Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > General Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-13-2010, 09:20 AM   #1
mike_bike_kite
Digitally confused
mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
mike_bike_kite's Avatar
 
Posts: 469
Karma: 1468286
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: London, UK
Device: KPW, K2i, Nexus 7 32gb, Kobo Mini
SciFi history?

I was just reading Time for the Stars by Robert A. Heinlein (1956). The crew on the space ship are out in deep space and needing to either grow or recycle everything to survive. It made me smile to be reading a SciFi story on electronic paper about the crew of some future space craft who were having to recycle paper for their morning newspaper
mike_bike_kite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 09:31 AM   #2
banjobama
Busy Read'n
banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.banjobama ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
banjobama's Avatar
 
Posts: 973
Karma: 5039283
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Device: Sony Reader PRS-650, Nexus 7
Ha ha ha. Silly readers of words on paper!
banjobama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 09:45 AM   #3
K-Thom
Wizard
K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.K-Thom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 3,302
Karma: 535819
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Berlin, Germany
Device: yup!
Why, on a long-term space odyssey it even could make sense to rather use recycled paper than an electronic reading device, which might be much more complicated and energy-consuming to recycle.
K-Thom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:01 AM   #4
speedtouch
eBook Newbie
speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.speedtouch once ate a cherry pie in a record 7 seconds.
 
Posts: 371
Karma: 1724
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: St. Louis, MO
Device: Kobo Aura
Well, because electronic readers weren't thought of back then when the book was written. Paper was the medium of information transfer.
speedtouch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:18 AM   #5
WillAdams
Guru
WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
WillAdams's Avatar
 
Posts: 979
Karma: 1915000
Join Date: Feb 2008
Device: Sony PRS-600, Fujitsu Stylistic ST-4121
It was hard to imagine that the large devices which filled the basement of a university or office or government building and output to paper tape and were input to punch cards would become small, personal and ubiquitous.

I'm trying to think of the first such instance, but blanking --- anyone?

William
WillAdams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:28 AM   #6
mike_bike_kite
Digitally confused
mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
mike_bike_kite's Avatar
 
Posts: 469
Karma: 1468286
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: London, UK
Device: KPW, K2i, Nexus 7 32gb, Kobo Mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by K-Thom View Post
Why, on a long-term space odyssey it even could make sense to rather use recycled paper than an electronic reading device, which might be much more complicated and energy-consuming to recycle.
I can't see that:
  • There's the extra weight and volume of the books (at least 1000:1).
  • This means more fuel will be required by the ship.
  • Recycling paper results in approx 30% loss each time which means fresh paper will always be required.
  • A fully grown tree can be turned into 300 new paperback books.
  • But recycling needs machinery and a lot of energy.
  • If you like to read on white paper then you'll also have to factor in the use of bleaches.
  • But most of all I just can't picture the star ship enterprise with a large paper based library.
Assuming ereaders can be made unbreakable then the only ongoing cost is their electricity. The electronics should also be unbreakable, if they're not then it doesn't bode well for life aboard the spaceship.
mike_bike_kite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:35 AM   #7
HamsterRage
Evangelist
HamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notesHamsterRage can name that song in three notes
 
HamsterRage's Avatar
 
Posts: 435
Karma: 24326
Join Date: Jun 2010
Device: Kobo
It's fun to go back and read hard SciFi from the 30s to the 50s just to see how much they missed. EE Doc Smith stuff is especially cool for that.

Miniaturization seems to have completely passed by most authors. They make everything huge to accommodate the gigantic machines.
HamsterRage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:39 AM   #8
mike_bike_kite
Digitally confused
mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.mike_bike_kite ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
mike_bike_kite's Avatar
 
Posts: 469
Karma: 1468286
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: London, UK
Device: KPW, K2i, Nexus 7 32gb, Kobo Mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedtouch View Post
Well, because electronic readers weren't thought of back then when the book was written. Paper was the medium of information transfer.
I certainly wasn't putting Heinlein down for missing future inventions but SciFi aims to show us the future and sadly the world really hasn't changed that much since the whole genre began. It was just quite nice to suddenly come across an example where reality had actually outpaced fiction for once.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillAdams
I'm trying to think of the first such instance, but blanking --- anyone?
The Commodore Pet came out in 1975. If you like the history of personal computers then this coffee table book is great Digital Retro.

Last edited by mike_bike_kite; 07-13-2010 at 10:44 AM.
mike_bike_kite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:50 AM   #9
curtw
Outside of a dog
curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
curtw's Avatar
 
Posts: 589
Karma: 1371114
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Houston, TX
Device: iPod Touch, Kindle 3, Nexus 7, Sony PRS-T2
Possible first occurrence

According to this reference, the first science fiction writer to posit an electronic book was Stanislaw Lem, in Return From the Stars, in 1961. Just five years (and a fantastic paradigm shift) from your Heinlein book.

I love this...

Quote:
I spent the afternoon in a bookstore. There were no books in it. None had been printed for nearly half a century. And how I have looked forward to them, after the micro films that made up the library of the Prometheus! No such luck. No longer was it possible to browse among shelves, to weigh volumes in hand, to feel their heft, the promise of ponderous reading. The bookstore resembled, instead, an electronic laboratory. The books were crystals with recorded contents. They can be read the aid of an opton, which was similar to a book but had only one page between the covers. At a touch, successive pages of the text appeared on it. But optons were little used, the sales-robot told me. The public preferred lectons - like lectons read out loud, they could be set to any voice, tempo, and modulation. Only scientific publications having a very limited distribution were still printed, on a plastic imitation paper. Thus all my purchases fitted into one pocket, though there must have been almost three hundred titles. My handful of crystal corn - my books. I selected a number of works on history and sociology, a few on statistics and demography, and what the girl from Adapt had recommended on psychology. A couple of the larger mathematical textbooks - larger, of course, in the sense of their content, not of their physical science. The robot that served me was itself an encyclopedia, in that - as it told me - it was linked directly, through electronic catalogs, to templates of every book on earth. As a rule, a bookstore had only single "copies" of books, and when someone needed a particular book, the contents of the work was recorded in a crystal.

The originals - Crystomatrices - were not to be seen; they were kept behind pale blue enamel the steel plates. So a book was printed, as it were, every time someone needed it. The question of printings, of their quantity, of their running out, had ceased to exist. Actually, a great achievement, and yet I regretted the passing of books.
curtw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 10:52 AM   #10
sabredog
Geographically Restricted
sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
sabredog's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,611
Karma: 14933353
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Perth, Australia
Device: Sony PRS-650, Sony PRS-T3, Kindle 3, iPad2, Nexus7v2
I well remember Starman Jones by Robert Heinlein where the ships astrogators had to be mathematical geniuses, using logarithmic tables to calculate hyperspace jumps. They even used slide rules before card inputting to the ships computer.

Well I remember using log tables at school and later professionally! Slide rules...nope....

It is a good book though!
sabredog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 11:13 AM   #11
BenG
Wizard
BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,786
Karma: 58923204
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Arkham, MA
Device: Paperwhite
We had lessons in high school about using slide rules but that was just as hand held calculators were making an appearance so it was never put to any practical use even though the calculators were pretty expensive at that time. I think one guy in the pre-calculus class had one, but was allowed to use it on tests.
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 11:21 AM   #12
WillAdams
Guru
WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WillAdams ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
WillAdams's Avatar
 
Posts: 979
Karma: 1915000
Join Date: Feb 2008
Device: Sony PRS-600, Fujitsu Stylistic ST-4121
mike_bike_kite --- thanks, but I was more looking for the reference which curtw made, for the ebook reader, save I was thinking more of the ubiquitous small hand-held computer --- the first reference I'm thinking of for that would be Niven & Pournelle's _The Mote in God's Eye_ which was from 1974, but surely there were others between 1961 and 1974.

William
WillAdams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 11:31 AM   #13
sabredog
Geographically Restricted
sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
sabredog's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,611
Karma: 14933353
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Perth, Australia
Device: Sony PRS-650, Sony PRS-T3, Kindle 3, iPad2, Nexus7v2
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillAdams View Post
mike_bike_kite --- thanks, but I was more looking for the reference which curtw made, for the ebook reader, save I was thinking more of the ubiquitous small hand-held computer --- the first reference I'm thinking of for that would be Niven & Pournelle's _The Mote in God's Eye_ which was from 1974, but surely there were others between 1961 and 1974.

William
I remember that reference and use it often when discussing the modern PDA and smart phone. It is the first reference I remember for the device that everyone uses now, but then it was really science fiction.

I do not recall authors like H Beam Piper using hand held computers at all in their stories. Though James Blish did mention a "cat's brain computer" in the screenplay short story adaptation of the Star Trek episode "Miri" published in the early 70's. However that was the size of a modern desktop printer.

In the old ST Classic episodes, books were read on moniitors rather than hand held devices

The Star Trek Padd was used to read books in STTNG, but that was much later on.
sabredog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 11:35 AM   #14
curtw
Outside of a dog
curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.curtw ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
curtw's Avatar
 
Posts: 589
Karma: 1371114
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Houston, TX
Device: iPod Touch, Kindle 3, Nexus 7, Sony PRS-T2
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillAdams View Post
mike_bike_kite --- thanks, but I was more looking for the reference which curtw made, for the ebook reader, save I was thinking more of the ubiquitous small hand-held computer --- the first reference I'm thinking of for that would be Niven & Pournelle's _The Mote in God's Eye_ which was from 1974, but surely there were others between 1961 and 1974.

William
The same site says that your memory is accurate: Pocket Computer originated with The Mote in God's Eye
curtw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2010, 11:45 AM   #15
sabredog
Geographically Restricted
sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sabredog ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
sabredog's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,611
Karma: 14933353
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Perth, Australia
Device: Sony PRS-650, Sony PRS-T3, Kindle 3, iPad2, Nexus7v2
It was also mentioned in some detail in the Mote in God's Eye setting novel "King David's Spaceship" One of the middies was using it to call the Imperial Naval destroyer orbiting Prince Samual's World. That book, written in the early 80's, was an expanded version of the three part serial "A Spaceship for the King" which was written way back in 1971, before Mote I believe.
sabredog is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New SciFi: 2184 MartinParish Self-Promotions by Authors and Publishers 33 12-26-2010 10:59 PM
Do you know this scifi paperback series? motormanjh Reading Recommendations 2 08-08-2009 04:55 PM
New SciFi Ezine Out Gibbo News 18 04-26-2009 11:07 AM
Help me place this SciFi! RWJ Lounge 12 10-22-2008 04:58 AM
SciFi/Fantasy kezza Deals, Freebies, and Resources (No Self-Promotion) 2 04-13-2003 12:52 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:48 PM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.