Have you written off Pocketbook yet?

[paola]

it is also an issue of price - for instance, the Kobo mini is going to sell for less than £60, which compares very favourably with the £100 or so of the PB360: will we be tempted to give up the extra features for £40 discount?

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by paola

it is also an issue of price - for instance, the Kobo mini is going to sell for less than £60, which compares very favourably with the £100 or so of the PB360: will we be tempted to give up the extra features for £40 discount?

That's a very good question. Price differences seem to prick the most at the time of purchase, but then living with missing features and prolonged aggravations afterwards often causes a reassessment. I don't know how many times I thought afterwards that the $20 I saved is unnoticeable in my life months down the road, but the crap I'm dealing with because of it goes on. Still, if the prices keep getting lower, buying multiple models will be an option without much buyer's remorse.

[troll05]

I think with a little investigation there is ONE reader for each and every user and no BEST FOR EVERYONE. For the named reasons I prefer the PB Touch, my wife loves her PRS-350 and wouldn't change it for anything in the world, and if you ask the average Kobo / Kindle / Nook user in this forum each will find a number of reasons why his own device is the best (for himself).
Prices may make a difference for the spontaneous buyer, but for somebody who did some research on his new toy I don't think it is all there is to consider, especially with the mare than affordable new "basic" devices for far less than 100 bucks

[Zetmolm]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

• Onyx Boox, especially the i62HD (see my comment above)
• Wexler Flex One (if weight and/or durability is all-important, and money is no object)
• BeBook Pure
• Cybook Bookeen Odyssey
• And probably a few others, that I can't bring to mind

The BeBook Pure has the old Vizplex E Ink screen, not Pearl. But BeBook will release a more advanced reader, presumably Pearl, in a few months' time.

The Cybook Bookeen Odyssey does have Pearl, in contrast to what Troll05 says. (He's mixing it up with the Orizon, which had the Sipix screen.)

Unlike Hrafn, I chose the PocketBook Touch over the Onyx Boox i62HD because from my perspective the hardware differences may be slightly in Onyx's favor, but the PocketBook software is really much and much better. Goes to show that a lot depends on personal preferences

[troll05]

Originally Posted by Zetmolm

The Cybook Bookeen Odyssey does have Pearl, in contrast to what Troll05 says. (He's mixing it up with the Orizon, which had the Sipix screen.)

No, I didn't mix it up, but the touch layer of the Odyssey makes the background look pretty dark (although pearl) and slurs the contrast very bad. In direct comparison it was much darker and with considerable less contrast than my PB 602 (with Vizplex).
I took it to Thalia to compare with the OYO (Sipix) and even this was better than the Odyssey.
Additional with light fom an oblique angle you could see a fine hexagonal pattern on the surface (due to the touchscreen).

All in all not worth the effort to order it and send it back

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by troll05

Not for sale yet, only prototype

It is now available from a couple of stores for around US$350.

[paola]

Originally Posted by rkomar

Price differences seem to prick the most at the time of purchase, but then living with missing features and prolonged aggravations afterwards often causes a reassessment.

Originally Posted by troll05

Prices may make a difference for the spontaneous buyer, but for somebody who did some research on his new toy I don't think it is all there is to consider, especially with the mare than affordable new "basic" devices for far less than 100 bucks

Agreed, and what both of you say surely goes for virtually all mobileread users - yet I am not sure how much this counts "outside", especially as my guess is that ease of use and availability to purchase can push you towards a reader on impulse. Not scientific, really, but you cannot fail noticing the masses of Kobo readers on display at Gatwick, Heathrow and Edinburgh airport - picture somebody about to go on holiday, plays around with the thing a little bit, and what the hell, for £60 I'll get all these great books. And you don't need to be an expert to change fonts and adjust margins or all the rest, nor bother with DRM and company to buy a book, as you dowload it straight to the machine.

Preempalver can correct me if I am wrong: I think PB did get into a similar agreement with IBS (Internet Book Store) in Italy to sell their devices, though unlike Kobo I think you have to register with Adobe to use the reader (whereas with Kobo I think they take care of it if you buy from Kobobooks directly). It would be interesting to know how ereader sales are going in Italy, and I wonder what prevented PB from entering into similar agreements with book stores in the UK. Then they would get these bookstores, like IBS, to deal with customers.

My guess is that PB will keep having a niche of die hard supporters, but the fact that we no longer have a PB representative on this forum is going to be felt in the medium run (isn't the German forum, with Fork, much more active?). I really do wonder what the point is of the "wanted features" sticky thread....

[FizzyWater]

I bought a Cybook way back when over the net without being able to test-drive it first. It was an incredibly frustrating and ultimately disappointing experience. I pretty much decided I would not buy another ebook reader that I couldn't test physically first.

PB has had some interesting readers, but I'm just not willing to order one without being able to see it in person first.

[Zetmolm]

Originally Posted by troll05

No, I didn't mix it up, but the touch layer of the Odyssey makes the background look pretty dark (although pearl) and slurs the contrast very bad. In direct comparison it was much darker and with considerable less contrast than my PB 602 (with Vizplex).
I took it to Thalia to compare with the OYO (Sipix) and even this was better than the Odyssey.
Additional with light fom an oblique angle you could see a fine hexagonal pattern on the surface (due to the touchscreen).

All in all not worth the effort to order it and send it back

I stand corrected. Thanks for your explanation. I never knew the screen of the Odyssey was that bad.

[Hrafn]

I'd like to correct what seems to me to be some wooly thinking on a number of points:

• Yes price does matter, especially if your purchase is an upgrade, so that it is an incremental cost-benefit analysis of additional features for the cost of a new eReader. And also when there's a likelihood that you'll upgrade further in the future (thus meaning that you're in all likelihood paying for a time-limited benefit).
• Yes hardware does matter, as it is the primary differentiation (the "additional features") for a newer model over staying with the older. The higher the price, the more new features you would expect to get for it.
• If the eReader allows you to use your favorite reading software (e.g. FBReader, or Coolreader) and favorite font, allows a reasonable degree of customisation, and doesn't screw anything up too badly, then software will have a minimal impact on the reading experience.

(All of this is intentionally written from an upgrade perspective, as this thread, both in apparent intent, and actual usage, appears to be about existing/former PB users writing off PB.)

From my own perspective, I would only be willing to pay a small amount for Pearl+6"+touchscreen (possibly the price of a discounted NST, if the Nook software hadn't been so objectionable), otherwise I would simply continue to use my PB360, and wait for something better to come along. However Pearl+6"+touchscreen+HD (whilst still retaining FBReader + user-installed fonts + hierarchical file navigation) was sufficient for me to pay for a full-priced eReader (hence the Boox i62HD).

Of course others may have different priorities, but regardless PB has to offer sufficient new features to warrant an upgrade.

To stay competitive, PB need to either up their marketing game so as to sell more eReaders to new customers, and/or improve the rate of their product development, such that their new products offer a compelling upgrade rationale for their existing userbase. As far as I can see, it is achieving neither.

[Zetmolm]

I agree with Hrafn that price and hardware matter, but I think software may be more important for some of us than he suggests, or at least it is for me. That is why I made the switch from Onyx Boox 60 to PocketBook Touch.

From a hardware perspective that is still a significant step ahead (Pearl+better touchscreen+improved speed), but I gave up on the HD that the Boox i62HD would have offered me because of the software differences.

E.g. I wanted to have dictionaries that handle inflected forms properly, and Onyx never got that right. And PocketBook has multitasking so that I can have 2 books open at the same time and very quickly (2 taps) switch between them.

From a hardware perspective, no brand is able to come up with a compelling upgrade rationale that will last. In the end, all advanced readers are very similar, although one brand may be a few months earlier with new stuff such as HD and frontlight than another brand. Even if PB comes up with a new product that is an interesting upgrade for existing users, other brands will have similar or even better hardware a few months later, for a lower price. If it were all about price and hardware, PB could never compete against the Kindles, Kobos and Nooks of this world.

When talking about PB's marketing game, I think they should put more stress on the fact that they have the most flexible software on the market, with more features than anyone else (and that is a gap that competitors cannot easily close). If you don't need all those features, fine, buy a cheaper reader that still has good hardware. But I think there are enough possible buyers who do want advanced software features, and PB had better find their niche there.

[Hrafn]

I will admit that I've never attempted to use the dictionary feature on either my PB360, or my i62HD. For that matter I cannot remember ever having looked up a dictionary in conjunction with a dead tree book either. When I do look up a dictionary, it is generally the full OED, more often for a word's etymology rather than its meaning (and when the latter, more often than not for the finer shading between its alternate meanings).

But I should have allowed for the fact that reading habits differ, and that therefore for some users some particular customisation function or refined implementation of a feature will be a 'must have', though I am unsure if this is a sufficiently widespread or unidirectional factor to alter my above analysis.

[troll05]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

But I should have allowed for the fact that reading habits differ, and that therefore for some users some particular customisation function or refined implementation of a feature will be a 'must have', though I am unsure if this is a sufficiently widespread or unidirectional factor to alter my above analysis.

And that is a perfect conclusion to this thread

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by troll05

And that is a perfect conclusion to this thread

If so, then this "conclusion" would seem to be that PB is a marginalised niche player of doubtful relevance to the wider market.