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Old 11-09-2013, 12:11 AM   #46
Xanthe
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I truly don't see how selling kindles in a paper book store will cut down on paper book sales. It is not like kindles can't be bought elsewhere.
You buy an ebook reader, you start buying ebooks. You get used to reading on an ereader because, say for instance, you don't have to deal with fonts that are too small or too light, and you stop buying paper books because with them you have to deal with those issues. I know that the amount of paper books that I have purchased over, say, the last five years, has steadily decreased while my ebook purchases have increased.

The independent booksellers are right to view the deal with Amazon as something that will eventually bite them in the...posterior.

I just was gifted with a paper book from a friend that has a lot of pages with earth-toned type on earth-toned pages. It looks pretty but my older eyes can no longer adjust to read something like that without straining.
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Old 11-09-2013, 12:21 AM   #47
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You buy an ebook reader, you start buying ebooks. You get used to reading on an ereader because, say for instance, you don't have to deal with fonts that are too small or too light, and you stop buying paper books because with them you have to deal with those issues. I know that the amount of paper books that I have purchased over, say, the last five years, has steadily decreased while my ebook purchases have increased.
I understand that, but I don't think people are just going to start buying ereaders because a bookstore is selling them. It is not like they will gravitate to the gadget counter and start oohing and saying I gotta have me one of those just because they are in a paper book store.

I doubt the sales would be that big, but if a regular customer is happier buying one for themselves or as a gift at their favorite bookstore then the store might make a few bucks as opposed to the zero bucks they would make if the customer went to Amazon or one of the many outlets already selling them.

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Old 11-09-2013, 10:45 AM   #48
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My point was, though, that even though the sales might not be large that is going to be one customer who will eventually be lured away from visiting the physical bookstore by the simple ease of doing searches online and downloading ebooks.

I used to visit a bookstore or check out the physical book aisle in the local supermarket or dept store at least weekly. Now I don't even bother with that. I'm talking about a lifetime habit changed in only a few years because of the ownership and convenience of an ereader.

Now multiply that by customer after customer with slowly aging eyes who decides to give an ereader a try because of the adjustable fonts, and your customer base slowly erodes.

So they may make a little money upfront, but I'm sure Amazon has the stats to prove that after about two years they will own that customer, which is why the deal is structured the way it is.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:55 AM   #49
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I don't disagree, I think though, that if they are going to be lured, they are going to be lured by someone. And if they are firmly against then they will most likely stay that way.

I do think that it is mostly going to benefit Amazon though.


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Old 11-09-2013, 11:19 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by speakingtohe View Post
I don't disagree, I think though, that if they are going to be lured, they are going to be lured by someone. And if they are firmly against then they will most likely stay that way.

I do think that it is mostly going to benefit Amazon though.


Helen
People likely to buy a Kindle are likely to buy it anyway, anywhere they find it.
If it's not the bookstores it'll be Best Buy or Office Max/Depot or staples or it will be Amazon directly. Saying no only means *they* get nothing and Amazon gets everything. Or, somebody else gets the sale and the recurring kickbacks.

The biggest benefit to Amazon is going to be that the bookstores are publicly and vociferously refusing to do business with them. And that the program is open to *all* small businesses, not just bookstores.
I can see newstands, gas stations, small town retailers, possibly even churches and community groups going with Amazon Source. Any of the thousands of businesses with paperback racks would be well advised to replace/supplement them with Kindle kiosks. Especially as the first order is risk free.

Last edited by fjtorres; 11-09-2013 at 11:22 AM.
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Old 11-09-2013, 08:15 PM   #51
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I am a big fan of Kindle books, but I still have lots of hardcover books as well. In my case specifically, as a religious Jew I cannot read on an electronic device during the Sabbath. (Yes I know that's today, but it's over at sunset which was a while ago.) Not only that, but a large part of my reading is done on the Sabbath, so kindles will never push away paper books for me. What they will do is complement them.

I would absolutely buy all my kindles from my local independent bookstore, if they offered it. I love them and get all my paper books from them, they're really helpful, and I would love to support them. And when I need to buy a new Kindle, I'd buy that from them too. So they'd keep renewing their benefits, since Amazon has said their 10% offer is for kindle upgrades as well.

Either way, I would be getting a Kindle and buying just as many books. The question is, where from?
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:17 PM   #52
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24868137

Quote:
"Hmmm, let's see," wrote Carole Horne from Harvard Book Store in Massachusetts.

"We sell Kindles for essentially no profit, the new Kindle customer is in our store where they can browse and discover books, the new Kindle customer can then check the price on Amazon and order the e-book.

"We make a little on their e-book purchases, but then lose them as a customer completely after two years. Doesn't sound like such a great partnership to me."

Staff at Skylight Books in California said it was "a Trojan Horse-style attempt to gain access to our customers".
I do very much agree with this. Shame on you Amazon.
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:50 PM   #53
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"We make a little on their e-book purchases, but then lose them as a customer completely after two years..."
There's nothing like being able to predict the future.
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:52 PM   #54
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Quote:
"Hmmm, let's see," wrote Carole Horne from Harvard Book Store in Massachusetts.

"We sell Kindles for essentially no profit, the new Kindle customer is in our store where they can browse and discover books, the new Kindle customer can then check the price on Amazon and order the e-book.

"We make a little on their e-book purchases, but then lose them as a customer completely after two years. Doesn't sound like such a great partnership to me."
Of course they sell Kobo's at Harvard Book Store. Aren't the deals pretty similar?

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Old 11-09-2013, 11:57 PM   #55
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Their customers, huh?
They own them?
Lets see for how long...
The Amazon deal is similar to Kobo's and nobody demonized them for it.
But since it's eee-vile Amazon...
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Old 11-10-2013, 12:35 AM   #56
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Useless post. Anyone can buy a Kindle pretty much anywhere these days.
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Old 11-10-2013, 02:11 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by AnemicOak View Post
Of course they sell Kobo's at Harvard Book Store. Aren't the deals pretty similar?
If I read the press release correctly, no. With Kobo the independent bookstores get a small commission when customers also buy ebooks through their website.
Amazon only from the device. I imagine many people buy ebooks from Amazon's website and so no commission is given.
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Old 11-10-2013, 04:02 AM   #58
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If I read the press release correctly, no. With Kobo the independent bookstores get a small commission when customers also buy ebooks through their website.
Amazon only from the device. I imagine many people buy ebooks from Amazon's website and so no commission is given.
Yes, seems Kobo is offering a much better deal as far as I can gather.
  • You can choose to support an Indie of your choice, by buying an ebook via a link on their website. You don't need to have bought a device from them.
  • You can register an account via the Indie and then all your purchases (via device or website) earns them a commission.
  • The deal doesn't seem to have an expiry date like the Kindle one has.

So, to me at least, the Kobo deal makes much better sense to independent bookstores. They'll continue to get revenue even if their customers decide to switch completely to ebooks and people from the area can decide to support the store (to keep it open for browsing purposes say) by linking their accounts to their local store.

(See here and here for details)
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Old 11-10-2013, 07:06 AM   #59
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If I read the press release correctly, no. With Kobo the independent bookstores get a small commission when customers also buy ebooks through their website.
Amazon only from the device. I imagine many people buy ebooks from Amazon's website and so no commission is given.
And when people buy a Kindle any of the thousands of retailers that carry Kindle, the bookstore gets nothing. Kobo has almost zero US presence without those bookstores, they need the bookstores. Amazon doesn't. And they're still offering up a third or more of the ebook margin as a "Good faith" gesture. Because that is all it is; a gesture.

Look, the only reason Amazon is throwing booksellers this bone is to save future legal expenses. They don't expect many to accept, they just want it on record they offered and were rejected so they don't have to deal with more ambulance chasers like these technical-illiterate idiots:

http://www.the-digital-reader.com/20...eller-lawsuit/

http://www.law360.com/articles/43606...ay-get-shelved


Quote:

“These are basically disappointed middlemen who are frustrated they can't sell to one segment of the marketplace but they haven't alleged anyone else has been injured,” Amazon's lawyer Kathryn D. Kirmayer of Crowell & Moring LLP told the judge.
Well, now they can get a piece of the kindle pie as middlemen. So, no more lawsuits on that front. By refusing, the booksellers give Amazon all the legal cover they need, especially since plenty of other small businesses will be jumping at the chance to make a few bucks at minimal effort and zero risk.

Last edited by fjtorres; 11-10-2013 at 07:14 AM.
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