Why 2+ GB Cards?

SciFiBill · 04-17-2008, 01:41 AM

I've been on again, off again in the forums, and I repeatedly see requests for 2+GB card support. I was wondering "why?" I am using the internal memory of the reader, and have over 20 books, 4-5 .PDF's a couple .bmp's a .png and about 4 .jpg's. I took my old CD's from Blackstone (?don't remember?), and copied a couple thousand clasics to a 2GB SD. Did the same again to another card, and finally a third. I know, formatting sometimes looks like heck, with squares and the occasional ascii chars, but for goodness sakes, I walk around with a 5000+ library in a sholder bag, and I don't even lean! I know most of those .txt and .htm files are skimpy, but unless you're installing full size image files on it, you should have room for at least a thousand books on a 2GB card. Or am I missing something? I know it *can* be used for music files, but I wanted a reader, not a high priced mp3 player. So what's up with the larger card support? Someone got the Library of Congress that they need to carry around?

James Bryant · 04-17-2008, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SciFiBill

I've been on again, off again in the forums, and I repeatedly see requests for 2+GB card support. I was wondering "why?" I <SNIP!> copied a couple thousand clasics to a 2GB SD. Did the same again to another card, and finally a third. <SNIP!> I walk around with a 5000+ library in a sholder bag, and I don't even lean! I know most of those .txt and .htm files are skimpy, but unless you're installing full size image files on it, you should have room for at least a thousand books on a 2GB card.

Cards are small, easily lost and liable to electrostatic damage (ESD). Card slots wear out quite quickly so the number of insertions should be minimised. So the more memory in a machine, which may be one BIG card which is never removed from its slot, the better. I have already posted my reasons for wanting all my books with me as I travel.

James - ebook nut since 1962

cmbs · 04-17-2008, 08:08 AM

Well there you go. Some people seem to NEED to carry around thousands upon thousands of books, AND can't be bothered with more than one bulky, hard to manage sd card.

I don't get it either.

JSWolf · 04-17-2008, 08:21 AM

Personally, I do have multiple books being read. That said, do I really need hundreds upon hundreds of eBooks available at one given time? The answer really is no. Last time I counted, I had 83 eBooks on my 505. Yes, I can see having 100 or so eBooks since you may not know what you'll want to read when the mood to read strikes. But can you really deal with sorting through hundreds and hundreds, thousands even? And to be honest, where are you going to get thousands of eBooks but from the darknet. So please, when it's said that there is a need to have the ability to store 4gigs worth of eBooks, remember that is total nonsense and we know that's not true.

And none of the current eBook readers with a 6" screen are all that wonderful when storing hundreds upon hundreds of eBooks. So please take a look and really decide if you need more then 100 eBook on your reader at one time and why. Why can't you just purchase say 512mb SD cards and make like collections. 100 eBooks at a time is more then enough for the readers to handle.

I would like to hear one really valid excuse for needing 500+ eBooks available at one time.

Ortep · 04-17-2008, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I would like to hear one really valid excuse for needing 500+ eBooks available at one time.

I can give you two

1) Because I want to impress my collegues?

2) Let's do some math. 24 hours in a day, 8 hours sleep, 4 hours eating washing shopping etc. No job. That leaves 12 hours to read books. Assume I read an avarage book in 4 hours. That makes 3 books a day. About 1100 books a year. I started reading when I was 7, avareage life expectancy 77. So I need 70*1100 = 77000 books on my reader. My avarage book is around 800 Kb. So I really need 6.2 Gig. OMG!!!!! I'm going to sell my Cybook, it is useless.

Zarkov · 04-17-2008, 08:38 AM

The only reason I can think of is uniformity. I use a lot of SD-HC cards for PMP’s, Laptop’s, PDA’s, digital Camera’s and work related systems. Which has caused me to have a fairly extended collection of SD-HC cards which are used to store different things and are all easily exchanged between devices. The Cybook is the only device which is stuck on non HC SD cards.

But then again I have inserted an SD card exactly once into the Cybook the day I started using it and I haven’t removed it since and have no intention to remove it until it’s full and I have read everything on it. I expect to do this somewhere on july 8th 2044. Until then a 2GB non SD card is good enough for me.

JSWolf · 04-17-2008, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarkov

The only reason I can think of is uniformity. I use a lot of SD-HC cards for PMP’s, Laptop’s, PDA’s, digital Camera’s and work related systems. Which has caused me to have a fairly extended collection of SD-HC cards which are used to store different things and are all easily exchanged between devices. The Cybook is the only device which is stuck on non HC SD cards

That is the best reason for wanting to have support for HC SD cards. Its not some "I've downloaded thousands of eBooks from the darknet and want them all online at one time" type excuse.

tompe · 04-17-2008, 09:08 AM

If you have all the books on the device you save time. You do not have to select books to put on the card. You do not have to backup the selection. And so on.

junior · 04-17-2008, 09:12 AM

I think that manage more than 200 ebooks/mp3/png on a device (cybook) that does not contain the search engine, much problem.

A card 1gb, currently, partially meets my needs.

But why use 1gb if I can use one of 4gd?

Why carry 200 ebooks if I can carry 77000 ebooks with the same weight?

athlonkmf · 04-17-2008, 09:12 AM

I have the needs for larger cards. Actually, I'm using a 8GB memory stick + 2GB SD-card now on my sony prs505 and STILL would like more space.

That's because I'm using my reader for comics and manga which could get really big in size.

jbenny · 04-17-2008, 09:51 AM

Dear ebook manufacturers,

JSWolf has decided that no one could possibly need any storage card larger than 2GB for ebook use. His rationale is that no one would ever need more than 100 or so ebooks at a time (I assume he means small, fiction ebooks with few images). He also has decided that anyone who has more than a few hundered ebooks must be getting them illegally. Since JSWolf knows best for all of us, Mr ebook manufacturer, please do not design future products to exceed these limitations, as it would be useless and would be promoting piracy.

------

Now that that bit of nonsense is dispensed with, I have owned many hundred pbooks in the past. I am sure that some readers here own or have owned many more than that. These pbooks were legally purchased. Why is it so hard to believe that someone could also own hundreds or thousands of ebooks?

One scenario in particular that was alluded to by James Bryant is the need to carry large amounts of documentation with you. I have had this need myself from time to time. I realize that most such documentation today is in PDF format, which is somewhat difficult to use on today's smaller readers (but not impossible). However, the discussion of storage card size in this thread was not limited to devices like the Cybook (the Iliad works better for PDF), nor was it limited to only today's devices. To get around the limitations of today's ebook readers, many people use Tablet PCs as repositories of large amounts of documentation (and the hard drives are considerably larger than 2GB).

As larger screen ebook readers become available (like the Astak Mentor series), the use of PDF and other image heavy ebooks will most likely increase. If the capability is there, people will take advantage of it. I fully expect that non-PDF ebooks and periodicals with images to become more prevalent.

Hopefully, ebook device manufacturers will not design future products according to the personal and rather limited dictates of JSWolf, but instead will push the design envelope and deliver products that will find new and unexpected uses.

JSWolf · 04-17-2008, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbenny

I have owned many hundred pbooks in the past. I am sure that some readers here own or have owned many more than that. These pbooks were legally purchased. Why is it so hard to believe that someone could also own hundreds or thousands of ebooks?

How long did it take for you to get these hundreds (or more) pBooks?

Quote:

One scenario in particular that was alluded to by James Bryant is the need to carry large amounts of documentation with you. I have had this need myself from time to time. I realize that most such documentation today is in PDF format, which is somewhat difficult to use on today's smaller readers (but not impossible). However, the discussion of storage card size in this thread was not limited to devices like the Cybook (the Iliad works better for PDF), nor was it limited to only today's devices. To get around the limitations of today's ebook readers, many people use Tablet PCs as repositories of large amounts of documentation (and the hard drives are considerably larger than 2GB).

The iLiad can handle CF memory cards larger then 2gig. Also, if you have a 505, you can use larger then 2gig if you use a memory stick. Plus you can also put in a 2gig SD card at the same time for 10gig combined.

Quote:

As larger screen ebook readers become available (like the Astak Mentor series), the use of PDF and other image heavy ebooks will most likely increase. If the capability is there, people will take advantage of it. I fully expect that non-PDF ebooks and periodicals with images to become more prevalent.

But, I was talking about the current crop of 6" screen based devices. I know the 9.7" screens will be much better for larger images and PDF. So there could very well be the need for more then a 2gig SD card.

Quote:

Hopefully, ebook device manufacturers will not design future products according to the personal and rather limited dictates of JSWolf, but instead will push the design envelope and deliver products that will find new and unexpected uses.

I was also talking about todays 6" screen based readers where the interfaces are not all that wonderful organizing content. The Sony is not bad overall and collections do help a lot plus the new menu options for finding content. But what I've read of the Gen3, it needs a bit of work. I'm hoping that the interface on the 9.7" devices makes it a lot easier to manage content in quantity.

James Bryant · 04-17-2008, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by junior

I think that manage more than 200 ebooks/mp3/png on a device (cybook) that does not contain the search engine, much problem. <SNIP!>

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I would like to hear one really valid excuse for needing 500+ eBooks available at one time.

Because that is the simplest way to use an ebook. At present limitations of indexing, search engines, card capacity, etc. may make other solutions more convenient, but in the long term , as the technology learns to produce what non-nerd readers require, one reader with all your books is the ideal, with no need to worry about Kindle-type access or separate disks, tapes, cards or dongles to lose, index, protect from ESD, and worry about their interface durability.

Sensible readers will actually have two identical ones as protection against loss or damage.

Another convenience is that a big memory can also hold serious quantities of reference material which can be accessed when you don't have Internet access. Maps, dictionaries, encyclopedias, concordances, biographies, etc. If you have a lively mind you never know when you may want to look something up. Granted that present technology makes finding things too difficult, but this is unlikely to last.

James - who presently has four ebooks, but not identical, though the same 100-odd basic books are in each of 'em

pilotbob · 04-17-2008, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

And to be honest, where are you going to get thousands of eBooks but from the darknet.

I just checked 1 source, manybooks.net and I quote from their home page:

There are 20,278 eBooks available here and they're all free!

That doesn't count project gutenberg (which probably dupes alot from manybooks) the Baen fee library, etc.

So, no you don't have to be a pirate (er copyright violator) to have thousands of ebooks.

BOb

SciFiBill · 04-17-2008, 11:18 AM

Ok, I'll concede the image files, as they could bankrupt a smaller card rather quickly. I must say though, you must have excellent eyesight, as I tried to read a .jpg manga on mine, and I quickly had to stop. No way was I able to read the "mumbles" and “thought balloons”. As for huge collections of books, I must agree with above that without a proper index scheme (I.e... A B C ->C ->Clarke, Cooper, Crandon ...And then a book bibliography under the author, or a Quick and Easy browse function (? maybe text only, no graphics?), it is too unwieldy to attempt navigation of hundreds, much less thousands of books. Once we’ve tackled the browse/index problems, I will be able to understand the need. But I am not expecting to see the above happen in these first generation readers – And I’ll be happy to see them implemented as early as in the third (when I hope to be buying my next).

04-17-2008, 01:41 AM	#1
SciFiBill Member Posts: 20 Karma: 15 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Central Texas Device: Cybook Gen3, Irex DR800SG	Why 2+ GB Cards? I've been on again, off again in the forums, and I repeatedly see requests for 2+GB card support. I was wondering "why?" I am using the internal memory of the reader, and have over 20 books, 4-5 .PDF's a couple .bmp's a .png and about 4 .jpg's. I took my old CD's from Blackstone (?don't remember?), and copied a couple thousand clasics to a 2GB SD. Did the same again to another card, and finally a third. I know, formatting sometimes looks like heck, with squares and the occasional ascii chars, but for goodness sakes, I walk around with a 5000+ library in a sholder bag, and I don't even lean! I know most of those .txt and .htm files are skimpy, but unless you're installing full size image files on it, you should have room for at least a thousand books on a 2GB card. Or am I missing something? I know it can be used for music files, but I wanted a reader, not a high priced mp3 player. So what's up with the larger card support? Someone got the Library of Congress that they need to carry around?

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04-17-2008, 08:08 AM	#3
cmbs non-believer Posts: 384 Karma: 713 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: USA Device: Cybook Gen 3, JetBook Lite	Well there you go. Some people seem to NEED to carry around thousands upon thousands of books, AND can't be bothered with more than one bulky, hard to manage sd card. I don't get it either.

04-17-2008, 08:21 AM	#4
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 73,835 Karma: 128597114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	Personally, I do have multiple books being read. That said, do I really need hundreds upon hundreds of eBooks available at one given time? The answer really is no. Last time I counted, I had 83 eBooks on my 505. Yes, I can see having 100 or so eBooks since you may not know what you'll want to read when the mood to read strikes. But can you really deal with sorting through hundreds and hundreds, thousands even? And to be honest, where are you going to get thousands of eBooks but from the darknet. So please, when it's said that there is a need to have the ability to store 4gigs worth of eBooks, remember that is total nonsense and we know that's not true. And none of the current eBook readers with a 6" screen are all that wonderful when storing hundreds upon hundreds of eBooks. So please take a look and really decide if you need more then 100 eBook on your reader at one time and why. Why can't you just purchase say 512mb SD cards and make like collections. 100 eBooks at a time is more then enough for the readers to handle. I would like to hear one really valid excuse for needing 500+ eBooks available at one time.

04-17-2008, 08:38 AM	#6
Zarkov Member Posts: 13 Karma: 10 Join Date: Feb 2008 Device: Cybook gen3	The only reason I can think of is uniformity. I use a lot of SD-HC cards for PMP’s, Laptop’s, PDA’s, digital Camera’s and work related systems. Which has caused me to have a fairly extended collection of SD-HC cards which are used to store different things and are all easily exchanged between devices. The Cybook is the only device which is stuck on non HC SD cards. But then again I have inserted an SD card exactly once into the Cybook the day I started using it and I haven’t removed it since and have no intention to remove it until it’s full and I have read everything on it. I expect to do this somewhere on july 8th 2044. Until then a 2GB non SD card is good enough for me.

04-17-2008, 09:08 AM	#8
tompe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 7,452 Karma: 7185064 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Linköpng, Sweden Device: Kindle Voyage, Nexus 5, Kindle PW	If you have all the books on the device you save time. You do not have to select books to put on the card. You do not have to backup the selection. And so on.

04-17-2008, 09:12 AM	#9
junior Connoisseur Posts: 85 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Fortaleza, Brasil Device: Palm TX, CyBook Gen3	I think that manage more than 200 ebooks/mp3/png on a device (cybook) that does not contain the search engine, much problem. A card 1gb, currently, partially meets my needs. But why use 1gb if I can use one of 4gd? Why carry 200 ebooks if I can carry 77000 ebooks with the same weight?

04-17-2008, 09:12 AM	#10
athlonkmf Guru Posts: 714 Karma: 1014039 Join Date: May 2007 Device: Sony PRS-500, Sony PRS-505, Kindle 3, Sony PRS350, iPad 64GB	I have the needs for larger cards. Actually, I'm using a 8GB memory stick + 2GB SD-card now on my sony prs505 and STILL would like more space. That's because I'm using my reader for comics and manga which could get really big in size.

04-17-2008, 09:51 AM	#11
jbenny Addict Posts: 323 Karma: 358 Join Date: May 2007 Device: Tablet PC and Nokia N800	Dear ebook manufacturers, JSWolf has decided that no one could possibly need any storage card larger than 2GB for ebook use. His rationale is that no one would ever need more than 100 or so ebooks at a time (I assume he means small, fiction ebooks with few images). He also has decided that anyone who has more than a few hundered ebooks must be getting them illegally. Since JSWolf knows best for all of us, Mr ebook manufacturer, please do not design future products to exceed these limitations, as it would be useless and would be promoting piracy. ------ Now that that bit of nonsense is dispensed with, I have owned many hundred pbooks in the past. I am sure that some readers here own or have owned many more than that. These pbooks were legally purchased. Why is it so hard to believe that someone could also own hundreds or thousands of ebooks? One scenario in particular that was alluded to by James Bryant is the need to carry large amounts of documentation with you. I have had this need myself from time to time. I realize that most such documentation today is in PDF format, which is somewhat difficult to use on today's smaller readers (but not impossible). However, the discussion of storage card size in this thread was not limited to devices like the Cybook (the Iliad works better for PDF), nor was it limited to only today's devices. To get around the limitations of today's ebook readers, many people use Tablet PCs as repositories of large amounts of documentation (and the hard drives are considerably larger than 2GB). As larger screen ebook readers become available (like the Astak Mentor series), the use of PDF and other image heavy ebooks will most likely increase. If the capability is there, people will take advantage of it. I fully expect that non-PDF ebooks and periodicals with images to become more prevalent. Hopefully, ebook device manufacturers will not design future products according to the personal and rather limited dictates of JSWolf, but instead will push the design envelope and deliver products that will find new and unexpected uses.

04-17-2008, 11:18 AM	#15
SciFiBill Member Posts: 20 Karma: 15 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Central Texas Device: Cybook Gen3, Irex DR800SG	Ok, I'll concede the image files, as they could bankrupt a smaller card rather quickly. I must say though, you must have excellent eyesight, as I tried to read a .jpg manga on mine, and I quickly had to stop. No way was I able to read the "mumbles" and “thought balloons”. As for huge collections of books, I must agree with above that without a proper index scheme (I.e... A B C ->C ->Clarke, Cooper, Crandon ...And then a book bibliography under the author, or a Quick and Easy browse function (? maybe text only, no graphics?), it is too unwieldy to attempt navigation of hundreds, much less thousands of books. Once we’ve tackled the browse/index problems, I will be able to understand the need. But I am not expecting to see the above happen in these first generation readers – And I’ll be happy to see them implemented as early as in the third (when I hope to be buying my next).

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