Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book Uploads - Patricia Clark Memorial Library > Upload Help

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-22-2014, 09:06 PM   #1
AlexBell
Wizard
AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AlexBell's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,252
Karma: 3868800
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Launceston, Tasmania
Device: Kindle3, Kobo Touch, Sony PRS T3, Nexus 7, iPad mini
ancle or ankle?

I'm now working on Round the Sofa by Elizabeth Gaskell. The 1859 Sampson Low edition contains the text:

'her foot had slipped upon the polished oak staircase, and her ancle had been sprained.'

I've no idea whether this was Mrs Gaskell's choice, or the publisher's or typesetter's decision.

I've more or less decided to silently change 'ancle' to 'ankle', and would be most grateful for feedback on the reasoning behind this decision.

- I don't want to leave the text unchanged - it just doesn't look right to me, and it's possible that readers may see it as an uncorrected typo.

- I don't want to mark the change with a footnote for two reasons:
-- When I first became interested in designing ebooks for the MR Library four years or so ago I looked at how others had designed their ebooks, and am certain that it was quite common for designers to write something like 'typos have been silently corrected'. I thought and still think that's a good example to follow.
-- I haven't come across any example of an author putting a footnote in a later version pointing out changes they have made. If anyone has an example of an author doing that please let me know.

What do other designers and readers think?

In case it needs to be written: I don't claim for a second that the choice I intend to make has any authority, or that anyone else should be impelled to make the same design choice. It just makes sense to me.
AlexBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2014, 09:44 PM   #2
eschwartz
Irrational Optimist
eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.eschwartz ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 5,285
Karma: 8275858
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: The Beaten Path, USA, Roundworld, This Side of Infinity
Device: Kindle Touch (Wifi only)
I don't think typos in the original text are an important heritage that should be preserved.

As a reader, I vote to correct it.
eschwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Enthusiast
Old 07-22-2014, 11:10 PM   #3
PeterT
Taking a break; Fed up
PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
PeterT's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,674
Karma: 43902502
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Toronto
Device: Wife: Touch, Arc, Vox Me: Nexus 7, Glo
My quick searching shows that ancle is a British spelling of ankle.
PeterT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 01:07 AM   #4
AlexBell
Wizard
AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AlexBell's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,252
Karma: 3868800
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Launceston, Tasmania
Device: Kindle3, Kobo Touch, Sony PRS T3, Nexus 7, iPad mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterT View Post
My quick searching shows that ancle is a British spelling of ankle.
I think you'll find it's 'archaic.' It's not in my Oxford Paperback Dictionary, and not found at www.oxforddictionaries.com. And I've never seen it before. If it is archaic I think my original decision is still valid.

Could you tell me please where you found it?
AlexBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 01:39 AM   #5
PeterT
Taking a break; Fed up
PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
PeterT's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,674
Karma: 43902502
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Toronto
Device: Wife: Touch, Arc, Vox Me: Nexus 7, Glo
The OED for a start....

Its safe to say that at the time the book was written, and the edition you are using, ancle was an accepted spelling of ankle.


Unfortunately I'm currently unable to access my library's web site, so can't get back to the OED. Hopefully I'll be able to in the morning,


This link should work for the next 3 days.
http://www.oed.com/view/Entry/7823?p...N1z5ijg&d=7823

Last edited by PeterT; 07-23-2014 at 01:47 AM.
PeterT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 05:33 AM   #6
Jellby
frumious Bandersnatch
Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Jellby's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,075
Karma: 4571547
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Spaniard in Sweden
Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura
This scan has "ankle", and it seems to be as old (1858) as others that have "ancle". There may be other spelling changes, though. A search for "ancle" in Google Books yields more than a few 19th century results.
Jellby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 11:28 AM   #7
Araucaria
Bibliophile
Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Araucaria ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Araucaria's Avatar
 
Posts: 102
Karma: 848538
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Cantal in the French Auvergne
Device: Kindle 3
Have a look at the Google Ngram viewer with ancle/ankle (a fascinating tool). The spelling with a "c" was more common up to about 1830, after which it went into terminal decline. Mrs Gaskell would have seen the older spelling frequently in her younger days.

Mind you, I'm surprised that Victorian authors were able to mention the word at all without blushing. Perhaps they were talking about horses?
Araucaria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 11:32 AM   #8
Bilbo1967
Not scared!
Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Bilbo1967 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Bilbo1967's Avatar
 
Posts: 8,112
Karma: 25330868
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Midlands, UK
Device: Sony 650, Sony T2, Xoom, Nexus 7 (2012 & 2013), Nook ST (x3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araucaria View Post
Mind you, I'm surprised that Victorian authors were able to mention the word at all without blushing. Perhaps they were talking about horses?
In which case it would be spelled, F.E.T.L.O.C.K
Bilbo1967 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 03:06 PM   #9
PeterT
Taking a break; Fed up
PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.PeterT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
PeterT's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,674
Karma: 43902502
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Toronto
Device: Wife: Touch, Arc, Vox Me: Nexus 7, Glo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araucaria View Post
Have a look at the Google Ngram viewer with ancle/ankle (a fascinating tool).
WOW... Love that tool! Never seen it before!
PeterT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 07:23 PM   #10
AlexBell
Wizard
AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AlexBell's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,252
Karma: 3868800
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Launceston, Tasmania
Device: Kindle3, Kobo Touch, Sony PRS T3, Nexus 7, iPad mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by Araucaria View Post
Have a look at the Google Ngram viewer with ancle/ankle (a fascinating tool). The spelling with a "c" was more common up to about 1830, after which it went into terminal decline. Mrs Gaskell would have seen the older spelling frequently in her younger days.

Mind you, I'm surprised that Victorian authors were able to mention the word at all without blushing. Perhaps they were talking about horses?
Thanks so much for the reference to NGram viewer. That looks to be an interesting and useful tool for future use. Karma on its way.
AlexBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 07:32 PM   #11
AlexBell
Wizard
AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlexBell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AlexBell's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,252
Karma: 3868800
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Launceston, Tasmania
Device: Kindle3, Kobo Touch, Sony PRS T3, Nexus 7, iPad mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellby View Post
This scan has "ankle", and it seems to be as old (1858) as others that have "ancle". There may be other spelling changes, though. A search for "ancle" in Google Books yields more than a few 19th century results.
Thanks, Jellby, for the notion of searching in Google Books. I didn't know that was possible.

I accept that ancle is an old spelling for ankle. But my original post still stands, and I really would appreciate feedback on my rationale for silently changing from ancle to ankle rather than leaving it or changing it and putting a footnote.
AlexBell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 07:33 PM   #12
JSWolf
Resident Curmudgeon
JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
JSWolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 36,622
Karma: 17734032
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Sony Reader PRS-650, iPad, nook STR
I would leave ancle since you now know that it's valid.
JSWolf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-23-2014, 08:24 PM   #13
AnemicOak
Bookaholic
AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AnemicOak's Avatar
 
Posts: 10,199
Karma: 28685597
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Minnesota
Device: HDX 8.9, AuraHD, Nook HD+, Kindle 2,3,T , Opus, Nexus7, iPhone5, etc
Unless your goal is to duplicate that specific edition of the book IMO you're fine either way and it doesn't seem the kind of change that needs elaborate notation. You're not really changing the word and either spelling is accepted for the time period.

I say do what you want and don't stress too much over it (I think I know why you're asking the question).

As a reader who appreciates the work people put into nice editions of PD works I always appreciate it when changes are noted somewhere, either in the posting of the book or in the front/back matter, but I don't know if this change is significant enough to note separately or not.
AnemicOak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2014, 12:30 AM   #14
JSWolf
Resident Curmudgeon
JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
JSWolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 36,622
Karma: 17734032
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Sony Reader PRS-650, iPad, nook STR
Personally, I'd rather the original spelling as that's what the author used. But if you do change it, there could be a major incident. I would think leaving the word alone would be much safer for you given what's already happened.
JSWolf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2014, 05:04 AM   #15
Jellby
frumious Bandersnatch
Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Jellby's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,075
Karma: 4571547
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Spaniard in Sweden
Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura
My take would probably be:

a. If you find other old or strange spellings, leave this as "ancle", on the assumption that this is the original and it's not wrong.

b. Otherwise (or if there are other instances of "ankle"), change it to "ankle" without notice (unless you give a full, detailed list of changes), based on the existence of contemporary editions with this spelling, which may indicate that this was actually a typo and unintended by the author.
Jellby is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:31 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.