Newbie question on all this Amazon DRM stuff

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by Alisa

This is of questionable legality. If Amazon did actually snoop on your Kindle and figure out that you'd done this you could be in trouble. So far they haven't but none of us can guarantee they won't in the future. They reserve the right to do so.

I'm not worried about this. There is no way for Amazon to know if I have an ebook on my Kindle what it's source was. I could have scanned and OCRed it. I could have typed it in. Both legitimate fair use format shifting tasks.

BOb

[Alisa]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

I'm not worried about this. There is no way for Amazon to know if I have an ebook on my Kindle what it's source was. I could have scanned and OCRed it. I could have typed it in. Both legitimate fair use format shifting tasks.

BOb

That's my feeling on the matter. And, as bwaldron said, it would be massively bad PR if they tried. I'm going to keep on as I have been, merrily stripping DRM from my legally obtained content for my personal use only. I wouldn't feel right encouraging others to do so, however, since I can't really guarantee they'll never get in trouble.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

I'm not worried about this. There is no way for Amazon to know if I have an ebook on my Kindle what it's source was. I could have scanned and OCRed it. I could have typed it in. Both legitimate fair use format shifting tasks.

They just have to download illegally available versions and compare to your version so see were you got it from.

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by tompe

They just have to download illegally available versions and compare to your version so see were you got it from.

Then I am fine, because I don't have any illegally obtained ebooks.

BOb

[Lilly]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Then I am fine, because I don't have any illegally obtained ebooks.

BOb

Same here! I buy all my books from legitimate online vendors.

[RickyMaveety]

Originally Posted by tompe

They just have to download illegally available versions and compare to your version so see were you got it from.

Keep in mind that a book available and purchased from another vendor is not "illegal" in the sense that it is pirated. It is legally obtained content.

However, even material legally purchased could be considered as obtained through circumvention of DRM. And, if Amazon goes that route, and starts monitoring Kindle content with that in mind, then I think their customers are going to have a monumental hissy fit.

I know I will.

[Alisa]

Originally Posted by tompe

They just have to download illegally available versions and compare to your version so see were you got it from.

Target could also post a security guard on every aisle and eliminate shoplifting altogether but I doubt it would be cost effective.

They could maintain a huge database of books and check all my content against it but they would have to build and maintain such a system in addition to paying for the bandwidth to grab as many samples of my stuff as they could while I was connected. Once they detected suspicious content, they'd have to determine if it was illegal or not. If it was, then each publisher could sue me for each individual book. That book costs a heck of a lot less than getting the lawyer to write a single letter. They could boot me from the system for breaking their ToS but then I wouldn't buy any more books. I'm just not seeing any upside to Amazon for a system like this. There's a reason the music industry has targeted uploaders. They're the only ones for which you can make a real argument in civil court for them costing you significant money.

[Spectrum]

I should have the right to do whatever I want with the product I buy without manufacturer telling me restrictions on it's use as long as I am not accessing the material from their site illegally.

If you are happy with your usage, keep on reading!

What others do with their device is others business.

[dschill]

^^ i totally agree with Spectrum

[Patricia]

There are many people who find it difficult to get to a library, owing to the distance they have to travel, mobility impairments etc.

Amazon could have made life easier for them. It is a great pity that they chose not to do so.

[larisa0001]

Originally Posted by bwaldron

True. But if Amazon started using the DMCA against individual Kindle users in such a fashion, the negative publicity would be far beyond anything they're getting now. It would be an incredibly stupid move...but, yeah, doesn't mean it won't happen.

Me, I'm not currently concerned about the de-drm'd (but legally purchased) ebooks on my Kindle.

As an (almost) lawyer, I am actually really hoping that someone brings a suit like that - this is the only way the DMCA can get thrown out. Right now, the general public's picture of a DMCA violator is someone who wants to get content without paying for it. If the public (a jury) can see just how broad, and how restrictive, the DMCA really is, and how it can lock people out of material they paid for and thought they owned, I think it may be enough to get it thrown out.

And e-books are actually perfect for this - when the Kindle dies a natural death, the next e-book gadget comes out, and everyone finds out that the $$$$ they spent on Kindle books has essentially been wasted, because they can't possibly read those books on the next gadget without violating the DMCA, chances are that this will become a live issue in the public's mind.

I own about $100 worth of eReader books that I can't read on any of the e-paper gadgets. No, I won't violate the DMCA - I'd rather lose $100 than get sued for copyright infringement and possibly lose my job and my license to practice law. But I don't like it that I can't legally access content that I paid good money for. No one else will like it either. The Kindle is just a problem waiting to happen.

[Thomas Ryan]

Originally Posted by larisa0001

As an (almost) lawyer, I am actually really hoping that someone brings a suit like that - this is the only way the DMCA can get thrown out. [...] The Kindle is just a problem waiting to happen.

Why wait for Kindle? Amazon may already be in the process of creating a precedent.
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http://www.publishersweekly.com/arti...rid=1192404514

Amazon To Drop Microsoft, Adobe e-Book Formats
By Calvin Reid -- Publishers Weekly, 1/26/2009 7:08:00 AM

Amazon.com has notified its publisher and author clients that it plans to cease offering e-books in the Microsoft Reader and Adobe e-book formats. [...Kindle/mobi only...]
====

Consider your options after you buy an Adobe DRM'ed (I assume they have DRM) book from Amazon this year, wait until the support is gone, and now buy a new computer...If it was "PID"-locked like Kindle, you're "legal" "copy" is worth less and you paid for it. I think the challenge you face is that you only purchased a limited "license" to the copy. The license "expired". too bad.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by Thomas Ryan

Why wait for Kindle? Amazon may already be in the process of creating a precedent.

http://www.publishersweekly.com/arti...rid=1192404514

Amazon To Drop Microsoft, Adobe e-Book Formats
By Calvin Reid -- Publishers Weekly, 1/26/2009 7:08:00 AM

Amazon.com has notified its publisher and author clients that it plans to cease offering e-books in the Microsoft Reader and Adobe e-book formats. In the future, the online retailer says it plans to offer only e-books in the Kindle format (for wireless download to its Kindle reading device) and the Mobipocket format, both of which are owned by Amazon. The online retailer’s note asks publishers and authors to make sure that Amazon has written permission to offer their books for sale in the Mobipocket format.

Consider your options after you buy an Adobe DRM'ed (I assume they have DRM) book from Amazon this year, wait until the support is gone, and now buy a new computer...If it was "PID"-locked like Kindle, you're "legal" "copy" is worthless than you paid for it.

I thought they dropped all those formats back when they dumped everyone's books in, was it 2005?

[Sydney's Mom]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

If you are running Vista,even the version 6.0 won't recognize the Kindle.

Oh, that is why I spent an entire evening looking for and installing and uninstalling and reinstalling version 6.0, and it didn't work!

It wasn't me!

[larisa0001]

Originally Posted by AnemicOak

I thought they dropped all those formats back when they dumped everyone's books in, was it 2005?

Sure, but e-books weren't on everyone's radar in 2005 the way they are now. There are e-book gadgets on display at the local Borders now. People who had no clue about e-books in 2005 are now buying Kindles. So in 2005, the outrage was confined to a few first-adopter geeks - when they do this now, they'll piss off a lot more people. Note the question that started this thread - the newbie in question is obviously new to the DRM debate. When Amazon drops the Kindle (and they will), that newbie may well be one of the people clamoring for their money back.