Literary Highly Challenging Vote • July 2013

[caleb72]

Originally Posted by medard

You can get Budenbrooks for free at Project Gutenberg in German. I found that trough Google.

Maybe next time it would be easier to check the price of a book first. Anyway, looks like I can contribute some stuff this time. I've read the book some years ago. It took me months.

It's strange. Usually I check all of that in advance, but this time I just assumed that there would be availability in libraries.

I saw the German edition at Gutenberg and I downloaded it. But my German is not strong enough to get me through a book of that size.

[jmilica]

Originally Posted by Bookpossum

Well, I see that Buddenbrooks has won. I'm getting the distinct impression that quite a number of us aren't going to be able to participate in this month's discussion. Should we do a quick head count on who will be able to get hold of the book (at a reasonable cost)?

I'm stuck: I can't get it from my library (actually a network of a number of quite large suburban libraries) as it just isn't in the catalogue, and it seems the only e-book version I can get is in German.

Originally Posted by caleb72

Yeah - I feel like a total heel because I voted for Buddenbrooks based on the fact that it was written by Thomas Mann and I stupidly did no research whatsoever.

When I realised that it was over 700 pages and I wasn't going to be able to get it anywhere unless I spent $14, I was desperately hoping for anything else to win.

Does this mean none of you can get paperbook cheaper than 14$? Or is it only for ebooks? In case it has to be ebook you might want to restrict voting then only to ebook version available under xy price?

[jmilica]

Originally Posted by paola

i beg your pardon, that is ex VAT: the full price is £21.60
http://bookshop.blackwell.co.uk/jsp/...E9780307780959

pity one can't resell it, otherwise you you lucky ones could make a fortune

There is paperback edition on Amazon UK for £6.89
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Buddenbrooks.../dp/0749386479

It does amaze me that so many are finding it unavailable in their local library system. As I have already stated it looks like I will be able to get an ebook from the Free Library of Philadelphia, and in case there is a problem with that I checked my local library resources. There is one copy in the local system and a number of copies available by request from a state wide search. An older translation by H. T. Lowe-Porter on those though.

I was really hoping that Herodotus would win though. With so many seemingly unable to obtain a copy maybe a coup could be staged?

[fantasyfan]

Originally Posted by Bookpossum

Well, I see that Buddenbrooks has won. I'm getting the distinct impression that quite a number of us aren't going to be able to participate in this month's discussion. Should we do a quick head count on who will be able to get hold of the book (at a reasonable cost)?

I'm stuck: I can't get it from my library (actually a network of a number of quite large suburban libraries) as it just isn't in the catalogue, and it seems the only e-book version I can get is in German.

I'm stuck too. There's no way I can get an ebook in English for anything like a reasonable price. I would rather not order a hard copy as by the time it would arrive {and be read} I suspect that the club will have moved on.

So I'll politely opt out of this particular selection--perhaps sometime later on I can give it a try.

[Bookpossum]

Originally Posted by Hamlet53

It does amaze me that so many are finding it unavailable in their local library system. As I have already stated it looks like I will be able to get an ebook from the Free Library of Philadelphia, and in case there is a problem with that I checked my local library resources. There is one copy in the local system and a number of copies available by request from a state wide search. An older translation by H. T. Lowe-Porter on those though.

I was really hoping that Herodotus would win though. With so many seemingly unable to obtain a copy maybe a coup could be staged?

Yes, I was really surprised that it wasn't available to me through the library system, nor as an e-book. I think the options seem to be a very small and select discussion group this month, which is perfectly feasible, or else as Hamlet suggests, a decision is made to go with Herodotus, which came in second. I think that sun surfer needs to make that call.

Originally Posted by fantasyfan

I'm stuck too. There's no way I can get an ebook in English for anything like a reasonable price. I would rather not order a hard copy as by the time it would arrive {and be read} I suspect that the club will have moved on.

So I'll politely opt out of this particular selection--perhaps sometime later on I can give it a try.

Yes, like you fantasyfan, I could try to get a copy through Abebooks, but the time to get it from the UK or wherever and the cost, especially if I want the more modern translation, make it unfeasible for me. So unless there is a decision to go with Herodotus, I'll have to opt out also - sorry.

[issybird]

It would be a shame if most of our group can't participate this month because of price or availability. The discussion is the point. I can see why people were blindsided; who would have imagined that a hundred-year old novel by a Nobelist was impossible to purchase for all practical purposes? And I do think a price of over £20 qualifies as impossible.

As I said upthread, the local university has the hardback, so I'm set. I'm caucusing with the group hoping for a revisit of this issue in the interest of inclusiveness, but it's up to sun surfer. I'm happy to read Buddenbrooks.

[caleb72]

Originally Posted by jmilica

Does this mean none of you can get paperbook cheaper than 14$? Or is it only for ebooks? In case it has to be ebook you might want to restrict voting then only to ebook version available under xy price?

I could get a paperback, but it will generally cost me more than the price I can get for the ebook - even second-hand, unless I was very lucky and stumbled across it randomly somewhere.

The only reason I can get the ebook for $14 is that I can "virtually" live in the U.S. for the sake of the purchase. I don't think I can even get it as an ebook in Australia.

I was hoping the result of the voting would serve to cover up my stupidity - but alas, it's confession time.

There were quite a few votes for Buddenbrooks though. Maybe there are still enough for a lively discussion?

[desertblues]

Originally Posted by issybird

It would be a shame if most of our group can't participate this month because of price or availability. The discussion is the point. I can see why people were blindsided; who would have imagined that a hundred-year old novel by a Nobelist was impossible to purchase for all practical purposes? And I do think a price of over £20 qualifies as impossible.

As I said upthread, the local university has the hardback, so I'm set. I'm caucusing with the group hoping for a revisit of this issue in the interest of inclusiveness, but it's up to sun surfer. I'm happy to read Buddenbrooks.

I can read it for free from Gutenberg in German, that's not the problem.
It would be a shame if the price of an (e)book is an obstacle for the bookclub.

(Not a help for this month...)Would it be better to have a maximum price for an (e) book, say $4-6? There's also second- hand books. I hardly buy new anymore.

[paola]

Originally Posted by desertblues

I can read it for free from Gutenberg in German, that's not the problem.
It would be a shame if the price of an (e)book is an obstacle for the bookclub.

(Not a help for this month...)Would it be better to have a maximum price for an (e) book, say $4-6? There's also second- hand books. I hardly buy new anymore.

I opted for a pbook from my library, in Lowe-Porter's translation: I'll have to do without the dialect

More in general, however, I agree that we should have thought about this before hand: I do think this is what we generally do, this time with the Buddenbrooks in particular we were a bit hasty. May it be worth that a condition for nomination is indication of where to get the book from? So even when voting people may take availability/price into consideration.

Again, up to sunsurfer to decide.

[fantasyfan]

Originally Posted by paola

May it be worth that a condition for nomination is indication of where to get the book from? So even when voting people may take availability/price into consideration.
Again, up to sunsurfer to decide.

Yes, I think that is worth considering--it is done in the other club. In fairness, we have previously taken a decision to select a book which was available only as a pb in the case of Turn, Magic Wheel, and a very fine choice it was--but we knew that there was a problem with ebook formatting beforehand. I nominated Wide Sargasso Sea which again {astonishingly!} is not available as an ebook and I stated that in the nomination process.

So I personally feel that Paola's idea of stating the format and price in advance (if possible by providing a link) is a good one--and, of course, that Sunsurfer has the final say.

[issybird]

Originally Posted by fantasyfan

So I personally feel that Paola's idea of stating the format and price in advance is a good one--but I accept that Sunsurfer has the final say.

No disrespect intended, but I put myself in the camp that says we're all big kids and should check availability for ourselves before voting. Given the international membership here, one person's checking what s/he can get may be irrelevant to the membership at large. And I say that as a sinner myself; I know I cited how cheap Herodotus in the best translation was at Amazon, but I didn't check anyplace other than the US of A. And kicked myself for being insensitive after.

I'm essentially indifferent this month. I would hate for the bulk of the membership to be excluded, but I'm good to go with Buddenbrooks (or will be, once I get to the library). Depending on how sun surfer calls it, I'd like to say that the Lowe-Porter translation isn't unreadable and perhaps people would be willing to consider picking up a cheap paperback/library pbook. Always assuming these are available options!

[Bookpossum]

Yes, I agree that it's up to each of us to check it out, especially as there are big variations in availability and/or price in different parts of the world.

I'll certainly learn from this one not to assume that a book will be available just because it's by a famous author, and will check in the future before I vote. Also of course the rules are different in various parts of the world on whether a book is public domain or not. Here in Australia the rules changed some time ago, so we have for authors who died up to and including 31 December 1954 a rule of death plus 50 years. For any who died from 1 January 1955 onwards, it's death plus 70 years. As Mann died in 1955, that rules him out of being in the public domain until 2025, for Australians at least.

sun surfer - are you there? How do you want to call this one?

[caleb72]

I agree with issybird and Bookpossum. It should be up to us to be responsible - which is why I'm quite dark on myself this time around - I should have known better than to assume anything.

I've got a three books I need to read first anyway, so it would take me a while to contribute. So I'll see what I can find in the meantime. Given that my vote helped put this book in the lead I should at least make an effort.

[Bookpossum]

Originally Posted by caleb72

I agree with issybird and Bookpossum. It should be up to us to be responsible - which is why I'm quite dark on myself this time around - I should have known better than to assume anything.

I've got a three books I need to read first anyway, so it would take me a while to contribute. So I'll see what I can find in the meantime. Given that my vote helped put this book in the lead I should at least make an effort.

There, there, don't feel bad. We all did the same thing.