Problems with Covers on eBooks & Kindle

[mjm101]

Apologies if this has been addressed already. I searched and found people having one of these problems, but not all of them together.

I exported an epub file from InDesign, then cleaned it up in Sigil (removing the 203 cover InDesign creates and streamlining the CSS).

Right now, the epub looks perfect in Nook, Adobe Digital Editions, Calibre, and when using the Firefox Epubreader extension. The book opens to the front cover, and the TOC lists the cover as the first item.

However, in iBooks and in the .mobi file created by the Kindle Previewer, the book opens to the title page and does not list the cover in the TOC.

I know this is a small thing most readers won't notice, but I want it to look the way I want it to look! At the very least, I'd like to understand why it's behaving this way.

Thanks in advance for all assistance.

[eschwartz]

At least on the Kindle, where you start is controlled by the "Text" attribute in the <guide>, Sigil has a semantics menu in the file browser.

However, the Kindle does not consider the cover.jpg to be "part" of the book. You can always add a cover.xhtml in addition to the cover, and set that to "Text",but then you will have two cover images which doesn't look good.

I have no idea about iBooks.

[mjm101]

Thanks for the reply, eschwartz.

I actually do have a cover.xhtml file that points to the image I've marked as the cover through the semantics menu. This seems to take care of the double cover problem, but doesn't explain why Kindle doesn't recognize the file.

Before I knew better, I left the 203.png file InDesign created in the epub file and never had this problem--but I had epub files that were between 5 and 7 Mbs. Now that I use the semantics menu to mark the jpeg file as the cover and then delete the large 203.png file, both Kindle and iBooks open to the title page and don't include "Cover" in the TOC. No idea why that is!

[eschwartz]

If the cover.xhtml is marked as "cover" I am pretty sure kindlegen will strip it out to prevent a double cover.

[mjm101]

Ha, of course. That's the way with ebooks, isn't it? You finally get the file perfect for one device, then another one messes it up! I'll try Kindle & iBooks using a smaller version of the 203.png file Adobe creates and see if that solves the problem. Thanks for the help!

[Tex2002ans]

Originally Posted by mjm101

However, in iBooks and in the .mobi file created by the Kindle Previewer, the book opens to the title page and does not list the cover in the TOC.

This is as eschwartz mentioned... and I too agree with "I have no idea about iBooks."

Kindles should open where the "Text" attribute is marked:

1. Right click the file you want the book to start on.
2. Add Semantics
3. Click on Text.

Now you can repeat 1-3 to double-check that there is a little checkmark next to "Text".

Originally Posted by mjm101

Before I knew better, I left the 203.png file InDesign created in the epub file and never had this problem--but I had epub files that were between 5 and 7 Mbs. Now that I use the semantics menu to mark the jpeg file as the cover and then delete the large 203.png file, [...]

What version of InDesign are you using? And what is this "203.png"? Is that filename of the "original" high resolution cover that you was created for the book?

Anyway, if you don't mind, you can PM/email me a copy and I can take a look and see if I can figure anything out. It could potentially be something annoying that InDesign stuck in the EPUB, that Sigil is not deleting.

My email is: *insert my MobileRead Username* @gmail.com

Originally Posted by mjm101

[...] both Kindle and iBooks open to the title page and don't include "Cover" in the TOC. No idea why that is!

Now, this may be a different beast. It could be you are missing the "Cover" in the toc.ncx file.

Side Note: I personally recommend against including front/backmatter in the TOC (either XHTML file or the ncx). I believe the TOC should easily allow you to jump around the book material (Preface, Introduction, Chapters, Afterword, Appendix, ...). You never really see "Cover", "Title Page", "Copyright page" in a physical book TOC.... and I believe it doesn't fit in an ebook TOC either.

There was some more discussion of frontispieces and other front/backmatter in ebooks in this topic: https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=228927

[mjm101]

Thanks for all the help, Tex.

Originally Posted by Tex2002ans

Kindles should open where the "Text" attribute is marked:

1. Right click the file you want the book to start on.
2. Add Semantics
3. Click on Text.

Now you can repeat 1-3 to double-check that there is a little checkmark next to "Text".

This worked perfectly, thank you! It allowed the book to start at the cover for both Kindle and iBooks, and it even added the cover to the Kindle TOC. It didn't add it to the iBooks TOC, but that doesn't matter, because whenever you bring up the TOC in iBooks, the cover is displayed on the left side.

Originally Posted by Tex2002ans

What version of InDesign are you using? And what is this "203.png"? Is that filename of the "original" high resolution cover that you was created for the book?

Exactly. I'm using InDesign CC, and when you export to ePub, it creates a file called 203.png, a high-res version of the cover that really increases file size. You can export the file to ePub with lower image settings, which helps the file size, but you still end up with two cover files. I haven't heard a compelling reason yet to keep both images, so I've been deleting 203.png and pointing all references toward the original cover image.

Originally Posted by Tex2002ans

Side Note: I personally recommend against including front/backmatter in the TOC (either XHTML file or the ncx). I believe the TOC should easily allow you to jump around the book material (Preface, Introduction, Chapters, Afterword, Appendix, ...). You never really see "Cover", "Title Page", "Copyright page" in a physical book TOC.... and I believe it doesn't fit in an ebook TOC either.

I get what you're saying, but an informal study of the eBooks in my library show that, at least in my genre, most publishers still include Cover, Title Page, Dedication, and Copyright in the eBook TOC, even though they would never do so in a physical book. So, until that standard changes, I'd rather follow convention.

Thanks again for all the help. Such a simple fix, but it seems to be doing the job.

[Hitch]

mjm01:

I don't know what ebooks you have, but I've never seen the "cover" on an ebook TOC, and we've never put it on any ebook TOC in the more than 2K books we've made.

I find having books open on the cover exceedingly annoying, as a reader. The cover has already served its purpose; it lured me to the book, I looked at the LITB for the book and the description, read blurbs, if any, and bought it. If I want to see it again, every reader has a "go to cover" option. I don't need to see it again. I don't know if they've changed this, but for years, the Dresden Files ebooks were distributed coverless.

{shrug}. I'm glad you're happy, but be prepared for the very real possibility that this may NOT work (mobi or iBooks) once it's been through the publishing workflow ("PW") at the retailers. Amazon consistently and routinely changes the SRL (start reading location) to the first page past the TOC, and iBooks sets it at the TOC. The PW is not the upload process; it's what happens AFTER you've uploaded the book, BEFORE it appears for sale, while it's being further processed by Amazon/iBooks (during the "review" period). You may get lucky--but don't count on it, and in the interim, if you had a better place in the book for the TEXT attribute, now it's already been used for the cover, which won't work after Amazon/iBooks changes it.

Hitch

[Tex2002ans]

Originally Posted by mjm101

This worked perfectly, thank you! It allowed the book to start at the cover for both Kindle and iBooks, and it even added the cover to the Kindle TOC. It didn't add it to the iBooks TOC, but that doesn't matter, because whenever you bring up the TOC in iBooks, the cover is displayed on the left side.

Glad to hear that solution worked!

Originally Posted by Hitch

I find having books open on the cover exceedingly annoying, as a reader. The cover has already served its purpose; it lured me to the book, I looked at the LITB for the book and the description, read blurbs, if any, and bought it. If I want to see it again, every reader has a "go to cover" option.

I personally purchase the books for the CONTENT (I don't pay one bit of attention to the covers during purchase)... but AFTER purchase, I prefer the ebook to open at the very beginning (so I can see every little thing that is included).

I guess that is just my error correcting mind at work.... I mean, what if they had a typo in the Title/Copyright Page?

Originally Posted by Hitch

I don't need to see it again. I don't know if they've changed this, but for years, the Dresden Files ebooks were distributed coverless.

I just despise having a "generic" or "no cover". I at least want a higher resolution/quality cover embedded in the book itself.

Example: Where I work, the artist creates original 1800px x 2700px book covers, and they are typically 1MB-8MB. I resize to 800x1200 and embed in the book + pick a JPG compression ~80-95 quality (I try to get the size down to ~300 KB). We also have the original covers available on a site for anyone who is interested in higher quality, and can also resize covers in the future (if requirements at retailers change, next generation ebook formats come out, etc. etc.).

I would at least prefer the cover in the book to not be an extremely compressed JPG (like the kind that gets pulled down from B&N/Amazon using Calibre).

Example: I purchased an EPUB of George R.R. Martin's book, "Busted Flush". Here is a generic cover that was actually in the EPUB:



Here is the compressed version that Calibre pulled from B&N:



And this is a high resolution cover that I grabbed directly off of George R.R. Martin's site:



I purchased the book, I just wish that I could have a cover that is closer to the original cover file!!! I mean, when you purchase a physical book, they don't say:

"Thank you for your purchase, hold on, let me swap out that cover for this tiny cover that fits in your wallet!"

or

"Thank you for your purchase, hold on, let me just swap this cover sleeve with one that just says the book name and author!"

You purchase the ebook, you should get the cover in all of its glory!

[Hitch]

Hey, Tex:

I don't have any issue whatsoever with delivering the cover; as a reader, I'm not that interested in it, post-purchase. As a bookmaker, I'm with you; we embed them in their full glory for our clients.

My real point in the post was the publishing-workflow "gotcha," so s/he knows that may well be coming.

Vis-a-vis corrections/errata: I think you and I had a gab about this at some point in time, here on MR. I absolutely do NOT crack open books and fix them. I try really hard not to see the errors, as that yanks me out of my enjoyable experience. It's harder now (not to see them) than it was 'ere I started this business, but still...I give it the old college try. And mostly, I'm not that interested in the frontmatter (heresy, I know!). I know that authors are horrified to hear it, but I truly don't read the dedication, acknowledgements, etc. Epigraph? Sure. Prologue? Sure. Other stuff? Not so much. ;-) Again: speaking as a reader here, not a bookmaker.

Hitch

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Vis-a-vis corrections/errata: I think you and I had a gab about this at some point in time, here on MR. I absolutely do NOT crack open books and fix them. I try really hard not to see the errors, as that yanks me out of my enjoyable experience. It's harder now (not to see them) than it was 'ere I started this business, but still...I give it the old college try. And mostly, I'm not that interested in the frontmatter (heresy, I know!). I know that authors are horrified to hear it, but I truly don't read the dedication, acknowledgements, etc. Epigraph? Sure. Prologue? Sure. Other stuff? Not so much. ;-) Again: speaking as a reader here, not a bookmaker.

As an author, I'm not at all surprised or horrified. I don't usually read them myself. Then again, you should at least skim enough to make sure the front matter really is worth skipping. For example, if you skip mine, you'll miss a lot of laughs, including a page of quotes like these:

Never before in the history of books has something like this been published. It truly shows what sort of a writer Mr. Gatwood is. In all our years, we have never had this sort of reaction to a book before.
—​The American Society for the Study of ​Subclinical Allergies

I can honestly say that nothing like it has ever been written and, God willing, nothing else ever will be.
—​My editor

We said we would publish this when Duke Nukem Forever®1 shipped. I guess that was a bad call.
—​My publisher

Some stories are elegant in their simplicity. Others are just simple.
—​Anonymous reviewer

It made us want to improve our products to better compete.
—​The vacuum cleaner company down the street

As much as it pains me to say it, some rules were meant to be broken.
—​Author of “Any Idiot Can Write”

This novel has single-handedly contributed more to global warming than any other book in the history of publishing.
—​Guy Montag

I’ve never been more bowled over by a book before.
—​Victim, great book avalanche of 2014

And so on.

Regarding the cover, I like to see the cover when I first open the book. Yes, I ostensibly see the cover before I open it, but only a tiny thumbnail of the cover. I'd like to actually see it at full size. That said, it's strictly a matter of personal preference—there's no right or wrong answer.