10-04-2012, 05:27 PM | #16 |
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Regardless of table support in MOBIPocket vs Kindle1 vs Kindle2, my point is that it's not nearly time to start abandoning all concern for the older MOBI format/devices entirely (which is the impression I got from Oxford-eBooks). I myself, will continue to ensure that the MOBI portion of the hybrid MOBI/KF8 file is flawless and as visually appealing as possible; for as long as Amazon continues to sell ebooks for devices that only support the MOBI format (which I expect to be a good long time, yet). I would encourage other content creators to so the same.
Just worrying about the KF8 formatting being right and letting the MOBI portion just "happen" without a glance at—or concern about—its quality/viability is an example of shoddy craftsmanship, IMO. If that format (MOBI) is available to be delivered to the device of a customer who PAID FOR that ebook (and it is available if you're converting with Kindlegen and uploading to KDP), then you have a responsibility to make that MOBI version as good an experience as possible for that customer. It's not nearly time to start selling ebooks whose creators just didn't know/care that the same code that creates pretty dropcaps in KF8 (or a tables that looks spectacular in KF8) will look atrocious in the MOBI version if you don't handle it correctly with the special media-queries that Amazon provides for such situations. As long as people can still purchase your ebook in the boring old MOBI format ... then I feel you should still be concerned about the MOBI format looking smart. Last edited by DiapDealer; 10-04-2012 at 07:07 PM. |
10-05-2012, 03:56 AM | #17 |
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Goodness me, DiapDealer I hope you're not accusing me of shoddy workmanship there!
All our eBooks are validated properly and checked against all Kindle types before being passed to our clients. 90% of the books that are commissioned are straight text, and naturally will easily be supported on all formats without any degredation whatsoever - and yes, Fancy dropcaps and the like ALWAYS degrade gracefully on all devices. However, some books DO contain fancy formatting, some books aren't run of the mill and contain diagrams, tables etc. There's usually a way to make such things work on the older devices but it wouldn't be commercially viable to hobble the book that will be enjoyed by an overwhealmingly large proportion of the readership. We as content creators need to be respectful of the existing device owners as they were the early adopters that helped to build the success of the industry - but it is also our duty to responsibly push forwards, to allow our publisher clients to sell books with richer content (not all books are story books, remember) to try to make their titles stand out amongst fierce competition. Amazon seem to be bravely trying to throw off the shackles of their old, limited format and I applaud them for doing so. |
10-05-2012, 04:32 AM | #18 | |
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10-05-2012, 05:05 AM | #19 |
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10-05-2012, 07:32 AM | #20 | ||
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My apologies if that's not the case. I certainly don't expect anyone to "hobble" the KF8 version of an ebook simply because the older MOBI format won't support a necessary formatting feature that KF8 does allow for. I only expect them to make every effort to "gracefully" downgrade the MOBI version with the tools provided for just such situations. Rather than simply letting the MOBI chips "fall where they may." Last edited by DiapDealer; 10-05-2012 at 08:13 PM. Reason: typo |
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10-10-2012, 04:17 AM | #21 | |
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Moreover, the "issues" of conversion with tables, diagrams, etc., have virtually nothing whatsoever to do with the format, or the age of the device (barring the "oh, I forgot this was a table"-brain of mobi devices); it's the screensize, and nothing else. if I get one book a week to quote that has 20lbs. of flour trying to jam itself into a 5lb sack, I get 10. I turned down this one guy who bugged me non-stop for months, INSISTING that I "didn't get it" when he repeatedly tried to explain to me how his 10" x 10" diagrams were going to work perfectly on regular e-reading devices. Finally, to save my mind, I sent him to Josh, who I'm pretty sure will forgive me by...2014, if not sooner. ;-) (Seriously, I did. But not to torture Josh. I just figured maybe he'd believe it if a second person told him the same things. Odin knows, I couldn't get him to bloody listen, and I won't take a book if I think it will come out like the dog's breakfast). It's not the format; it's the size of the devices that's the major hurdle in setting diagrams, tables, and other elements. We've had hundreds of books with thousands of tables, design elements, lists, text-boxes...you name it; and they all manage to survive out there in the wastes of K-1/2 Mobi-Land. ;-) I think the idea of just chucking MOBI 7 for the ease of K8 is...well, lacking. Hitch |
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10-10-2012, 05:15 AM | #22 | |
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Of course there are still K1s and K2s out there, but to say that they comprise the "vast majority" of Kindles in use is unlikely to be true, to my mind. |
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10-10-2012, 06:48 AM | #23 |
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The K2 was initially a US only device, but it was quickly followed up with the K2 "International" version.
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10-10-2012, 04:49 PM | #24 | |
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I truly think that some of us, who read ePUBs predominantly, underestimate the true market reach of the Kindle devices, particularly the nice, long-battery-life, e-inks. Hitch |
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10-15-2012, 02:10 PM | #25 |
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The Kindle for iPhone displays Mobi 7 and not Mobi8 (KF8). Not sure when this will change. Also,the Kindle for iPad seems to display a weird combination of Mobi7 and Mobi8 formatting. I am designing with the KF8 format with some allowances in code for the Mobi7 format.
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10-15-2012, 04:00 PM | #26 | |
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Lots of luck with that. We've had a serious issue with the iPad's display (via the Kindle readers) of both 7 & 8 element attributes. We had an utter boondoggle with a border for a damn table that we tried to use for something else--I forget what, now. It worked a treat for everything but "Kindle for iPad," and we tested it on devices, Previewer, you-name-it...never could get it to work. No amount of media-queries, setting the element styling to hidden...nothing worked. It persisted in showing both K7 & K8 styling(s). Very bizarre. Hitch |
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11-07-2012, 05:15 PM | #27 | |
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11-07-2012, 05:28 PM | #28 | |
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I find that if I make it look good in KF8, then it is difficult to format for Mobi7 because of the HTML tagging. Any advice on how to make a nice looking Mobi at the same time as a decent KF8? |
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11-07-2012, 10:23 PM | #29 | |
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The Kindle Publishing Guidelines gives several examples of how to use media queries to target the two different formats using the same source code. Judicious use of media queries in conjunction with the "display:none" CSS attribute can be used to tailor the look of both formats (as well as ePub if done properly). I tend to use entirely different stylesheets for each format and then import the correct one using the special media-queries provided by Amazon -- the fourth method described in the Publishing Guidelines (section 8). |
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