Editorial: Are Too Many E-books Stealing the Pleasure of Reading? - Page 3

glitrbug · 05-18-2010, 12:42 AM

See now, (shaking head) I was just the opposite. I used to break out in a cold sweat at the thought of being stuck at home during a blizzard/tornado/hailstorm or bad case of the flu without enough books. I am pretty sure that between what's on my 8 GB SD card in my Kindle 1, what's archived at Amazon and what's saved on my external hard drive, I have more Ebooks than the small town libraries I grew up near had DTB. I remember my 5th grade teacher wailing that I read on a college level and she had no appropriate books for me.
I use LibraryThing to keep track of what I have read, what I thought of it and who I want to read more of. They seem to suggest good books and I get 3 or 4 a month for review so I find new authors that way.

basschick · 05-18-2010, 01:47 AM

are too many ebooks stealing the pleasure of reading?

nope!

Sweetpea · 05-18-2010, 01:56 AM

Sometimes I have the feeling I simply have too many books to choose from. That's mostly when I just finished a book (or the last book of a series). But I already had that feeling too when I just had my pbooks and went to the library every week.

But I feel the same towards my ebooks as I do towards my pbooks. Some books are still very special to me, and those I'll read over and over again. Before, I read those books in pbook form, these days, in ebook form.
The only "problem" I have now, is that not every book is "ready" for reading on both my ereaders. The JE100, with Mobipocket on it, can read every book I have, but on the BeBook Mini I prefer my custom made PDF. But I haven't converted every book to PDF yet...

arma_virumque · 05-18-2010, 02:41 AM

the promise of digital printing was supposed to be the single format. Books are a single format so to speak: table of contents, index and the actuall content, (then you get the little extra details in footnotes, biblios, etc).

The problem of e-readers is their proliferation in many different types that soon will match of books been published!! If every publisher attaches an e-reader to their contents then you'll be hauling 15 different e-readers with their corresponding flavor of USB cable, firewire, bluetooth, 3G, wifi, chargers, etc.

Hence ALL the advantages of digital books is lost, the environmental factor (save trees, in case is not from a tree farm), the usability factor (fast words look up without a dictionary that weights a ton, citations, linking etc), space/weight and the ability to carry as many books as you wish. It's all lost in the DRM crap, vastly different and cumbersome user interfaces particular of e-readers.

Thanks god I got a NOOK with it's touchscreen which makes the experience iPad-like. Because e-readers user interface and navigation is the biggest stumbling block for a fully natural and pleasing reading experience, the very thing the article mourns about.

With a paper book all you gotta do is go and open it. With e-readers you need to pass a user interface degree in order to get to the book.

In my opinion e-readers got a long way to go before they become a solid and comfortable 'writer's' alternative to pulp books.

However, this is just the beginning. As I said earlier e-readers should match the iPad's iBook and pdf reader. I saw a video and fell in love with that.

beppe · 05-18-2010, 04:06 AM

I can see only good things coming from this sort of progress.

astra · 05-18-2010, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falbe Publishing

Yes, the choices may be overwhelming, but forget about the forest and start looking at trees

I love this!

The choice is huge.
However, my reading habits have not changed since I have started to read ebooks only. I use the same approach for choosing what to read as I have been doing for the last decade since I became aware of book forums.
There are 3 forums I follow. Not all the threads and sub-forums that they host. Mostly only general topics such as:
Reading in May 2010
May 2010 reads
Reading at t'moment?
After joining Goodreads and falling in love with it, I follow monthly threads such as Reading in Xmonth 20xx year in two groups: Fantasy Book Club and SciFi; Fantasy Book Club. Although, they are less informative, people discuss read books less, they usually just list them but sometimes there are good reviews.

In a while you find people whose reviews or points of view you like more and follow their suggestions or descriptions of books more than others.
As simple as that. Sometimes I do fall prey to over-hyped books. For example Time Traveller's Wife. Then again, I learn from my mistakes, I try to remember users who raved about it, then read between the lines their posts and remember the posters who have diametrically opposed points of view.
That's how I make my TBR list

Ebooks or printed books, it doesn't matter. I have only so much time to read and I am a very slow reader, so I must be careful of what I choose to read.

amgoforth · 05-18-2010, 05:25 AM

You must be an extrovert. You have missed the whole point. The reason Bob and I and others have these problems is the books are in our face. You go to the library or bookstore, used or new, you can't buy them all. You have to pick a few. Even at thrift shops or library sales it is the same. All these free books online to download is different, you can have all you want, and you get overwhelmed. Of course it is the same if you have a large library of thousands of books like I used to have. Now anyone can do it by downloading them free and legally. I find that I wind up collecting ebooks, but reading real books.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gastan

I really don't intend to be mean but I don't know of any other way to say it ...... this is an absolute waste of time. This is an argument/discussion looking for an excuse to justify its over-long, irrational, pointless existence.

As an e-book reader, have you ever looked at the number of titles available for free on the web, or available conveniently for purchase, and felt lost? Why would you feel any more lost than when you enter any well stocked book store or library?
I didn't really have to keep track of which books I was currently reading, because they were all there on my desk or table. So just put the books you are currently reading on an SD card. Move finished books to a computer file and add the new selection to the card. Never any question of what's currently being read.
In addition, there are so many source of e-books of every type and quality. Yeah, sort of like finding a book store or two in every shopping mall or a library in every town. Choices, choices. I'm pretty sure that this easily exceeds the available libraries of the richest men on earth throughout all of human history before the digital age. But I bet it doesn't exceed any good large city public library.
How do I pick the right books, and manage my reading list? How did you do it before ebooks and ereaders? It shouldn't be any different.
...we want to read the best stuff, and we almost anguish when we compare the number of books we can read with the number of books we'd like to read. I seem to remember having this same feeing in a library, a good bookstore, and now with ebooks. What's changed?
So what are the ways people can simply and comfortably find the right books to read. How about the old fashioned way? Word of mouth; reviews; tried and true favorite authors, etc..
How to keep track of what books they've read and what they liked or learned from them? Physically segregate read books from unread books by maintaining a "read" and an "unread" file - analogous to physically seperating read pbooks from unread pbooks in your bookshelf.
"Wow, that book looks interesting. I think I'll read it." Has there ever been any other way of deciding what to read for pleasure? Will there ever be any other way to decide which book to read -- for pleasure?

astra · 05-18-2010, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gastan

I really don't intend to be mean but I don't know of any other way to say it ...... this is an absolute waste of time. This is an argument/discussion looking for an excuse to justify its over-long, irrational, pointless existence.

As an e-book reader, have you ever looked at the number of titles available for free on the web, or available conveniently for purchase, and felt lost? Why would you feel any more lost than when you enter any well stocked book store or library?
I didn't really have to keep track of which books I was currently reading, because they were all there on my desk or table. So just put the books you are currently reading on an SD card. Move finished books to a computer file and add the new selection to the card. Never any question of what's currently being read.
In addition, there are so many source of e-books of every type and quality. Yeah, sort of like finding a book store or two in every shopping mall or a library in every town. Choices, choices. I'm pretty sure that this easily exceeds the available libraries of the richest men on earth throughout all of human history before the digital age. But I bet it doesn't exceed any good large city public library.
How do I pick the right books, and manage my reading list? How did you do it before ebooks and ereaders? It shouldn't be any different.
...we want to read the best stuff, and we almost anguish when we compare the number of books we can read with the number of books we'd like to read. I seem to remember having this same feeing in a library, a good bookstore, and now with ebooks. What's changed?
So what are the ways people can simply and comfortably find the right books to read. How about the old fashioned way? Word of mouth; reviews; tried and true favorite authors, etc..
How to keep track of what books they've read and what they liked or learned from them? Physically segregate read books from unread books by maintaining a "read" and an "unread" file - analogous to physically seperating read pbooks from unread pbooks in your bookshelf.
"Wow, that book looks interesting. I think I'll read it." Has there ever been any other way of deciding what to read for pleasure? Will there ever be any other way to decide which book to read -- for pleasure?

Brilliant post btw.
It said the same thing I did, just a different wording.
Nothing has changed.
Just like in the First Law trilogy. The first chapter of the first book is called End and the last chapter of the last book is called Beginning.

astra · 05-18-2010, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amgoforth

You go to the library or bookstore, used or new, you can't buy them all. You have to pick a few. All these free books online to download is different, you can have all you want, and you get overwhelmed

Is it about having it, owning it, or actually reading it? Because regardless of what you can own, you can read only so much.

I cannot imagine how one can loose a track of what one is reading. If you read more than one book at time and you loose track of them, then you are incapable of reading many books at the same time. I know, I cannot. So, I don't.
I am sure I would forget all the good books I am planning to read, so I have created a TBR list. It started with a simple handwritten notes in my Read books notebook I have from age of 6, then it was copied to Word on my PC then to Goodreads.

I believe it all boils down to whether you are an organised type of person or not. If you aren't, then you would be in trouble with printed books in huge book shops too.

Blue Tyson · 05-18-2010, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by basschick

are too many ebooks stealing the pleasure of reading?

nope!

Exactly the opposite, in fact.

Coops · 05-18-2010, 07:58 AM

The only issue i see is that it's so much easier to 'give up' on a book early on if it's not immediately grabbing you, and switching to something else.

But the alternative is far, far worse.....
I'm with Glitrbug - " I used to break out in a cold sweat at the thought of being stuck at home during a blizzard/tornado/hailstorm or bad case of the flu without enough books"
I have been stuck on an oil rig offshore, on standby (ie waiting around) and finished my books. This was before the days of internet, and even having my own laptop to ward off death by boredom. My god, the horror.
I had to read an Iain M Banks sci-fi novel, which was painful enough - but the true pit of hell and torture was ending up reading 'Toxin' by Robin Cook.
The Worst Book I Have Ever Read.
Ever.

Look - 71 (count 'em!) 1 star reviews at Amazon.... oh, the memory of it.
http://www.amazon.com/Toxin-Robin-Cook/dp/0399143165

ps - it's inspired me to write my first Amazon review, so it's up to 72 one star reviews now.

TallMomof2 · 05-18-2010, 09:17 AM

Heck, I thought it was going to be an editorial on how all the OCR errors and lack of proof reading makes reading stressful.

IMO, when it comes to books more is better.

astra · 05-18-2010, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TallMomof2

Heck, I thought it was going to be an editorial on how all the OCR errors and lack of proof reading makes reading stressful

That would be true. I hate errors and I hate when I stumble because of an error and it breaks my concentration on the story and jerks me out of it and drops me brutally back to real world.

mores · 05-18-2010, 10:41 AM

For me it's hard to judge, since there was a time between the beginning of puberty and 2000 where I did not read for pleasure. It was eBooks that got me back on track and rekindled my joy of reading.

One thing that I did notice, however, was that most eBook stores are like huge, HUGE warehouses filled with ALL sorts of books. And almost no directions. You need to sift through everything and figure out how to avoid the trash.

Book covers, not just the visuals but also the effort that goes into printing them, do allow you to draw conclusions of their quality. I have given up "browsing" through eBook stores. I buy only what I know I will like.

But having a lot of books on my device does not reduce the joy I find in them. I read only a book at a time, and the only thing I might feel is anticipation to start with the next book - which does not make the current book any less enjoyable.

And just like a smoker who comes home on saturday night only to realize he's out of cancersticks before the weekend I feel stressed when I'm nearing the end of a good book and realize I don't have anything good to read next.
I might have classics or unknown indie books lined up. But sometimes I'm not in the mood to try something new, I feel like there's a void when my favorite authors have not published anything new.

Steven Lyle Jordan · 05-18-2010, 10:46 AM

One of the biggest things to take away here is that, with the significant change in dynamic between available ebooks and consumer tools, comes a need for new and better ways to manage it all, through searching, purchasing (or obtaining), storing, filing, referencing, and just plain enjoying. In other words, everything's different.

Going from "familiar" to "different" usually creates some amount of stress, creating emotions ranging from excitement to dread... and in the case of ebooks, most of their aspects are changing, so there are few areas to fall back on as a "familiar" comfort while everything else changes. Many of the biggest sources of contention among ebook consumers and creators can be said to reflect a desire to keep one element or another "the way it was," creating that "familiar" aspect to provide an anchor as everything else changes around it. The fact that we don't all agree on that anchor--be it prices, formats, access, rights, tools, etc--is what causes much of the contention.

The best way to deal with it, in most cases, is taking things a step at a time as far as you can... but when everything is changing, you often have to take multiple new steps at once... it's like a waltz dancer learning the electric slide, or all the steps to a Michael Jackson video... and it can take some time before you figure out the steps, and the rhythm, and the changes, and finally jump in and take a few practice steps until you get it.

And until you get the steps down, you're too busy concentrating on the effort involved to actually enjoy the dance.

Sooner or later, we'll all have the right tools, know where to get books, know how to store and retrieve them on demand, etc, etc. Some of us already have all the tools and methods we need (lucky you!), and some of us are still waiting and working on the tools and methods that will function as desired for us (hand raised). Eventually it'll be second-nature to everyone.

05-18-2010, 02:41 AM	#34
arma_virumque Member Posts: 14 Karma: 82814 Join Date: May 2010 Device: nook	possibly the promise of digital printing was supposed to be the single format. Books are a single format so to speak: table of contents, index and the actuall content, (then you get the little extra details in footnotes, biblios, etc). The problem of e-readers is their proliferation in many different types that soon will match of books been published!! If every publisher attaches an e-reader to their contents then you'll be hauling 15 different e-readers with their corresponding flavor of USB cable, firewire, bluetooth, 3G, wifi, chargers, etc. Hence ALL the advantages of digital books is lost, the environmental factor (save trees, in case is not from a tree farm), the usability factor (fast words look up without a dictionary that weights a ton, citations, linking etc), space/weight and the ability to carry as many books as you wish. It's all lost in the DRM crap, vastly different and cumbersome user interfaces particular of e-readers. Thanks god I got a NOOK with it's touchscreen which makes the experience iPad-like. Because e-readers user interface and navigation is the biggest stumbling block for a fully natural and pleasing reading experience, the very thing the article mourns about. With a paper book all you gotta do is go and open it. With e-readers you need to pass a user interface degree in order to get to the book. In my opinion e-readers got a long way to go before they become a solid and comfortable 'writer's' alternative to pulp books. However, this is just the beginning. As I said earlier e-readers should match the iPad's iBook and pdf reader. I saw a video and fell in love with that.

05-18-2010, 07:58 AM	#41
Coops Zealot Posts: 129 Karma: 77756 Join Date: May 2009 Device: Kindle Oasis, Sony T3 backup	The only issue i see is that it's so much easier to 'give up' on a book early on if it's not immediately grabbing you, and switching to something else. But the alternative is far, far worse..... I'm with Glitrbug - " I used to break out in a cold sweat at the thought of being stuck at home during a blizzard/tornado/hailstorm or bad case of the flu without enough books" I have been stuck on an oil rig offshore, on standby (ie waiting around) and finished my books. This was before the days of internet, and even having my own laptop to ward off death by boredom. My god, the horror. I had to read an Iain M Banks sci-fi novel, which was painful enough - but the true pit of hell and torture was ending up reading 'Toxin' by Robin Cook. The Worst Book I Have Ever Read. Ever. Look - 71 (count 'em!) 1 star reviews at Amazon.... oh, the memory of it. http://www.amazon.com/Toxin-Robin-Cook/dp/0399143165 ps - it's inspired me to write my first Amazon review, so it's up to 72 one star reviews now. Last edited by Coops; 05-18-2010 at 08:09 AM. Reason: the p.s.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Pleasure Reading Learning Survey	untiedknot	News	19	04-25-2009 01:52 PM
Stealing Light by Gary Gibson	tech_au	Reading Recommendations	5	01-18-2009 01:21 PM
Pleasure to have found you all!	Jai	Introduce Yourself	2	12-03-2007 11:49 AM
Ripping a CD you own is STEALING...	Nate the great	Lounge	189	10-15-2007 08:43 AM

05-18-2010, 12:42 AM	#31
glitrbug Junior Member Posts: 6 Karma: 10 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Omaha, NE Device: Kindle 1	See now, (shaking head) I was just the opposite. I used to break out in a cold sweat at the thought of being stuck at home during a blizzard/tornado/hailstorm or bad case of the flu without enough books. I am pretty sure that between what's on my 8 GB SD card in my Kindle 1, what's archived at Amazon and what's saved on my external hard drive, I have more Ebooks than the small town libraries I grew up near had DTB. I remember my 5th grade teacher wailing that I read on a college level and she had no appropriate books for me. I use LibraryThing to keep track of what I have read, what I thought of it and who I want to read more of. They seem to suggest good books and I get 3 or 4 a month for review so I find new authors that way.

05-18-2010, 01:47 AM	#32
basschick Wizard Posts: 1,096 Karma: 4695691 Join Date: May 2008 Device: Kindle Paperwhite	are too many ebooks stealing the pleasure of reading? nope!

05-18-2010, 01:56 AM	#33
Sweetpea Grand Sorcerer Posts: 9,707 Karma: 32763414 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Krewerd Device: Pocketbook Inkpad 4 Color; Samsung Galaxy Tab S6	Sometimes I have the feeling I simply have too many books to choose from. That's mostly when I just finished a book (or the last book of a series). But I already had that feeling too when I just had my pbooks and went to the library every week. But I feel the same towards my ebooks as I do towards my pbooks. Some books are still very special to me, and those I'll read over and over again. Before, I read those books in pbook form, these days, in ebook form. The only "problem" I have now, is that not every book is "ready" for reading on both my ereaders. The JE100, with Mobipocket on it, can read every book I have, but on the BeBook Mini I prefer my custom made PDF. But I haven't converted every book to PDF yet...

05-18-2010, 04:06 AM	#35
beppe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,161 Karma: 81026524 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Italy Device: Kindle3, Ipod4, IPad2	I can see only good things coming from this sort of progress.

05-18-2010, 09:17 AM	#42
TallMomof2 Kindlephilia Posts: 2,017 Karma: 1139255 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Snowpacolypse 2010 Device: Too many to count	Heck, I thought it was going to be an editorial on how all the OCR errors and lack of proof reading makes reading stressful. IMO, when it comes to books more is better.

05-18-2010, 10:41 AM	#44
mores Guru Posts: 834 Karma: 102419 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Vienna, Austria Device: iPhone	For me it's hard to judge, since there was a time between the beginning of puberty and 2000 where I did not read for pleasure. It was eBooks that got me back on track and rekindled my joy of reading. One thing that I did notice, however, was that most eBook stores are like huge, HUGE warehouses filled with ALL sorts of books. And almost no directions. You need to sift through everything and figure out how to avoid the trash. Book covers, not just the visuals but also the effort that goes into printing them, do allow you to draw conclusions of their quality. I have given up "browsing" through eBook stores. I buy only what I know I will like. But having a lot of books on my device does not reduce the joy I find in them. I read only a book at a time, and the only thing I might feel is anticipation to start with the next book - which does not make the current book any less enjoyable. And just like a smoker who comes home on saturday night only to realize he's out of cancersticks before the weekend I feel stressed when I'm nearing the end of a good book and realize I don't have anything good to read next. I might have classics or unknown indie books lined up. But sometimes I'm not in the mood to try something new, I feel like there's a void when my favorite authors have not published anything new.

05-18-2010, 10:46 AM	#45
Steven Lyle Jordan Grand Sorcerer Posts: 8,478 Karma: 5171130 Join Date: Jan 2006 Device: none	One of the biggest things to take away here is that, with the significant change in dynamic between available ebooks and consumer tools, comes a need for new and better ways to manage it all, through searching, purchasing (or obtaining), storing, filing, referencing, and just plain enjoying. In other words, everything's different. Going from "familiar" to "different" usually creates some amount of stress, creating emotions ranging from excitement to dread... and in the case of ebooks, most of their aspects are changing, so there are few areas to fall back on as a "familiar" comfort while everything else changes. Many of the biggest sources of contention among ebook consumers and creators can be said to reflect a desire to keep one element or another "the way it was," creating that "familiar" aspect to provide an anchor as everything else changes around it. The fact that we don't all agree on that anchor--be it prices, formats, access, rights, tools, etc--is what causes much of the contention. The best way to deal with it, in most cases, is taking things a step at a time as far as you can... but when everything is changing, you often have to take multiple new steps at once... it's like a waltz dancer learning the electric slide, or all the steps to a Michael Jackson video... and it can take some time before you figure out the steps, and the rhythm, and the changes, and finally jump in and take a few practice steps until you get it. And until you get the steps down, you're too busy concentrating on the effort involved to actually enjoy the dance. Sooner or later, we'll all have the right tools, know where to get books, know how to store and retrieve them on demand, etc, etc. Some of us already have all the tools and methods we need (lucky you!), and some of us are still waiting and working on the tools and methods that will function as desired for us (hand raised). Eventually it'll be second-nature to everyone.

Advert

Advert