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Old 10-02-2010, 06:27 PM   #1
Steven Lake
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Big House vs Small House Publishing

Hey all, I've been thinking about this. Lots of people here, and in other places on the internet argue incessantly about why either Big House (baen, random house, etc) or small house (tiny presses with only a few hundred authors) is the better way to go. However, the reasons always seem inconsistent, so I figure that it wouldn't hurt to discuss the reasons, and maybe make a list of pros and cons, and sorta hash that out. So I'll start out with my core list, and you guys can add, subtract, or append to it with your own thoughts.

Big House Pros:
* A large publishing house behind you with lots of clout.
* Marketing. They've got the connections to get you well known.
* Lots of money to help you become famous and well known.
* Publisher name recognition. If you're with a big name house it immediately gives you an extra boost of credibility. IE, you'll sell more books, not because you're good, but simply because you're published with a name recognized publisher.
* Gets into the distribution stream quickly, and quantities are almost always guaranteed, except when demand exceeds printing capacity.

Big House Cons:
* Very difficult to get into.
* You're treated like cattle. IE, you're just a number.
* If your first book doesn't fly, good luck ever getting another one published by them.
* Just because they have the money doesn't mean they'll spend it on you. So you may get published by them, but you might find that you're on your own after that.
* They tell YOU what you'll do with your book. IE, you lose creative control of it once it's accepted by them and may be butchered as a result. Only the *really* high sales authors get around this issue, as they are able to dictate their own contracts.
* They go for the "mass market", and as a result may push your book in the wrong markets, thus hurting sales.
* Just because you're a signed author and they've got the resources doesn't mean they'll market you. In some cases they'll print your book and then leave you to fend for yourself, ultimately reserving their marketing power to the bigger authors.
* They tend to be very out of touch with their customers, causing customer kickbacks that can hurt you as an author.

Small House Pros:
* Very personal treatment. They quite often give you very hands on treatment.
* The book you give them, minus basic editing, is the book that is published. They may suggest changes, but they won't force them on you.
* Easier to get into in some cases, even though they're still selective.
* More niche and genre focused, which means that if you're accepted, you have a better chance of your book selling better than it would through a big house.
* More willing to work with you on prices for various things, like author purchased books (IE, copies you buy for selling yourself at events)
* You're more likely to get signings and other events, even if they are smaller than what the big houses might be able to arrange or offer.
* They'll always market you, even if it's on a much smaller scale than the big houses can offer.
* They want you to succeed.
* They are very pro-customer/reader which is highly beneficial to you as an author, as well as your current and future customers.

Small House Cons:
* Limited marketing, or small marketing budget.
* Lack of market clout in comparison to the big houses.
* Smaller print runs, which may result in your book price being higher, which may hurt sales.

Draws (Ie, neither really wins):
* Success rates. Just because you get picked up doesn't mean you'll be an instant best seller.
* General author and story quality. Some books they publish will be gems, some will be turds.

Ok, that's all I can come up with, so what about you guys? Also, this list is drawn from both my own experiences, and the collective experiences of others I have observed and talked to over the years. So not all the items on this list are of my design, just fyi. Anywho, discuss and comment, and then add your own thoughts. I'm thinking that if we can get a good enough list of pros and cons together we might even add this to the wiki. Of course, if an entry for this already exists, maybe we can update it with more current info.

Last edited by Steven Lake; 10-16-2010 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 10-02-2010, 08:02 PM   #2
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I think your pros and cons pretty much nail it for me. I came very close with the big publishers, but in the end, they passed. So I submitted with a small publisher and was accepted. I also tried self-pubbing with Amazon to see which would be more successful. But it's an experiment that has yet to pan out because the publishers don't issue royalties for 60 to 90 days after the end of a quarter. Since my new book has only been out two months, I'll have to wait a little longer to find out. Nonetheless, I signed a third book with a different small publisher, so I guess I'm in favor of a small publisher. My book is in edits now and will release in December.

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Old 10-02-2010, 09:58 PM   #3
Steven Lake
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Yeah, mine's been pretty good so far. He usually pays within the first week or two after the quarter. Mine I just roll over and keep on account to buy more print books for sale, or to cover other expenses as needed, like posters, business cards, etc. I just let him do them for me as it's just easier for me. As for buying more print books on account, that actually works out well, because that way I not only get my royalties, but I also get a little extra from the profit I make on selling the books. ^_^
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Old 10-03-2010, 06:19 AM   #4
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Good points, Steve, and mostly on the ball; though not all smaller houses offer only 'basic' editing. Having edited for the main players, I would back the quality of my own editorial team against anyone's ... on all levels.

You might be interested in popping into the *For Authors* section of our own website at http://www.bewrite.net. It's a warts-n-all piece that honestly covers pretty well all your points and one or two others and was drawn up with personal advice from other industry pros in houses big and small (and even personally cleared, pre-posting, by the highly-sensitive and astute 'Writer BeWare').

Where I strongly agree with you is that an author MUST do his/her homework and realise that there are many levels of publishing from the mighty Big Six down to the deplorable author mills and vanity-presses-in-disguise. After the work that goes into actually producing a manuscript, it's a sin not to put in the research necessary to be sure it will not have been effort, time and tears wasted.

Best wishes. Neil (and here's karma to ya for raising such an important point)
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Old 10-03-2010, 06:24 AM   #5
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I've done both. If I had my choice, I'd go with a big publisher every time. I like their clout, I like having the bigger print runs, I like seeing my book for sale at airports.

Small publishers have their benefits, too, especially if you want personal attention paid to your work.
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Old 10-03-2010, 10:04 AM   #6
Steven Lake
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Yeah, I do admit that there are a few nice perks to being published by a big house. But I hate being treated like cattle. That's why I went with a small house. I'd rather lose a little bit of marketing clout and settle for smaller print runs than to be treated like cattle by a big house. Now will I never publish with a big house? Nah. You show me a big house who actually cares for their authors and their books, and I'll show you a writer standing in line to sign with them.
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Old 10-03-2010, 02:26 PM   #7
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Actually, 'unknown' authors sometimes gain by small press projection. The bigger houses offer little to newcomers and mid-listers, Steve. Neil
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Old 10-03-2010, 02:35 PM   #8
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As the internet levels the playing field, I can see the smaller publishers gaining ground over the major publishers in their niches. Small publishers can adapt to marketing conditions faster than larger publishers. A possible "pro" point for small presses.
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Old 10-03-2010, 09:47 PM   #9
Steven Lake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neilmarr View Post
Actually, 'unknown' authors sometimes gain by small press projection. The bigger houses offer little to newcomers and mid-listers, Steve. Neil
Oh, exactly. It's like I said above, if you're not a big lister, good luck getting much, if any marketing from the big presses. If you really look at the big picture, and take into account all the facts, including what Valmore Daniels said, unless you're a big name author, there's really no value in going with one of the big houses. (I mean big 'officially', not 'in your own mind' as some authors are. lol. ) Now if you're a big name author, you're better to go with the big houses. For everyone else, I'd say that small is better.
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Old 10-03-2010, 11:53 PM   #10
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Valmore's point about the internet levelling the field is quite important at the moment while everyone runs around in this new arena but I am pondering how much that'll change in the next couple of years as various parties rise up from the noise to dominate ( much like Facebook, Google and Youtube have almost effectively wiped out their competitors ). We can see places like Smashwords already getting ahead while other existing large print houses are losing ground in the eBook arena.

Good points all around - good reading.

Paul.
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Old 10-08-2010, 04:53 PM   #11
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Oh, exactly. It's like I said above, if you're not a big lister, good luck getting much, if any marketing from the big presses. If you really look at the big picture, and take into account all the facts, including what Valmore Daniels said, unless you're a big name author, there's really no value in going with one of the big houses. (I mean big 'officially', not 'in your own mind' as some authors are. lol. ) Now if you're a big name author, you're better to go with the big houses. For everyone else, I'd say that small is better.
Excellent point, I've read, pretty much everywhere, that 90% of your big house budget is spent on a mere 2% of the authors. I worked for a multi-national and after that small glimpse of how big business works, I can believe it. A lot of people I know make money by inventing something in their shed, turning it in to a business and then when the business gets to a certain size, the multinationals turn up and they sell it and retire for ever (I live near Cambridge remember). So I've got this book which I wrote in my shed, I'm selling it and when it gets big enough hopefully Random House, Harper Collins, or Transworld, will come calling.

Meanwhile I self publish and people get to actually read my book in the public domain... before I die.

Cheers

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Old 10-08-2010, 08:42 PM   #12
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lol. That's a great way to look at it. I myself would love to be picked up by Random House, but only for one of my series (Land of the Lions) as I feel that would do best with a big house publisher. I think the rest will actually do better at a small house. Some might think differently, but that's my thoughts on it.

Anywho, if they do pick me up, there will be several stipulations that will immediately go into the contract before I ever sign with them. They are: 1) I will be treated as a human, and not cattle. 2) My book is my book. Do not even *DREAM* of changing it. Suggest all the editing and grammatical tweaks you want, but if I don't want to change it, it's not getting changed. Deal with it. And no, you may not in any way change the story on your own unless I say so. 3) I may not be Dan Brown, but you *WILL* market my book with a reasonable amount of effort. 4) Don't lie to me...ever. You lie to me, the book goes elsewhere, period.

Now most big houses will probably laugh at those demands, and if they do, fine. I simply don't need to publish with them then. This might sound a bit snooty on my part, but dangit, I've spent my life getting stepped on by big companies, and I will not let a publisher do it to me too! It's one of the biggest reasons I went small house in the first place.

Last edited by Steven Lake; 10-08-2010 at 08:45 PM.
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Old 10-10-2010, 04:46 PM   #13
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I reckon the very terms you set out exclude you from anything but a small house until you are the next dan brown!

Cheers

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Old 10-10-2010, 05:28 PM   #14
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Well, if that's the case, then so be it. If there isn't a single big house out there who'll agree to those simple terms, then I guess I don't need them. :P Really, it's not that much to ask. I guess of the four demands, #4 is probably number 1 on my list. I hate being lied to, and omission of information for the purpose of selfish gain is just the same as lying in my book.
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Old 10-10-2010, 05:41 PM   #15
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Anywho, if they do pick me up, there will be several stipulations that will immediately go into the contract before I ever sign with them. They are: 1) I will be treated as a human, and not cattle. 2) My book is my book. Do not even *DREAM* of changing it. Suggest all the editing and grammatical tweaks you want, but if I don't want to change it, it's not getting changed. Deal with it.
.
Have to ask...how do you know the changes they suggest wouldn't make your book better and more likely to sell? Even if they are changes you don't like? Would you really give up the chance of a best selling book because you wouldn't take somebody else's advice?

Don't get me wrong, I admire anyone who's that confident in their abilities that they believe an outsider wouldn't have a contribution that would make the book better.
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