated, it's hard to recommend anything flat out without knowing your potential buyers priorities.

I would hate to recommend the Sony solely on the strength of its' really nice touch screen interface, and the fact that the features it does have, like it's built in MP3 player, are nicely designed and work well (unlike Kindles horrible, near useless "experimental" 'science project' features) - then find out later that the person who bought the PRS-650 was overcome with envy when a friend whipped out a Kindle 3G and 'tweeted' or some other such web related B.S. (Geeee, I wish I could do that!!!).

Personally, I have very mixed feelings about an e-ink style e-reader like the Kindle 3 or PRS-650 being turned into a web-enabled device. I suppose it's ok to use WiFi or 3G to simplify the process of loading books onto the device, but when I am reading, it's just me and the words on the printed page, and I DON'T WANT the web intruding and creating distractions.

When I read on my Netbook, for example, it's hard to resist popping open a browser window to quickly check a factoid that happened to spark some interest while reading. If I am doing technical reading for research purposes, a limited amount of this type of spontaneous 'hyper searching' can be productive and useful.

When reading for enjoyment, however, I find having the web close at hand, almost without exception, to be distracting and negative.

In other words, simply put, NOT having a web browser and email messaging close at hand while reading for pleasure is the better choice for me, because it reduces distractions and lets me stay focused and enjoy my reading more.

"Heh, but what about that fancy PRS-650 touch screen interface?" you might ask, "Doesn't that wiz bang technology ALSO create a distraction factor?"

Actually, NO, quite the opposite - The PRS-650's touch screen technology, far from adding a technical distraction factor, actually reduces it. This is because the touch interface is so incredibly simple and intuitive, that it essentially JUST VANISHES.

You just find your books cover in the thumbnail browser - give it a quick tap to open it - and literally one second later - it's just you and the printed word. Simple, elegant, glorious!

On the other hand, if you are more a product of the modern age, and find that none of my comments ring true to you . . .

If you find that even 10 minutes spent reading, without pausing to "update status" causes you to start to feel physically ill from the symptoms of 'INTERNET WITHDRAWAL', then you might just be happier with a Kindle 3G. Lack of Overdirve support though, would make Kindle my LAST choice.

If I did want the web handy while reading, I would prefer a Netbook, Nook Color, or other Android tablet based reader, all of which offer BETTER web browsers, and all of which DO have support for checking out Adobe EPUB books using my libraries Overdrive service.

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Old 01-18-2011, 05:39 PM   #55
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Funny, what you said above about "not that important to me since my local libraries don't have a good selection."

This was almost word for word EXACTLY what my local Kindle pod-person said, when I inquired if perhaps SHE knew how to get the Kendle working with Overdrive so we could transfer library books.

The Overdrive section of my local library currently lists 685 Epub titles, which may not sound like much, but it includes a really nice selection of both New York times best selling authors and popular works from lesser known authors.

Do Kindle owners think it makes them seem worldly and important if they imply that they just couldn't possibly live for even a minute without access to such popular world shaking titles as "Farming Practices of Western Siberia 1645 to 1840" ?
It's not a question of not having "Farming Practices of Western Siberia" or any other such type of facetious book available from the local library, it's the fact that if you are a genre reader, one in which most of the books are issued in paperback and not in hardcover, those aren't the books that libraries, with their limited funding, tend to buy.

So it's not pod-speak if someone is saying that the books they tend to read are not available from their public library. And it's not boasting on the Kindle owners' part if they claim that they have better access to a wider assortment of ebooks - it's merely the truth.

I'm not a Kindle owner, so I have no vested interest in promoting it but I am a library-card holder and I know for a fact that my county-wide library system doesn't carry either the books or the ebooks by authors I enjoy. In order to get some of ebooks that my library doesn't provide access to, I'll buy the Kindle book via Kindle for PC and strip the DRM so that I can use it on my ereader. So in many instances, the Kindle system is more useful than the library system.
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Old 01-19-2011, 12:06 AM   #56
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. . . So it's not pod-speak if someone is saying that the books they tend to read are not available from their public library. And it's not boasting on the Kindle owners' part if they claim that they have better access to a wider assortment of ebooks - it's merely the truth.
Oh, I see, you mean like the Harry Potter books.

Tragically this series is not available for the Sony -- but I can just waltz right over to the Kindle store, and ... Oh, crap not available for the Kindle either!!!

In fact I have NEVER run across a SINGLE example of a title that was actually of use to me that WAS available on Amazon's Kindle, but was not available for the PRS-650 by accessing the combined resources of my local library, the Sony Store, Borders, Kobo, and Google Books (3 million titles and counting).

My point was simply that it's kind of nice that I can get about 90% plus of my reading material FREE, and for the other 10% I can't imagine a case where Amazon was my only option.

Perhaps you can cite an example of a popular series that IS available through Amazon, but NOT available from Sony, Borders, Kobo, or Google Books???

This question is 'on-topic' for this thread, because in considering the original topic "Is the Sony really that good?", I am sure that everyone will want to know about any books that just aren't available for the Sony, but which could be read on Kindle or another reader.

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Old 01-19-2011, 05:53 AM   #57
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In fact I have NEVER run across a SINGLE example of a title that was actually of use to me that WAS available on Amazon's Kindle, but was not available for the PRS-650 by accessing the combined resources of my local library, the Sony Store, Borders, Kobo, and Google Books (3 million titles and counting).
The Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson and the reason I bought a Kindle last year.

You know, I love Sony's. I do believe they are a superior, which is evident in the 5 Sony readers I have bought over the past 1.5 years. I own a Kindle only because I wanted The Primal Blueprint on ebook and couldn't get it anywhere else, but seriously? You're so over the top even though I love my Sonys you could drive me towards Kindle, Nook, Astak, anywhere just because your methods of persuasion are more of a repellent.

I'm not sure what happened btwn your first post and this one, but I went from agreeing with you to being embarrassed that we have the same reader. Did something bad happen to you after that post??

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Old 01-19-2011, 09:54 AM   #58
Bookworm_Girl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SolRaven View Post
The Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson and the reason I bought a Kindle last year.

You know, I love Sony's. I do believe they are a superior, which is evident in the 5 Sony readers I have bought over the past 1.5 years. I own a Kindle only because I wanted The Primal Blueprint on ebook and couldn't get it anywhere else,
The Sony is my main ereader. It's where I do most of my reading. However, one of the reasons I bought a Kindle was access to books that aren't available in EPUB format. It is not that frequent that books are not available in both formats, but it was the case for some books that I really wanted to read too. Also, more and more best-selling authors are signing exclusive deals with Amazon such that their books are only available in Kindle format or available for some time frame like a year before EPUB. Here is an interesting article which gives examples.
http://gigaom.com/2010/02/08/more-au...-kindle-deals/
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Old 01-19-2011, 10:23 AM   #59
JSWolf
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I say don't buy exclusive eBooks. Just let them rot.
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Old 01-19-2011, 10:38 AM   #60
tm3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delphin View Post

For example, Amazon didn't see fit to include numbers on the keyboard (not even as shifted characters), so you have to use the stupid arrow keys to navigate this cumbersome 'virtual' on-screen keyboard for numbers.

For me though, having the more user friendly touch screen interface is really important, because I like to also use some of the publicly available book sites like feedbooks, which offers literally thousands of free public domain titles, and in sorting out the wheat from the chaff, it's important to me that my reader makes browsing through a large numbers of titles as pleasant as possible (even after thousands of titles are loaded on the reader.)
i don't own an ereader, and am considering the 650 and the K3.

your comment about mac vs pc got my attention as i am a long time mac owner even though i have soured a bit on apple recently. but i'm not sure that i understand the above ...

1) is entering a string of numbers on a ereader a common thing? why?

2) since the 650 does not have wifi, how do you browse an online book site?

thanks
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