DRM Good or Bad?

[VydorScope]

Well,

What it comes down to is Laser thinks DRM is protecting the books, as so long as that is the case, DRM is a valid tool to use.

Most of us do not think such, and see it as only making the LEGIT READER's experience less then ideal.

So the two roads will never meet....

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by VydorScope

Well,

What it comes down to is Laser thinks DRM is protecting the books, as so long as that is the case, DRM is a valid tool to use.

Just because Laser thinks DRM works does not make it a good idea.

[ScalyFreak]

Originally Posted by VydorScope

What it comes down to is Laser thinks DRM is protecting the books, as so long as that is the case, DRM is a valid tool to use.

And what we on the other side are arguing is that studies have proven over and over that it is not the case, and that DRM doesn't stop anyone from pirating a book if they really want to do it. Still valid?

[Lazer]

Scaly et al. (especially YOU Scaly!):

A toast to all for your spunky discussions and beliefs here! (I mean that)

And yes, Scaly, you nailed me on my age/gender profile! Multiply X 2. Take a peak at my author page on Amazon (Tony H. Latham) and you can see a pic of who you've been sparring with–nope, not trying to sell you a book! ; )

I'll toy with what I've learned/felt from this hearty discussion and will move it over for my nonfiction about trafficking in wildlife that's on the edge of being polished, it's certainly written for a broader market than my first little book.

To all; read and write well, but mostly enjoy.

TL

[PatrickPurcell]

I can only speak for myself, here. I just uploaded my first ebook for online publication in the Kindle book store. During the upload process, Amazon gives you the option of DRM or no-DRM. That was a no-brainer for me... as a completely unknown author, I'm much better off if my work is distributed for free on PirateBay--free exposure! Even piracy is more likely to lead to a purchase than not if nobody even knows who I am to begin with. Distribution is the important thing, initially.

Now if you're a well known author looking after you're bottom line, the issue is more complicated, but your work will be traded by hackers anyway if you're a name in this business. So why worry at all?

[ScalyFreak]

Originally Posted by Lazer

Scaly et al. (especially YOU Scaly!):

A toast to all for your spunky discussions and beliefs here! (I mean that)

Prost, skål, your health!

Originally Posted by Lazer

And yes, Scaly, you nailed me on my age/gender profile! Multiply X 2. Take a peak at my author page on Amazon (Tony H. Latham) and you can see a pic of who you've been sparring with–nope, not trying to sell you a book! ; )

Hey, we're neighbors! That means your book is in my city's library... *heads off to search for it*

[VydorScope]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Just because Laser thinks DRM works does not make it a good idea.

I was stating Laser's point of view, not stating what I believe to be true.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by VydorScope

I was stating Laser's point of view, not stating what I believe to be true.

I was thinking that when you said "DRM is a valid tool to use" was yours. Sorry if I misread.

[VydorScope]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I was thinking that when you said "DRM is a valid tool to use" was yours. Sorry if I misread.

I have made many posts the opposite and even state in that post "most of us do not" - with us being a second personal plural - which includes the author.

But to be sure, as I have stated, IMO DRM PROMOTES piracy, and hurts legit readers - therefor I release all of my books DRM Free.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by VydorScope

[...]But to be sure, as I have stated, IMO DRM PROMOTES piracy, and hurts legit readers - therefor I release all of my books DRM Free.

I am not at all certain about the "promotes" emphasis, which you have made a couple of times. I certainly agree that it doesn't do anything much to stop it, but actual promotion? Where's the evidence of that?

I would have thought that the only difference was that a DRM "protected" book needs to be actively pirated, whereas a non-DRM can just be copied around - and because it's so easy no even thinks of it as piracy, even though the result and implication is the same, and even if the perpetrator does not realise it (many don't). Looked at in that light, DRM does serve one purpose: it does require that the person acknowledge they are (or may be) acting contrary to the author/publisher's desires.

[VydorScope]

Originally Posted by gmw

I am not at all certain about the "promotes" emphasis, which you have made a couple of times. I certainly agree that it doesn't do anything much to stop it, but actual promotion? Where's the evidence of that?

There have been a couple studies that indicate that(check google) might be the case, and in my personal experience I have seen it, and posts in this thread state indicate that others have seen it. Its far from a open closed proof case, but I hold that opinion (note I always try to qualify it as my OPINION not a fact).

I have plenty of books on my Nook Color, and in my Kindle app that are DRM protected. Im not like some others that refuse to buy DRM books. I can see why people think DRM is a good idea, even if I dont agree with it.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by VydorScope

There have been a couple studies that indicate that(check google) might be the case, and in my personal experience I have seen it, and posts in this thread state indicate that others have seen it. Its far from a open closed proof case, but I hold that opinion (note I always try to qualify it as my OPINION not a fact). [...]

I am not trying to be argumentative, seriously, I'm not. But how have you seen this in personal experience?

It may be that, since I haven't actually published anything I've written yet, I don't understand some of the mechanics involved. But it seems to me that if a book is DRM protected and you find it on a site with the DRM removed then you conclude it has been pirated and made available on that site for the convenience of others. BUT if your non-DRM protected doesn't appear on that site, you can't conclude that it hasn't been pirated. If there is no DRM there was no need for a pirate to make an unprotected version available, people can already share the book directly. So how can you measure the difference?

[no.guru]

Originally Posted by Lazer

I would have absolutely no problem with it. It's your copy. Move it to Calibre and print it if you want. I just don't want to see my copyright violated and somebody trying to distribute it for free, or worse to sell it for their profit. (not that my works are worth much)

Cold here. Somebody lied about the first day of spring.

OK, that makes sense. Good to know you're not following the poor example set by the publishing industry, although I think some may be shifting in the right direction by selling paper books and ebooks combined.

[speakingtohe]

I am not pro DRM or anti DRM. I am also not against circumventing DRM for legitimate usage (of which there are many)

I do not think it discourages organised piracy, but I am fairly sure it discourages casual distribution of ebooks in many cases. Especially the case of a person emailing all of their friends a copy. And I am certainly not implying that anyone on MR would do this.

I do think that it has raised consciousness in many people's minds towards the fact that authors/publishers/distributers would in general prefer to be paid at some point.

For example it never occurred to me that buying a book in a second hand or thrift store would not contribute directly to the author. I am not against buying second hand books as it is legitimate and does get the author more recognition and like a library book someone bought that book and it was was only traded, lent or sold one copy at a time because it was physically gone from the shelves.

I have seen people sell or give away ebooks and still keep a copy and sell or give them away again. Not saying that anyone here has ever done that.

And to flog a dead horse it is even harder to read a paper book on the device of your choice than to format shift.

Helen

[Justin Nemo]

Originally Posted by speakingtohe

For example it never occurred to me that buying a book in a second hand or thrift store would not contribute directly to the author. I am not against buying second hand books as it is legitimate and does get the author more recognition and like a library book someone bought that book and it was was only traded, lent or sold one copy at a time because it was physically gone from the shelves.

How can it benefit the author, there is no control over it once it has made the first sale. It can be sold and re sold a thousand times over in thrift shops, charity shops and garage sales and the author gets nothing.

I was told recently that there was a file on a torrent site that had 10,000 ebooks in mobi and epub I think, which you can download and just drop on to your Kindle or Ipad. So what is the point of DRM, no one benefits? So isn't it time that writers stood up and said something?