How will Amazon counter the new Sony Daily Reader?

[koland]

Isn't the cheaper (new) sony a 5" screen as well. So, the same price as a Kindle 1 (still available at Amazon), but thinner and with a smaller screen, no keyboard and no wireless and less selection. It doesn't really compete at all with the K2, if only due to the size, let alone the missing features. Seems mainly to be an attempt to capture the ipod crowd (most of whom want a backlit screen, as they have not yet realized the damage from years of using them and have other things to do outside besides reading) or the old palm pilot crowd (or it's aimed at the Japanese market, where the small size will make a huge difference -- they get all the cool, tiny computers there that we never see). The new Daily Reader is a competitor with the K2 - the higher price vs. larger form factor, no touch screen, no library access, but larger book selections (so far) and limited (so far, free) internet access. It really won't replace a DX, as the screen is much too small 7 vs 9.7 is a big difference), but the screen should be bigger than the K2. The question will be, can they solve the problems in adding a touch screen that the 700 had - it adds glare, reduces clarity and contrast (not to mention ends up smudged all the time and probably will scratch more).

Amazon could add tag support in under a day or two (and a week of testing). The field is already supported in the metadata (in the book file and the associated mbp for mobi, they could use the mbp file to non-mobi books, so add a day of extra programming for them to TRULY support the bookmark file's abilities, most of which they ignore, currently), so it's a matter of adding the ability to pick one (or, preferably, more tags) to display on the home page (add two options to show/sort menu - Show All Tags; Select Tags, then display a list of tags and let you pick the ones you want to see) and the ability to add/edit the tags (Menu option: Add/Edit tags; lets you add tags or click on existing ones to edit/delete them

If Amazon wants the DX to be taken seriously in the educational market, they must add some type of categorization support -- this is both the simplest and fastest way to do so, as well as one of the most flexible. Playlists/collections and actual directory folders are both much more limited in use. If you have directories, a book can only exist in one place (unless you have multiple copies, each with it's own separate bookmarks that don't sync). Where to put that young adult paranormal romance? Do I look under Young Adult or Romance to find it? And then I'd probably want sub-folders under Romance, as well as most of the others.

For school use, folders would be adequate. I could dump each class' reading material into a single directory and use subfolders to further organize them. But for readers of fiction, they would be a poor substitute for true categorization. Even non-fiction readers would need to make some compromise decisions (all alphabetically, use library filing system, with it's arbitrary classification of crossover subjects, or what?).

Add to that, that with non-academic reading, we probably want to tag things with "read", "unread", "read next" and such, while still maintaining the other structure we've set up. And who wants to have to be moving the file around physically on the hard drive (which is what folders would entail), drilling into sub-directories to find the new location as we have finished reading a book. Instead, once you read a book, use the menu to edit the tags (I may not want to delete the book, as another reader in the house may not be finished).

[davidspitzer]

The sony 505 was and remains an amazingingly solid reader - the new Daily Edition sounds intriguing but I fear it will suffer the same fate as the 700 and the 600, (I just returned my 600), which is a an apparrent abandonment of readability for a touchscreen. Perhaps if they went with a capactive touch or a sub wacom layer that does not effect contrast and increase apparent reflection.

The selling point for me is contrast, reading angle and battery life for eink. Introducing readers that dimish eink's strongest facet (contrast) does not make sense to me. I like the form factor of the daily and think it could be quite useful but if it uses the same pressure sensitive touch layer on top, I am having difficulty gettign excited about it - I would rather give up touch for the contrast of the 505 or the 300

I think Sony realized the mistake of the 700 and went for a compromise rather then a real solution

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by pshrynk

Sony has folders and I'm sure that RobertB will be coming by soon to tell you that Aztac Readers have folders, as well.

Sony doesn't have folders; it has "Collections" which have to be set by software at the time the books are loaded on the device.

Since I bounce between three computers, only one of which has the Sony software (two have Calibre), and I often load new ebooks on my device using the third computer (at work), I've found the collections to be useless. I sort my ebooks into folders, and try to remember which category they're in. Sometimes I change the metadata to add a prefix so they'll sort together by filename.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Sony doesn't have folders; it has "Collections" which have to be set by software at the time the books are loaded on the device.

Since I bounce between three computers, only one of which has the Sony software (two have Calibre), and I often load new ebooks on my device using the third computer (at work), I've found the collections to be useless. I sort my ebooks into folders, and try to remember which category they're in. Sometimes I change the metadata to add a prefix so they'll sort together by filename.

FWIW you can do Collections with Calibre too.

[oncdoc]

I just wish pdf support was there for the kindle 2. do you think we will ever have it?

[oncdoc]

i may go for the prs 505 if it drops below 200 dollars

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by AnemicOak

FWIW you can do Collections with Calibre too.

I know, but I don't believe I can set them after I've loaded the books onto the Reader, which makes the Collections feature (with either software) much less useful to me.

Let me know if I'm wrong about that--can I use Calibre to tag the books that are already in my PRS-505, or would I have to remove them all, enter them in Calibre, and re-upload to the device?

I keep a few hundred books on my Reader, including many PDFs that aren't normally considered "ebooks" (like court rulings in copyright cases, and bus schedules, and blog entries with comments), and having to move them all around would make collections not worth the hassle.

[TMark]

Looks like price is expected to drop and I'm going to get my hands on that 505 very soon.

[dhcalva]

FWIW, My thoughts on what Amazon should ideally do to secure it's position...

1) Some sort of folder/collections. I nearly bought a Sony 505 just for this feature, but Search gave me an alternative. Also, Search should be able to search 'globally' or just withing a collection/folder. Allow us to 'file' documents on the device itself, not just from a PC.

2) ePub support. This would give them access to a load more free books. Really a no brainer.

3) True PDF support. Really, it would be handy.

4) ADE Support for ePub & PDF. Adobe will obviously license ADE to anyway without many, if any, restrictions on other DRM formats on the device. This would give us access to many more ebooks AND allow people with other ePub devices to migrate to the Kindle. Also, support for some lending libraries that lend ePub or PDF files.

5) Better support for DRMed Mobipocket files with users having to use a 'kludge'. And will give us support for the lending libraries that support Mobipocket.

6) Drop Topaz. Either use DRMed Mobipocket or ADE ePubs in it's place.

7) Landscape mode. It would really help with PDFs.

8) PC/Blackberry/Palm Pre support for reading DRMed files. They own the Stanza app, lets leverage it!

9) More built in font options so we don't have to use hacks to fix it.

I think we can all agree that if Amazon did that, they would handily keep the top spot.

Edit: FYI, My Kindle 2 is en route. Just ordered it today to replace my completely unresponsive Cybook Gen 3.

[Kris777]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Personally, I think the CyBook, Kindle, EZ Reader, Sony are all solid viable devices with very few differences. For what they are designed for, which is reading fiction ebooks any one will work fine. I actually would say they all have more in common than they have differences.

BOb

Agree that CyBook, Kindle, EZ Reader, Sony and jetBook are all solid viable devices

[badbob001]

Like the upcoming Sony 900 / Daily Edition, Amazon should add a landscape two page view.

[juj1n]

Originally Posted by oncdoc

i may go for the prs 505 if it drops below 200 dollars

Originally Posted by TMark

Looks like price is expected to drop and I'm going to get my hands on that 505 very soon.

^ FYI guys Target has dropped the price of their Sony Prs-505 to 195 dollars.

Originally Posted by koland

Isn't the cheaper (new) sony a 5" screen as well. So, the same price as a Kindle 1 (still available at Amazon), but thinner and with a smaller screen, no keyboard and no wireless and less selection. It doesn't really compete at all with the K2, if only due to the size, let alone the missing features. Seems mainly to be an attempt to capture the ipod crowd (most of whom want a backlit screen, as they have not yet realized the damage from years of using them and have other things to do outside besides reading) or the old palm pilot crowd (or it's aimed at the Japanese market, where the small size will make a huge difference -- they get all the cool, tiny computers there that we never see).

If Amazon wants the DX to be taken seriously in the educational market, they must add some type of categorization support -- this is both the simplest and fastest way to do so, as well as one of the most flexible. Playlists/collections and actual directory folders are both much more limited in use. If you have directories, a book can only exist in one place (unless you have multiple copies, each with it's own separate bookmarks that don't sync). Where to put that young adult paranormal romance? Do I look under Young Adult or Romance to find it? And then I'd probably want sub-folders under Romance, as well as most of the others.

For school use, folders would be adequate. I could dump each class' reading material into a single directory and use subfolders to further organize them. But for readers of fiction, they would be a poor substitute for true categorization. Even non-fiction readers would need to make some compromise decisions (all alphabetically, use library filing system, with it's arbitrary classification of crossover subjects, or what?).

Add to that, that with non-academic reading, we probably want to tag things with "read", "unread", "read next" and such, while still maintaining the other structure we've set up. And who wants to have to be moving the file around physically on the hard drive (which is what folders would entail), drilling into sub-directories to find the new location as we have finished reading a book. Instead, once you read a book, use the menu to edit the tags (I may not want to delete the book, as another reader in the house may not be finished).

No one wants the Kindle 1 anymore that thing is an abomination to look at, you can only get it second hand, and the controls are not intuitive plus it only has 4 shades of gray. As for k2 competition, the sony prs-600 would be the most likely candidate. No one cared for the side lighting in the 700 so it was removed accordingly. Despite it not having wireless connection to a dedicated store, the main selling point for sony readers is that they use somewhat of an open system and natively support multiple formats. Most of the people that steer away from the kindle are those who hate DRM and don't want to buy books that can only be read on one device. With sony readers you have options aside from the sony store. May not be as convenient but still an option nonetheless. Honesty I tried the 600 and didn't like it because the clarity wasn't as sharp as the 505 or kindle 2 because of the touch screen but that only becomes apparent via comparison. If the 600 was the only ereader you've ever used, you'd probably never notice it.

As for the DX in educational settings, it already got it's first failing grade. The kindle DX was said to be a "poor excuse of an educational tool" by a student in a test pilot using the kindle in replacement of textbooks. IMHO it will never replace textbooks because you can't have multiple books open at the same time and jump between pages rapidly. It also isn't as easy to annotate or highlight... I love ereaders but I don't think they will ever replace textbooks anytime soon.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/28/k...-in-princeton/

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by juj1n

No one wants the Kindle 1 anymore that thing is an abomination to look at, you can only get it second hand, and the controls are not intuitive plus it only has 4 shades of gray.

I just got another one. And since it was refurbished (not second hand), it came with the 1 year warranty.

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by juj1n

No one cared for the side lighting in the 700 so it was removed accordingly.

An opinion concerning the 700 is one thing, but a plainly wrong declarative statement such as this is just nonsense.

The sidle lighting (and the touch interface) was the main reason I purchased the 700 and the reason I still use it rather than my 505.

[orion2001]

Originally Posted by juj1n

As for the DX in educational settings, it already got it's first failing grade. The kindle DX was said to be a "poor excuse of an educational tool" by a student in a test pilot using the kindle in replacement of textbooks. IMHO it will never replace textbooks because you can't have multiple books open at the same time and jump between pages rapidly. It also isn't as easy to annotate or highlight... I love ereaders but I don't think they will ever replace textbooks anytime soon.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/28/k...-in-princeton/

I agree. I don't see ebooks replacing textbooks anytime soon. Textbooks aren't novels. You don't read them once, front to back and them put them away for a long time only to read it again, front-to-back. I have a whole bunch of my textbooks in PDF format on my PC at home. Despite this, when I have to quickly look things up, or if I am working on a problem (even if I am on my computer) I end up going to my regular textbook instead of the PDF on my PC. This is with a PC with a 24 inch widescreen monitor and all the processing power I will ever need to browse through multiple PDFs. I highly doubt that any E-book reader will replace a textbook. It is much easier to use a physical textbook, flip through pages, jump back to a section you read 10 minutes back, etc... and more so if you are referring to multiple books at the same time.

E-textbooks will be useful if you are in class and can't lug around all your textbooks. But if you are home and working on things, you will always tend to go for a regular textbook rather than a digital one.