12-05-2015, 07:11 AM | #16 | ||||
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Thanks for this clarification! If the only license other than life+70/CC0 is the CC BY-SA-NC, that would be fine because works of art and entertainment would still be considered as freely licensed under this license (but not works of practical use, non-fiction). The task for me would be to identify the EPUBs under CC BY-SA-NC, so I can download them into a separate directory like “non-commercial-only” in order to make sure that users who have obtained the full collection don't run into some legal trouble. Ideally, the posting guidelines and the copyright notice in the upload posts should reflect that the material can also be under CC BY-SA-NC, and the statement “the copyright holder has given specific permission for distribution” would be less ambiguous (because it sounds like restrictive licensing, at least every user has to assume it because the default is “all rights reserved”).
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If you have the time and interest, you could also consider some of the theoretical background, see Google and the World Brain for instance. I don't want some big company to build such a library to nastily exploit it, I would rather favor the public to take care of it for ourselves. Currently, the downloaded EPUBs are some kind of data pool for me to experiment with EPUBs, to start to read and extract information from them, maybe for automatically generate indexes or PDFs, I'm not so sure about it right now. Especially as around half of the German ones are invalid, so there might be better sources somewhere. Quote:
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12-05-2015, 11:24 AM | #17 | |
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Alex, the site owner, is very concerned about his liability so it is very important to stay within the guidelines for uploads and downloaders need to be responsible for the laws in their country. Dale |
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12-09-2015, 08:25 AM | #18 |
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That's great! This way, the contributions of the uploaders were not only made towards mobileread but towards the community (including readers in particular, but also providers of software services for the library).
Does this mean that there were no legal grounds for the actions against “in 2007, somebody posted mobileread ebooks on the Usenet [...]”, “also in 2011, somebody redistributed ebooks from mobileread gratis [...]” and “in 2015, as a user redistributed the library obtained from my downloader [...]”, but maybe social reasons (staff is always fulfilling the requests of uploaders or something like it)? Or was it because at this time, the e-books weren't checked for their legal status as they are today? Does this mean that “in 2011, it became apparent that somebody sold the e-books [...]” was problematic in legal terms because the CC BY-SA-NC was violated? For “in 2015, one or more individuals uploaded e-books to Kobo Writing Life and sold them [...]”, it doesn't seem the CC BY-SA-NC was already in place from the copyright holders, so which license applied to their original content before that day and how was it violated by the uploader to Kobo Writing Life? Would it be possible to host the library as a downloadable package non-commercially? Is such a mirror something you guys would approve, for instance to save mobileread server resources? I don't think I myself would host such a package for the mere purpose of having other people downloading it, but I can think of extracting the texts and images of valid EPUBs and present or convert them in other formats (web, print), analyzing their contents, providing personal notes (or social reading for them) etc., for which the legal permission would be an absolute requirement, and approval (maybe even support) of uploaders, the community and staff would be important to me, too. You don't have to decide this now, as I'll investigate this topic further regarding the opinions of German uploaders who wanted their files removed from a downloadable package. Update: Can you please tell me which Creative Commons license in particular is accepted besides CC0, is it CC BY-SA-NC, or a different CC license with NC clause? Last edited by skreutzer; 12-14-2015 at 12:27 PM. |
12-13-2015, 01:13 PM | #19 | |
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12-13-2015, 01:17 PM | #20 |
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Of course he can as they are works of individual expression, the question is: do the Posting Guidelines require the uploader to license them freely or to put them into Public Domain (from DaleDe's answer above, I understand: yes).
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12-13-2015, 01:21 PM | #21 |
Unicycle Daredevil
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I know what you think. That's why I was asking Dale.
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12-13-2015, 01:25 PM | #22 |
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Claiming copyright is one thing [1], licensing is another [2].
[1] The right to grant or withhold licenses. [2] Who is actually getting which permissions. Last edited by skreutzer; 12-13-2015 at 01:40 PM. |
12-13-2015, 02:03 PM | #23 |
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My personal opinion would be no, it is not required that copyrighted content uploaded here be released under a CC license. Leaving aside uploads that may have been overlooked, I would say it's OK to upload material as long as you have the copyright holder's permission, and this may be either explicit (the uploader is the copyright holder's, or the copyright holder has somehow approved) or implicit (the material has been published under a non-CC license that, however, allows redistributing it through MR, like some Project Gutenberg translations).
It is true that the Guidelines say "EBooks uploaded to this site must be in the "life+70" public domain, or licensed under a compatible Creative Commons license", but (again my personal opinion) I believe this was not intended to be exclusive of other solutions, as long as it is with the copyright holder's permission. Now, if this sentence in the Guidelines is considered as the final word, then yes, all works should be either PD or CC... but it doesn't say which kind of CC. And that doesn't mean all books in the library automatically comply with these guidelines; we try to make sure there are no "problematic books", but we cannot thoroughly check every upload, we basically trust the uploader's description. |
12-13-2015, 03:00 PM | #24 | ||
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Indeed, therefore I want to know too, if there's a particular CC license required or just “any” (not all of them are libre licenses), and if this is stated somewhere on the site, so uploaders were able to know about it prior to today. As it seems to be hard to find, I might have to look into the EPUBs and try to find out which CC licenses were used up to this point. Quote:
It might be that there wasn't a common understanding of what's accepted and what isn't, and maybe that wasn't an issue before as mobileread can ignore third parties and concentrate on the mere distribution of text towards readers, but the cases in 2007, 2011 and 2015 showed that it would be of help to have some certainty regarding this question, so it hopefully will become clear what can and can't be done in the future. If uploaders interpreted the existing statements differently, we might be stuck with a library which can't realize its full potential, but maybe uploaders did the right thing even if it wasn't explicitly stated. |
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12-13-2015, 03:14 PM | #25 |
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I really don't like the attitude in statements like that. As I said in the German thread, I have nothing against your project per se - you can use my books for it, if you wish - but I am worried that if you keep on pursuing your project with this attitude you are going to change the rules for us uploaders and destroy the character of the library, which is working very nicely and is in no need of any substantial changes. If you want to use it as it is, that's fine by me, but I am going to resist any pressure for changes to suit your project.
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12-14-2015, 03:45 AM | #26 | |||
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12-14-2015, 12:28 PM | #27 |
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This discussion may be of interest as well, therefore I link them together.
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