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Old 08-13-2011, 12:17 PM   #106
elcreative
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May have misinterpreted you in that case but "Joneses" now has more than one meaning especially round here where people have alluded to Apple and Kool Aid in the same posting...

I would also say that keeping in with the trends isn't exactly an Apple only philosophy... try any modern successful brand/company... isn't that what being successful is about in business terms...
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Old 08-13-2011, 12:43 PM   #107
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So, I actually got around to trying the cloud reader... It's fairly nice. I'll be something I maybe use at work when I leave my actual Kindle at home.
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Old 08-13-2011, 12:50 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elcreative
I would also say that keeping in with the trends isn't exactly an Apple only philosophy... try any modern successful brand/company... isn't that what being successful is about in business terms...
Exactly. I agree entirely. That's why I said;
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or the large scale success of any electronic gadget for that matter
My only beef is stonetools' assumption that the "most successful" somehow equates to easiest/most intuitive user interface/experience. iPhones may very well be "the most intuitive interface" out there, I don't know. But I certainly wouldn't base that kind of subjective opinion solely on the number of units being sold.
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Old 08-13-2011, 02:41 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by BuddyBoy View Post
I don't believe iOs YET supports the full Bluetooth headphone protocol - last time I paired my headset I couldn't advance or rewind tracks, despite it being part of the standard and the buttons to do so being on my headphones.
If you are talking about AVRCP support, it has been there for almost a year.

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I'm not sure if there are any statistics to support a theory I have, but when you look at the sales of Apple products, and the significant (in a statistical sense) amount of user griping just on Apples own support forums, you begin to see that they may have the largest group of unsatisfied adopters. It's a weird metric because many of these folks like some aspect of the product, and most don't generally dislike it enough to abandon it, but just the same, they're dissatisfied with the way Apple treats them, and addresses their concerns.
Let's compare your theory to published customer satisfaction reports:

Smartphones:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/...entry_id=85740
Quote:
For the fifth time in a row, Apple scored the highest in customer satisfaction among smartphone makers, J.D. Power and Associates said in its annual study.
(5th time in a row is significant in that Apple has only made smartphones for 5 years)
Computers:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20...action-survey/
Quote:
Consumers who opt for Apple computers are the most satisfied among all PC buyers, according to a report released today by the Temkin Group.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/apple-...-improve/39420
Quote:
Apple continues its dominance, leading the PC category by a wide margin for the seventh straight year. Customer satisfaction with Apple’s computer products, including the iPad, rose 2% to an ACSI of 86—the highest score ever for Apple. The company now has a 9-point lead over its nearest competitor. No other company in the ACSI has as formidable a lead within its own industry. Innovation and product diversification, along with strong customer service, have long been at the center of Apple’s success.
What is weird about those metrics?

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Granted, aspects of that happen with many firms too, but what seems to make Apple unique is the cadre of die-hard users who turn up when Apple pees on us, and loudly proclaim, with great joy, that it's raining apple juice.
Not unique at all-any more so than the die-hard non-Apple users who loudly proclaim, with great joy, how unsatisfied those Apple users are.
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Old 08-13-2011, 06:23 PM   #110
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Just tried the KCR. Seems pretty smooth. I have not tried the offline mode, but if it is as smooth, then its a nice user experience.Its a good backup to the native app, IMO.
I expect B&N and Kobo web apps before too much longer
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Old 08-13-2011, 10:51 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by BuddyBoy View Post
No one will ever accuse Steve Jobs of playing well with others.
True enough.

But Steve is an artist. He has an artistic vision for the products Apple makes. A true artist follows his muse. But people don't expect a business to follow a muse, so they don't grasp the concept.

Apple is not IBM. Apple is Van Gogh...
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:00 PM   #112
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But Apple's mp3 players are a classic case in point. Why on earth would the average user prefer these products that had poorer battery life, smaller storage capacity and poorer sound quality than well-known and often cheaper competing brands?
Because they just work.

That is, Apple products are not "technology." They disappear into the environment. Like light bulbs. Like the old wired telephones did. Like the faucets in your kitchen. Like automatic transmission.

The Kindle does that, too.
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:02 PM   #113
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We are all geeks now. I think even now, though, kids will find Macs easier to learn than the Linux. Certainly, adults still do.
Adults, yes. Kids, no. Kids can learn anything. I know. I used to be older...
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:04 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
Sure it's possible. And as long as you can admit to the very same possibility, we can each go our own happy way.

BTW... why would you assume that hundreds of millions of units sold automatically equates to best/easiest/most intuitive interface? By that logic, Windows would be the most intuitive/easiest O.S. available... I'm pretty sure neither of us thinks that that is in any way true.
I was just thinking about that. Apple products don't start out intuitive. Somehow they become intuitive.
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Old 08-14-2011, 04:28 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjk View Post
If you are talking about AVRCP support, it has been there for almost a year.



Let's compare your theory to published customer satisfaction reports:

Smartphones:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/...entry_id=85740

(5th time in a row is significant in that Apple has only made smartphones for 5 years)
Computers:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20...action-survey/

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/apple-...-improve/39420


What is weird about those metrics?


Not unique at all-any more so than the die-hard non-Apple users who loudly proclaim, with great joy, how unsatisfied those Apple users are.
I'm happy to hear AVRCP fully supported now - when they initially introduced it, they didn't support the full protocol, so, as I said, things like skip, rewind, etc didn't work. I'll have to give it a try again. Odd, though, that you say it's been working for a year. I recall trying it on my iPhone 4 when I bought it last august and it wasn't working then.

And thank you for pointing out those satisfaction surveys. My exposure to apple support and the support forums must have skewed my perspective since I only seem to run into folks who like their apple products but are frustrated with the way they're supported.

And I hope you aren't classing me as a die-hard non-apple user: I have three iPhones, a 3G iPad, and a MacMini.
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Old 08-14-2011, 04:32 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Harmon View Post
Because they just work.


I suggest that the reason that people chose iPods over better competing products that were just as easy to use was because of Apple's brilliant marketing... and you reply with the slogan.

Case proved?

Graham
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Old 08-14-2011, 05:34 AM   #117
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I suggest that the reason that people chose iPods over better competing products that were just as easy to use was because of Apple's brilliant marketing... and you reply with the slogan.

Case proved?

Graham

Well, if the slogan happens to be true, then case NOT proved.

Originally, back in 2001, Ipods really were better and easier to use than competing mp3 players. Over time, the competitors copied the Ipod, feature for feature.
By the time, you got into the market-2005-2008- the competitors caught up with the Ipod in terms of ease of use, and were trying to compete on price. By that time, brand loyalty to Ipods had developed among consumers who knew that Ipods offered the quality, features and usability they wanted, and so they continued to buy them. Researching many different brands costs in terms of time and aggravation, and most consumers were happy to forego that in order to stick with a brand they could be certain of. Also too, Apple's customer service is all by all accounts world class-something that cannot be said of many manufacturers.
All this is a lot more complex than than the "Apple consumers are all sheep" meme so popular out there, of course, which is why folks like you buy into it.
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Old 08-14-2011, 05:49 AM   #118
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How wish every topic here doesn't turn into Apple v/s rest of the world!
Any news on Firefox support of Kindle Cloud Reader especially after the release of Firefox 6? I am not technically proficient so please tell if it won’t have any impact.

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Old 08-14-2011, 06:02 AM   #119
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All this is a lot more complex than than the "Apple consumers are all sheep" meme so popular out there, of course, which is why folks like you buy into it.
Your analysis was spot on up until you made this needless remark. My praising Apple's brilliant marketing does not equate to my calling their customers sheep.

You've made a good point that by capturing a large section of the early market for iPods Apple built up a head of steam that proved unstoppable, even after the competing products caught up with and even surpassed the Apple products.

Apologies, din155, you're right. We have gone way off topic with the mp3 thing. However, it's probably reasonable that some discussion of Apple vs Amazon takes place in this thread because the introduction of the Kindle Cloud Reader does have a bearing on the restrictions placed on the Kindle app on iOS.

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Old 08-14-2011, 07:19 AM   #120
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No need for apologies Graham, this topic was always heading there... Just that it gets bit annoying when the actual topic doesn't get any further. I am happy that Amazon came out with cloud reader. Here is a hope that they provide support for the other browsers as well.
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