07-22-2014, 03:04 PM | #16 | |
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Google translates it as "empty enclosure". |
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07-22-2014, 03:48 PM | #17 | |
Wizard
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The ability to resell however will increase the value of the purchase for potential buyers. |
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07-22-2014, 04:45 PM | #18 | |
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At least that's the way I see it. If the publishers want to sell eBooks at near the price of paper books, the buyers should have the right to sell them. |
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07-22-2014, 04:51 PM | #19 | |
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https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=239064 so we don't need to repeat ourselves - again - so soon. |
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07-22-2014, 04:52 PM | #20 | |
DRM hater
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Try picking up a digital file from the 1980s or the 1990s and using it as intended. Given that, at least with Kindle and Epub, they are well-understood and minted on a sort-of-open-standard (except for the DRM), our odds are better than opening a WordStar file or running a 16-bit program. That said, digital obsolescence is a real issue. Do you really think the first Kindle will be supported forever? Or that Amazon or Nook won't possibly be out of business in 2035 or whatever and people won't lose their books like they did with DRM'd music from the Microsoft store that shut down? It'll happen. It's probably just a matter of time. Even for the people that think "That could never happen, Amazon will be around forever!"... People losing physical books is the same as people losing Amazon/Nook account info and never get it back, or they lose the device and have no idea what the account info was. People die and digital content isn't inherited (another outstanding issue). People's accounts can get banned. etc. Just because they don't wear out, per se, doesn't mean that there aren't ways for them to end up non-readable / non-usable. Last edited by GreenMonkey; 07-22-2014 at 04:57 PM. |
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07-22-2014, 05:03 PM | #21 |
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I agree it's a concern, but I don't think it's a given. In fact, I think the Information Age has given us the awareness and the tools to prevent the sort of digital obsolescence you are talking about. It's far easier to preserve digital data than it is to conserve paper books. We could do with sheer distributed volume what in the paper world would take materials, skill, and climate controlled environs. You've heard of "rare books?" I dount we'll ever hear of "rare ebooks."
An 80s vintage 8" disk might be hard to "use as intended" today, but we are well along the route of having separated content from media, or even format. True, all humanity's technology can collapse, we could go back to the level of the stone age and not be able to access ANY digital info, but by the same token, we could all go blind, illiterate or atrophy to the point where we could no longer access any paper books, too. Stuff happens. |
07-22-2014, 05:10 PM | #22 |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
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This is true. Just look st all of the dead computer systems that came and went in the 1980s and 1970s, or the many late gaming consoles. There is a lot of content that is only still usable because someone broke copyright law and made the code work on newer systems (emulators).
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07-22-2014, 06:16 PM | #23 |
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It seems that the publishers should see the 'writing on the wall' and act in their own self interest to head off these types of legal challenges.
If they used their existing power given by DRM and worked with the major sellers to create a "resell this book" feature where people could submit the book for sell as used (which would remove your capability to access it on your devices, like lending the book does). If your copy sells (used copies sold in a first-in-first-out order) Amazon [or other vendor] keeps a cut, the publisher keeps a cut, and the seller gets 70% of the sell price, and everybody's happy. If you decide, before the book sells, you could retract it from the for-sale stack and get it back. I suspect that many people who don't re-read (myself included) would sell some of their books back when they're done reading them and everybody'd be legit and benefit for all. I'd probably buy more books new and for a higher price if I knew that I could resell them. I think that used books would sell for more than used books do currently (due to the lack of degradation of digital files that everybody keeps mentioning) and yet the publisher gets a cut of used sales, which they currently don't with paper books. |
07-23-2014, 07:38 PM | #24 | |
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A year ago there were thousands of bestsellers sold by individuals on Amazon, but the prices were often under a dime. Now I can't fid them? links anyone. If 10,000 people pre ordered a bestseller, then at least 3,000 would be on sale the next day. And I am thinking that publishers would not allow, and Amazon would not promote selling second hand copies till the sales fell of for new copies. By then their might be 100,000 people queued up to sell their 'used' ebooks, and if they wanted 1/2 price for instance, very good chance the book has already been discounted by that much or more. The publishers have unlimited copies they can sell, and I am sure some fee would be applied to a license transfer. No way they couldn't under cut anyone actually trying to get more then 50 cents for a used book, and for that amount it seems economically unviable. Too much trouble to go to. Helen |
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07-23-2014, 08:35 PM | #25 | ||
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There is no difference to the buyer between a used eBook and a new one. And the same merchants sell both. So there's no reason for the merchant to communicate to the buyer whether the copy purchased was new or used, because there is no such thing as used or new. It all comes from the same bit-bucket. If that's right, then, your proposal is for Amazon, kobo, etc., to buy back eBooks after reading. Then, Amazon gets rewarded for setting up the buy-back software by being allowed to pay the publisher a radically reduced price for a number of copies equal to the buy-back. Quote:
Your plan, again if I understand it, transfers money from book collectors to those who read once and then toss. Since I don't collect books, this isn't totally repellent to me |
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07-23-2014, 10:29 PM | #26 |
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It's interesting that Tom Kabinet is only charging a 10% commission. I don't know what their return policy is if the seller doesn't get what they expected. My assumption is that Tom Kabinet doesn't pay for the used ebook until they have a committed buyer but maybe they don't pay the seller for a couple of weeks after the sale to make sure it's not returned. I don't see the 10% commission as being sustainable when they have to police if the seller has a valid copy and take the legal risk if they don't.
My question is that how much cheaper would it have to be for someone to buy a used ebook. The rights holder is only getting 5% and the quality is unknown. I'd guess that most people that are price sensitive and aren't worried about the author getting compensated would just download from a file sharing site. On the selling side I have the same question. How much would you have to get to bother trying to resell versus not being able to re-read it in the future. It might stop the publishers from being able to price the ebooks equivalent to a paper book but if they price it like the rental they claim it is (a temporary license for only one person to read it) then I think it would kill any viable market to sell them used. I don't feel strongly that I need the right to be able to resell my ebooks but I also don't see a value to anybody else to buy them. I just don't see this as a make or break thing for publishing. If they price the ebooks properly it would kill this as a viable market. The only exception I can see is for educational text books that cost $100's and maybe people should be able to resell those like paper books. Either that or build the cost into the course tuition. |
07-24-2014, 12:24 AM | #27 |
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How about the possibility that someone has attached a virus to an "ebook" file that is being resold. I don't know if it's possible but I imagine someone somewhere is trying to work out if it is and if it should turn out that it is exactly how to do it.
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07-24-2014, 01:28 AM | #28 | |
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It wouldn't affect me, since the virus would be written for Windows, not linux. A bunch of people would double-click on a file that has the ebook icon, and accidentally run a program instead. Very sad, but hardly anything new. That would be a virus masquerading as an ebook. In order to embed a virus in an ebook, you'd have to find some security flaw to exploit in the ereader program -- one that gives you access to the OS. Any reputable source for used ebooks would probably be checking for the watermark, by comparing the book to a master copy. They'd notice weird resources hiding out in the EPUB zip. Last edited by eschwartz; 07-24-2014 at 01:32 AM. |
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07-24-2014, 04:45 AM | #29 |
The Grand Mouse 高貴的老鼠
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The same applies to CDs. Readily copied with full digital fidelity. There's nothing (except personal morality) stopping someone buying CDs, copying them, and then re-selling the CDs.
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07-24-2014, 05:00 AM | #30 | |
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