08-26-2012, 06:58 AM | #46 |
Resident Curmudgeon
Posts: 73,686
Karma: 128176798
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3
|
|
08-26-2012, 07:30 AM | #47 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
Are you saying that the fixed layout formats weren't Epub in 2011 because they didn't meet a spec which didn't exist? That makes no sense. Or are you saying that they stopped being Epub once the spec was released? That doesn't make any sense either. |
|
08-26-2012, 10:35 AM | #48 | |
Resident Curmudgeon
Posts: 73,686
Karma: 128176798
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3
|
Quote:
|
|
08-26-2012, 10:56 AM | #49 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
Thanks for clearing that up, Arbiter of All that is Right and True in eBooks. |
|
08-26-2012, 11:00 AM | #50 |
Resident Curmudgeon
Posts: 73,686
Karma: 128176798
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3
|
How can they have met a spec that never existed? Prior to ePub 3, there never was a spec for fixed layout in ePub. Even though they called it ePub, it never was and it's still not.
|
08-26-2012, 11:17 AM | #51 |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
As I said before, they met the Epub spec at the time. Obviously you never bothered to read it.
|
08-26-2012, 11:54 AM | #52 | |
eBook Enthusiast
Posts: 85,544
Karma: 93383043
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6
|
Quote:
|
|
08-26-2012, 12:19 PM | #53 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
The Epub spec is a set of minimum requirements. It is not prescriptivist in nature. Ie, it doesn't describe all the allowable content, just what a file must have. That means that a fixed layout Epub could still meet the Epub spec. So the industry standard Epub was fragmented then and still is now. |
|
08-26-2012, 12:48 PM | #54 |
eBook Enthusiast
Posts: 85,544
Karma: 93383043
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6
|
Nate, you don't have to take my word for this. Get an iBooks fixed-layout book and run it through the ePub validator at http://validator.idpf.org/. It will fail validation - I guarantee it.
Regardless of the fact that some people may choose to call such fixed layout books "ePub" (and it's certainly true that some people do), it's just plain wrong to do so. They are not valid ePub books; they are books that can only be read by iBooks. |
08-26-2012, 03:04 PM | #55 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
http://blog.threepress.org/2011/01/1...-layout-epubs/ But whether something meets the spec is irrelevant. (If that were a criterion then you'd have to disallow everything sent through Pubit, which doesn't do adequate validation.) What matters is that the vast majority of digital publishing calls the fixed layout formats Epub. |
|
08-26-2012, 04:10 PM | #56 | |
eBook Enthusiast
Posts: 85,544
Karma: 93383043
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6
|
The link you provide specifically states:
Quote:
|
|
08-26-2012, 05:08 PM | #57 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
Getting back to the original point: So Apple's FL Epubs are indeed Epubs, which means the so-called Epub standard is fragmented by mutually incompatible content. That internal issue renders the related issue of Kindle incompatibility moot. So long as Epub is internally incompatible Jon cannot kick Kindle around for being the same. P.S. And Harry, did you really think you could win an argument on the facts against someone who writes about this stuff for a living? |
|
08-26-2012, 05:34 PM | #58 |
eBook Enthusiast
Posts: 85,544
Karma: 93383043
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6
|
I am pretty familiar with the specs on the IDPF site. Could you point out which part of the spec "specifically allows for developers to do nonstandard things to Epub files and still validate"? I really don't recall having come across this statement in my reading of the spec.
Thanks. |
08-26-2012, 06:12 PM | #59 | |
Sir Penguin of Edinburgh
Posts: 12,375
Karma: 23555235
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: DC Metro area
Device: Shake a stick plus 1
|
Quote:
BTW, this is going away in Epub3. But it's still valid for Epub 2ish. So as you can see, Epub was basically designed to introduce incompatibilities. And thus as far as the consumer is concerned there is no standard Epub format. |
|
08-26-2012, 08:50 PM | #60 |
Wizard
Posts: 4,538
Karma: 264065402
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Taiwan
Device: HP Touchpad, Sony Duo 13, Lumia 920, Kobo Aura HD
|
While you two are having your little discussion on the side, that still leaves uncontested the bold statement by JSWolf "more standard epub books are being sold world wide than Kindle books". Do we have any real numbers here? Any educated guesses by the experts? My money would be on Amazon -- especially since official ebooks in languages other than English are still a lot less widely available/accepted by readers. Even if there are more epub compatible readers out there, many people might use them to read PD or library books, or even pirated materials. Not all reading material is paid for.
That being said, even if Amazon had only a 40% market share, calling epub THE standard wouldn't make sense. Last edited by HansTWN; 08-26-2012 at 08:56 PM. |
Tags |
amazon, epub, kindle |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Paulo Coelho Sells 99-cent eBooks (Kindle/Nook - US and Canada only, for now) | Wetdogeared | Deals and Resources (No Self-Promotion or Affiliate Links) | 2 | 05-03-2012 10:08 AM |
Kindle 3 no longer on Amazon UK | evwool | Amazon Kindle | 19 | 10-21-2011 01:46 AM |
Kindle no longer available in Europe (via amazon.com)?! | Frawan | Amazon Kindle | 13 | 10-14-2011 07:40 AM |
pocketbook-usa.com no longer sells/supports PB 301? | speedtouch | PocketBook | 13 | 10-27-2010 11:04 AM |
Amazon No Longer Selling US Only Kindle | dhill | Amazon Kindle | 12 | 12-18-2009 08:01 AM |