07-16-2014, 12:32 PM | #31 |
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Not necessarily surprising. The law was voted, but the 'décret d'application' probably has not gone through yet. The FNAC web site has always been much slower to adapt to anything then Amazon's, so I guess changes will come a tad later.
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07-16-2014, 08:21 PM | #32 |
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Checking tonight on the two biggest French eBook sites:
www.fnac.com is abiding by the letter and intent of the new law. You can buy a paper book at full price with free shipping, or at 5 percent off in one of their physical stores. www.amazon.fr is still selling at 5 percent off with the nose-thumbing shipping fee of 1 centime. Last edited by SteveEisenberg; 07-16-2014 at 10:29 PM. |
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07-16-2014, 09:27 PM | #33 | |
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Breaking News! Everyone is obeying the law. |
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07-17-2014, 05:14 AM | #34 | |
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How do you know that?
Ninjalawyer said: Quote:
So do you actually know how the law works in France? Some people do not write were they live so it is hard to know. But to me it seems to be a lot people here assuming the law must work as in the US. |
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07-17-2014, 06:32 AM | #35 |
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07-17-2014, 06:36 AM | #36 |
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Maybe it depends what book you check, but this morning Amazon.fr seems to have gone discount-free, while still charging the cent for shipping. So www.fnac.com is, at least momentarily, a centime cheaper. Here is an example:
http://recherche.fnac.com/SearchResu...0&submitbtn=OK http://www.amazon.fr/En-finir-avec-E...zg_bs_books_38 Could it be the Amazon has decided their policy of a day ago had too much legal or political risk? Or it is just that they periodically change prices? I'll be checking again to see if the discount comes back. |
07-17-2014, 09:43 AM | #37 | |
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It may be that there are places where the "intent" of the law is enforceable, but I don't really consider that to be lawful. I cannot imagine the horror of living in a place where the "law" is that arbitrarily dependent on whatever the politicians say it is -- and then have it apply retroactively. If they can explain the intent in court proceedings, they should've used that explanation as the text of the law. |
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07-17-2014, 09:55 AM | #38 |
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07-17-2014, 10:00 AM | #39 |
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07-17-2014, 12:13 PM | #40 | |
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07-17-2014, 08:18 PM | #41 |
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Amazon Has Stopped Nose Thumbing
Here's Amazon FAQ on the law:
https://www.amazon.fr/gp/help/custom...deId=201360370 Here's the law: http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affich...XT000029210814 Here's what I believe happened: A law went into effect commonly interpreted as giving businesses that ship books a choice between selling at a 5 percent discount, and offering free shipping. One, or the other -- not both. My high school French isn't good enough for me to offer my own interpretation of the legal text, but this is consistent with what I just wrote: samhy, Post #35, this thread and: http://www.france24.com/en/20140109-...all-retailers/ For the first couple days after the legislation came into effect on 8 July, Amazon indeed both offered the 5 percent discount and shipped at the virtually free price of one Euro cent. The is the nose thumbing of our thread title. However, several days later, Amazon backed down. A continuing reminder of Amazon's days of rage last week is the one centime shipping fee. As far as I can see, it's unnecessary by any interpretation of the law, and puts Amazon's price for a shipped book one cent higher than the competition. If my understanding is correct, Amazon will, I predict, drop the one cent charge in coming days. For years to come, Amazon's French government critics, who do in fact exist, will look back on those few days last week as proof of Amazon's arrogance. But unless I am missing something (and I may, since I'm not sure how Amazon promotions fit with the law ), the middle finger waving is over. Last edited by SteveEisenberg; 07-17-2014 at 08:24 PM. |
07-18-2014, 04:31 AM | #42 | |
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When some sellers, including but not limited to Amazon, started free shipping in addition to the 5% discount it has been seen as a bigger discount and one that can't be matched by brick and mortar shops if they don't ship books. So in the end, this is a way to preserve the independent bookstores. Those are only facts, not my personal views |
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07-18-2014, 09:54 PM | #43 |
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I'm not surprised; just the latest example of the French gov meddling in the marketplace to protect their aging books-and-mortar bookstore lobby.
Didn't we see something like this a few months ago? The public must be all for it if they elected the gov, but, personally, I'd object to it as a "tax on nostalgia" |
07-19-2014, 12:49 AM | #44 |
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07-19-2014, 05:29 AM | #45 |
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Ninjalawyer gave the benefit of his opinion which is generally correct in common law jurisdictions. Intent of the legislature may become relevant in a very limited fashion if it is required to resolve an ambiguity in the wording of the legislation concerned. If there is no ambiguity, the question never arises.
However, Ninjalawyer's comments were limited to Common law jurisdictions, as are my own. France is, of course, a civil law jurisdiction and I am not familiar with its rules of interpretation. I do, however, note eschwartz's comment with approval. That is: "It may be that there are places where the "intent" of the law is enforceable, but I don't really consider that to be lawful. I cannot imagine the horror of living in a place where the "law" is that arbitrarily dependent on whatever the politicians say it is -- and then have it apply retroactively. If they can explain the intent in court proceedings, they should've used that explanation as the text of the law." |
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