Beware of Amazon CS accidental misinformation.

[Josieb1]

Originally Posted by knauck

Well then you'd be incorrect, because previous 3G models have supported free 3G browsing. Like I said, I saw it both ways in different places.

As far as I am aware its only up to and including the Kindle Keyboard that's provides 3G access to the web. I have two Kindle Keyboards and since we bought then the 3G has been limited to 50MB a month. I didn't think any model since offered any 3G outside of the Kindle Store and Wikipedia.

[Haesslich]

Originally Posted by susan_cassidy

If you pay .15 cents a megabyte, and send it to your address@kindle.com email address, instead of the address@free.kindle.com, yes it does work. I do it all the time.

$0.99 if outside the U.S., as Josieb1 is.

Still, the worst part of this mess is that the CS agent was probably searching Amazon.com's help pages... and if you type in Whispernet or 3G Service, the ONLY pages you get are the Kindle DX or Kindle 2nd Generation pages, which give you the statement the CS guy read off. I've tried it before, when searching for info on the PW. The Help pages for the PW just link to the old DX pages when you look for the wireless section.

[knauck]

Originally Posted by Haesslich

$0.99 if outside the U.S., as Josieb1 is.

Still, the worst part of this mess is that the CS agent was probably searching Amazon.com's help pages... and if you type in Whispernet or 3G Service, the ONLY pages you get are the Kindle DX or Kindle 2nd Generation pages, which give you the statement the CS guy read off. I've tried it before, when searching for info on the PW. The Help pages for the PW just link to the old DX pages when you look for the wireless section.

Thank you, it's nice to see someone who has also noticed the conflicting information on Amazon's own website.

[barryem]

Earlier 3G kindles did allow 3G web browsing. I forget if they changed that with the Touch or the Paperwhite but it's no longer true. I think this is fairly widely known and it is stated on the product page pretty plainly.

I can understand your frustration. That product page is so large it's really difficult to read everything on it and it's easy to miss something. I'm sure you're not the first person to make that mistake.

Add to that a poor understanding of a moderately complex issue on the part of the CS rep and it gets more frustrating. You might want to notify Amazon about this. I suspect they'd like to know.

The problem with calling Amazon liars is that they have a long history of dealing honestly with their customers. If you had said this in similar circumstances about any other company it would probably seem like intentional information. But long time Amazon customers have had too many experiences with them going out of their way to keep us happy.

For example, when I lent my older Kindle to a neighbor so she could read a book she returned it with the screen badly scratched. It was still in warranty but this obviously wasn't a defect and I had no thought of getting a warranty replacement. I called and explained the circumstances, hoping for a discount on a replacement, but they said no discount. They'll just replace it under warranty. I explained again that it was damaged by someone mistreating it but the CS rep insisted that she wanted to replace it. And she overnighted the replacement even though I said there was no rush. I was reading on my Paperwhite.

When you get this kind of treatment over and over and over and they make a mistake at some point, it looks like a mistake where it might look like intentional misleading from some other company.

Also, what you did get, while it may not meet your needs, is an excellent ereader at a great price. And if it won't do, it's the easiest thing in the world to return.

Barry

Had the OP read much here on MR he would have known the 3G on a Paperwhite was extremely limited and he would have known that using the Chat service at Amazon Support is never a good idea. Those Chat guys are from India, know nothing about the products, cannot communicate well in English--they are outsourced contractors without a clue!

All that aside though, the OP appears to just want to be hostile. I have no sympathy for him though as it is obvious he just wanted something for free. That is, he thought he could buy a fairly inexpensive Paperwhite 3G and have FREE unlimited internet access without having to pay a cellular company for data. Why on earth would Amazon provide free unlimited data?!? I think Amazon got burned on the KKB 3G models and quickly learned they had provided way more service than they wanted to pay for and did away with that on all subsequent Kindles.

[knauck]

Originally Posted by jswinden

Had the OP read much here on MR he would have known the 3G on a Paperwhite was extremely limited and he would have known that using the Chat service at Amazon Support is never a good idea. Those Chat guys are from India, know nothing about the products, cannot communicate well in English--they are outsourced contractors without a clue!

All that aside though, the OP appears to just want to be hostile. I have no sympathy for him though as it is obvious he just wanted something for free. That is, he thought he could buy a fairly inexpensive Paperwhite 3G and have FREE unlimited internet access without having to pay a cellular company for data. Why on earth would Amazon provide free unlimited data?!? I think Amazon got burned on the KKB 3G models and quickly learned they had provided way more service than they wanted to pay for and did away with that on all subsequent Kindles.

You are correct about one thing, my first reaction is hostility towards companies that say one thing and deliver another. You are also correct that I have not read much on this forum before buying - I apologize, I was unaware that I was required to read a forum on some corner of the internet before buying a product. Also, in case you did not realize this, you pay an extra $60 for the 3G capable model, so by definition the 3G is not 'free'. The fact that you skipped over the part of my post mentioning my reasoning and desire for a connection is hardly shocking. You appear to enjoy belligerence more than you claim I do. You also appear to have not read the post that another member wrote about Calibre and a workaround for me.

So instead of contributing a useful post to this discussion, you talked trash and there was no value added.

[knauck]

Originally Posted by barryem

Earlier 3G kindles did allow 3G web browsing. I forget if they changed that with the Touch or the Paperwhite but it's no longer true. I think this is fairly widely known and it is stated on the product page pretty plainly.

I can understand your frustration. That product page is so large it's really difficult to read everything on it and it's easy to miss something. I'm sure you're not the first person to make that mistake.

Add to that a poor understanding of a moderately complex issue on the part of the CS rep and it gets more frustrating. You might want to notify Amazon about this. I suspect they'd like to know.

The problem with calling Amazon liars is that they have a long history of dealing honestly with their customers. If you had said this in similar circumstances about any other company it would probably seem like intentional information. But long time Amazon customers have had too many experiences with them going out of their way to keep us happy.

For example, when I lent my older Kindle to a neighbor so she could read a book she returned it with the screen badly scratched. It was still in warranty but this obviously wasn't a defect and I had no thought of getting a warranty replacement. I called and explained the circumstances, hoping for a discount on a replacement, but they said no discount. They'll just replace it under warranty. I explained again that it was damaged by someone mistreating it but the CS rep insisted that she wanted to replace it. And she overnighted the replacement even though I said there was no rush. I was reading on my Paperwhite.

When you get this kind of treatment over and over and over and they make a mistake at some point, it looks like a mistake where it might look like intentional misleading from some other company.

Also, what you did get, while it may not meet your needs, is an excellent ereader at a great price. And if it won't do, it's the easiest thing in the world to return.

Barry

Thank you for your insight. The product page is indeed cramped and quite overloaded with mostly useless marketing 'information'.

I changed the verbiage in my original post to "Accidental Misinformation" instead of "Lies" due to your post. I have had no experience with Amazon in the past. I have had far too many bad experiences with other web based retailers over the years to let me believe that this was actually as accident initially.

I talked with CS again and they were indeed apologetic to hear of the mistake when they saw it in the chat log. They offered a full refund with return shipping.

I have actually decided that even with the limited 3G it will be better than my first PW, because being able to download books on the fly is still a big plus. Not sure if it's worth the $60, but I'll keep it anyway =). I also realized that I can tether it to the data connection on my company iPhone via wifi and read my email/news that way.

PS:Why are there so many flamers on this board?

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by knauck

PS:Why are there so many flamers on this board?

Are you talking about this thread or in general?

I see a few may have disagreed with you, but no flaming. Your post aroused my curiosity so I looked back through the posts. Where are these many flaming posts if you would be so kind. (each post is numbered)

Helen

[TimW]

Originally Posted by knauck

Thank you for your insight. The product page is indeed cramped and quite overloaded with mostly useless marketing 'information'.

I changed the verbiage in my original post to "Accidental Misinformation" instead of "Lies" due to your post. I have had no experience with Amazon in the past. I have had far too many bad experiences with other web based retailers over the years to let me believe that this was actually as accident initially.

I talked with CS again and they were indeed apologetic to hear of the mistake when they saw it in the chat log. They offered a full refund with return shipping.

I have actually decided that even with the limited 3G it will be better than my first PW, because being able to download books on the fly is still a big plus. Not sure if it's worth the $60, but I'll keep it anyway =). I also realized that I can tether it to the data connection on my company iPhone via wifi and read my email/news that way.

PS:Why are there so many flamers on this board?

"Why are there so many flamers on this board?"

There was a fair amount of flame in your provocative heading "Beware of Amazon misinformation/lies!" to get some flames in reaction. I'm more concerned with this statement:

I also realized that I can tether it to the data connection on my company iPhone via wifi and read my email/news that way.

That's a violation of your Kindle Terms of Service. Quoting from the ToS:

Your Conduct. You may use the wireless connectivity provided by us only in connection with the Service as permitted by this Agreement. You may not use the wireless connectivity for any other purpose.

Termination. Your rights under this Agreement will automatically terminate if you fail to comply with any term of this Agreement. In case of such termination, Amazon may immediately revoke your access to the Service without refund of any fees. Amazon's failure to insist upon or enforce your strict compliance with this Agreement will not constitute a waiver of any of its rights.

That could result in the termination of your account and any access to digital content you've may have purchased. Illicit tethering is a big reason why Amazon hasn't offered a reader with unlimited 3G browsing since the K3.

[knauck]

Originally Posted by speakingtohe

Are you talking about this thread or in general?

I see a few may have disagreed with you, but no flaming. Your post aroused my curiosity so I looked back through the posts. Where are these many flaming posts if you would be so kind. (each post is numbered)

Helen

Perhaps flamer is not the right word. I am not much of an internet citizen, but I heard a colleague describing people who start crap or say obviously incorrect things on IRC or boards as flamers and trolls.

#6 and #7 are patently incorrect and obviously do not address the real subject matter. #20 is clearly un-called for.

[knauck]

Originally Posted by TimW

"Why are there so many flamers on this board?"

There was a fair amount of flame in your provocative heading "Beware of Amazon misinformation/lies!" to get some flames in reaction. I'm more concerned with this statement:



That's a violation of your Kindle Terms of Service. Quoting from the ToS:





That could result in the termination of your account and any access to digital content you've may have purchased. Illicit tethering is a big reason why Amazon hasn't offered a reader with unlimited 3G browsing since the K3.

I said tethering FROM my iPhone TO my kindle. Using my IPHONE'S internet connection. Why is that confusing? There is nothing against ToS there.

Also, my thread title is directed towards Amazon. I said nothing negative about a user here. If some few people here believe it's their duty to defend Amazon in light of chat logs that clearly put them in the wrong, then there's an issue with them. Not me.

[ixtab]

Originally Posted by TimW

That's a violation of your Kindle Terms of Service.

No, it's not. He's using the iPhone's 3G to give the Kindle connectivity, not the other way around.

[TimW]

Originally Posted by knauck

I said tethering FROM my iPhone TO my kindle. Using my IPHONE'S internet connection. Why is that confusing? There is nothing against ToS there.

Also, my thread title is directed towards Amazon. I said nothing negative about a user here. If some few people here believe it's their duty to defend Amazon in light of chat logs that clearly put them in the wrong, then there's an issue with them. Not me.

My apologies. I read it several times to see if I was reading it correctly. When I've read of people using the term "tethering" in conjunction with a 3G Kindle, it's usually the other way.

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by knauck

Perhaps flamer is not the right word. I am not much of an internet citizen, but I heard a colleague describing people who start crap or say obviously incorrect things on IRC or boards as flamers and trolls.

#6 and #7 are patently incorrect and obviously do not address the real subject matter. #20 is clearly un-called for.

Thanks for the reply.
I see it as post 6 trying to help even if misguided.
Post 7 as reacting too quickly in a defensive manner to something they found offensive whether intended that way or not.

Post 20 was snarky and uncalled for but still not flaming. And to be fair the big red letters and you have been warned in the first post will set of an adverse reaction in many who will see you as perhaps being a bit arrogant and presumptuous in issuing such a stentorian warning about something that most are aware of already. (customer service people are often misinformed or unknowledgeable).

Overall I think you have had a kind reception by most but I can understand your dismay if you have been lucky enough to have never encountered bad service before.

Good luck with getting every thing mostly settled to your satisfaction, and I am sure you will.

Helen

[knauck]

Originally Posted by TimW

My apologies. I read it several times to see if I was reading it correctly. When I've read of people using the term "tethering" in conjunction with a 3G Kindle, it's usually the other way.

Ok. I'd never do something against the ToS that's also morally wrong. I have done a little research on the webkit, and by doing a couple relatively uncomplicated steps, one could theoretically use the 3G connection to surf. The fact that I (believe I) can do it definitely does not mean I would. I never would have jailbroken my iphone until the US supreme court ruled that it was legal, for instance.