Does it matter to Sigil what type of file I start out with?

[Gregg Bell]

My process used to be: Word .doc--> html ("web page filtered" done in Word). Then I open the html in Sigil. It's worked great. But now I'm using LibreOffice to compose. But will my .odt (still not sure how I will convert it to .html or perhaps I'll go straight to epub via Writer2Epub--open to suggestions) work as well as my .doc as a starting point? Are there any technical glitches that come along with using .odt as a starting point?

And on a similar vein of thought. I've like editing in Calibre's Edit Epub program. If I edit there, are there any complications (code-wise or otherwise) when I open that epub in Sigil? Thanks.

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by Gregg Bell

And on a similar vein of thought. I've like editing in Calibre's Edit Epub program. If I edit there, are there any complications (code-wise or otherwise) when I open that epub in Sigil? Thanks.

Yes. There could very well be complications. To be perfectly honest, you're not going to want to go back to Sigil once you've been editing in calibre. Sigil to calibre will be fairly safe, but calibre to Sigil will be fraught with peril.

[eschwartz]

To be specific, Sigil has a long-standing issue with handling   (non-breaking space). calibre handles the problem by converting to unicode characters, Sigil does different things depending which version you use -- and none of them are compatible with each other, though calibre will fix what's left afterward.

[Gregg Bell]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Yes. There could very well be complications. To be perfectly honest, you're not going to want to go back to Sigil once you've been editing in calibre. Sigil to calibre will be fairly safe, but calibre to Sigil will be fraught with peril.

Thanks DiapDealer

[Gregg Bell]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

To be specific, Sigil has a long-standing issue with handling   (non-breaking space). calibre handles the problem by converting to unicode characters, Sigil does different things depending which version you use -- and none of them are compatible with each other, though calibre will fix what's left afterward.

Thanks eschwartz. It's ironic. You hear so many people praising Calibre and at the same time so many people saying it's terrible. But what about my first question. Does it matter whether I start with .doc or .odt? Since I've never had any problems with the process I stated in my op I'm tempted to stay with it (and that means .doc), but, as you know, I've gone Linux so I'm wondering if .odt is going to be just as good as .doc. Thanks.

[eschwartz]

The difference will basically be down to how well written the converter is. Kovid's DOCX conversion with calibre is very well written and produces beautiful output, but uses unique style names which do not make it easier to edit after the fact.

Toxaris' addon for Word and writer2epub both produce EPUBs that many people find useful, but I don't know which one is *better*.

[Gregg Bell]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

The difference will basically be down to how well written the converter is. Kovid's DOCX conversion with calibre is very well written and produces beautiful output, but uses unique style names which do not make it easier to edit after the fact.

Toxaris' addon for Word and writer2epub both produce EPUBs that many people find useful, but I don't know which one is *better*.

Thanks eschwartz. I just read about all these weird hyphenation issues with Calibre (eg. mothe-r) at the ends of lines, and so I'm wanting to stay with Sigil. But am I okay starting with .odt, then say doing the Writer2Epub then to Sigil? I just need a process that works for me (with no booby traps that show up in ereaders once the book is out there).

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by Gregg Bell

Thanks eschwartz. I just read about all these weird hyphenation issues with Calibre (eg. mothe-r) at the ends of lines, and so I'm wanting to stay with Sigil.

Calibre's editor has no more influence on how/where hyphenation occurs than any other editor does. If you're not inserting soft hyphens in the text, or hyphen properties in the CSS (neither of which calibre's editor does automagically BTW), then hyphenation is entirely controlled by the device/app the ebook is being read on.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Calibre's editor has no more influence on how/where hyphenation occurs than any other editor does. If you're not inserting soft hyphens in the text, or hyphen properties in the CSS (neither of which calibre's editor does automagically BTW), then hyphenation is entirely controlled by the device/app the ebook is being read on.

Ixnay on the soft-hypens-ay. BAD.

P.S., Gregg?

Well, it matters if you're tying to use a Tiff file, sure. Otherwise, stop thinking about the GUI, and think only about what's underneath: the HTML. What you are asking here is essentially: Does the color of the car affect the quality of the engine inside it?

And the answer is, no; the color of the car doesn't affect the quality of the engine inside it; in your particular case, the care you take in putting the engine in, in the FIRST place, affects the final quality of the engine when it's output from OO or LO or Word or Pages or Bob's Big-Boy Word Processor.

Right? Styles = CSS. CSS = "how stuff looks." Styles being mapped to ELEMENTS, like paragraphs versus headings versus blockquotes, will affect how the input works. Don't use paragraph styles, designed to "look big" as chapter heads; use HEADER styles. Don't use paragraph styles with double-indents as blockquotes; use blockquotes (if that's available as a style). Use LISTS, not typed stuff, for lists. Numero Uno Big Bookmaker Rule: first think about what it IS; then worry about what it looks like later. THAT, far more than OO versus LO versus Word, etc., will "matter" to Sigil.

IMHO.

Hitch

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Ixnay on the soft-hypens-ay. BAD.

Oh, you'll get no arguments from me.

I was just trying to point out the only ways to affect hyphenation from within the epub itself--and why calibre's editor (or any editor for that matter) simply CAN'T affect hyphenation without employing either of those things.

Unless the language is being set wrong. Doesn't some reading software use the language setting to use the proper hyphenation dictionaries for that language?

[PeterT]

So Hitch, i suppose what you are saying is just WRITE in a strict NOTEPAD type program; NO markup on the text AT ALL, then, when the basic work IS finished, copy the text into the eBook editor of your choice, and do the markups, assigning of styles etc there?

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by PeterT

So Hitch, i suppose what you are saying is just WRITE in a strict NOTEPAD type program; NO markup on the text AT ALL, then, when the basic work IS finished, copy the text into the eBook editor of your choice, and do the markups, assigning of styles etc there?

It would give very clean, well-formatted output!



In all seriousness, though, that is exactly the idea behind markdown.

[PeterT]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

In all seriousness, though, that is exactly the idea behind markdown.

Exactly! (And yes I have used Markdown when coding content for a website a few years back; the site had been coded in a CMS that included markdown as an option for document entry, and when I joined it they were already using markdown.)

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by PeterT

Exactly! (And yes I have used Markdown when coding content for a website a few years back; the site had been coded in a CMS that included markdown as an option for document entry, and when I joined it they were already using markdown.)

I would, if it weren't such a giant pain in the ass to use Markdown. As I've said, more than once, I use Markdown both in my customer service system (150-300/mails/day) and our production management system (literally, thousands of notifications/week), of TWO different kinds (one uses single paired asterisks for italics, and double-asties for bold, the other uses underscores for italics, and single-pair asterisks for bold, different things for headers, bq's, etc....), and it's very tiring to write/use, in my opinion.

is it fine for a few paragraphs? Yes, albeit annoying. Is it a giant paint in the tuchus to use for 100K words? ABSOLUTELY. Would I ever write a book in it? NOT IN THIS OR ANY OTHER LIFETIME.

If one is OCD, and needs that level of visually-reinforced structure, great. I don't. {shrug}. I can create perfectly clean styles in Word, (or RTF and about 10 other formats), output them and get clean content. I don't have to see paragraph tags wrapped around everything. I mean, seriously, folks, think about what you're saying: if you're going to write in markdown, why not just write the damn HTML in the first place? I'm sure that there's some logical reason for that distinction, but I don't see it. it's like...baby-step HTML. Mini-ML. Sheesh, why bother?

P.S.: Yes, guys, I get the humor. You mean well, even if you are completely and utterly wrong. I'll love ya anyway.

Hitch

[Gregg Bell]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Calibre's editor has no more influence on how/where hyphenation occurs than any other editor does. If you're not inserting soft hyphens in the text, or hyphen properties in the CSS (neither of which calibre's editor does automagically BTW), then hyphenation is entirely controlled by the device/app the ebook is being read on.

No, don't use soft hyphens at all in text or CSS. Thanks for the info.