Legacy formats are ticking time bomb for lost data

[NatCh]

Everybody has a skill, yvanleterrible.

[yvanleterrible]

We need better media support. Anyone seen something new?

I knkow I know! That can be a thread by itself!

[nekokami]

Microfilm is subject to water damage (more so than paper, I think) and probably fades over time, as it's a photographic process. I don't think I would want to rely on it for long-term storage, though as an additional backup it might not be too bad.

Low-acid paper in a watertight, airtight box is probably best after all for a combination of information density and durability. Clay tablets are just too bulky and fragile!

[NatCh]

Engrave stuff on stainless steel plates? They're heavy, sure, but they're not fragile ....

[nekokami]

Not very dense storage, though. If you make the plates thin enough to stack well, they do become more fragile. And even stainless steel rusts. You might want to pick a different alloy.

[mogui]

Originally Posted by Bob Russell

I never really thought about it much before this thread, but how secure do we feel our current technology is? I mean, can we envision a human disaster that would leave us without the long term ability to read DVDs, hard drives, etc?

If we move away from paper archival, then we are very dependent on technology to read magnetic storage. But that's not the sort of thing you can do by just being clever - you have to maintain your technological and manufacturing capacity. If we had a major disaster in the form of an asteroid hit, plague, nuclear holocaust, etc would we really expect to be able to preserve digital archives for any period of time?

And of all times in human history, that would be when we most need to preserve the knowledge and history of humans in order to survive. What a shame if it knocked us into another dark ages due to the digital dependence.

Interesting thoughts Bob.

If we want to preserve our written culture over time, the eBook is a good way to do it. Design an EP (or similarly low-powered) screen eReader in a waterproof durable case. The back of the case is a panel of solar cells. Put it on a windowsill to charge it. The "battery" is a very long-lived storage medium -- perhaps a capacitor. The reader has vast (terabytes) non-volatile memory -- enough for many reference works that can be accessed via touchscreen technology. The user can save notes on the reader too. The interface to the reader is infrared that can work through the case. The case is seamless with no ports to allow water or dust inside. The reader can operate off of sunlight alone, long after the battery becomes nonfunctional.

Now the reading public can obtain these ubiquitous readers for the price of a fast-food lunch. They all come with basic reference works already installed -- encyclopedia, multilingual dictionaries, and more. Then the user adds whatever their interests dictate. Odds are that over time, with enough readers extant, most important works will be captured.

Then if the dreaded civilization-killer occurs, there will be enough working readers around to preserve a base of knowledge from which to recover. The uBiquitous eReader -- I want one.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

In fact, no medium you choose is going to be easily readable with simple or no technology, AND impervious to wear and tear. One way around that is to back-up data in 2 formats, one designed to survive the ravages that would damage or destroy the other... say ceramic, which will not burn, and stainless steel, which will not break. The other solution is simply combining the strengths of one medium for data with the strength of another medium as a package.

As the issue of technological readability is an issue, perhaps something we should be considering is the careful preservation of certain machines as well, to use as the tools to rebuild after a catastrophe. Cache-ing certain pieces of large and small equipment, perhaps in well-marked underground bunkers, with full instructions included on how to assemble and use, could be the things future people might use after a disaster to start to recover their infrastructure.

An interesting study could be done on exactly what would be best to cache... something repairable, and which can be used to build other things, which can build other things, etc. Maybe the idea would be to cache a flexible factory, complete with its own tool fabrication equipment.

Hmm... I feel story notes coming on...

[yvanleterrible]

Hmmm! How about Micro laser etched ceramics!

[yvanleterrible]

As far as mass storage I like this one but there is no way to decode without technology.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

If anyone here remembers the George Pal movie The Time Machine, they might remember the "speaking rings" that simply needed to be placed on a table and spun with a hand, in order to speak. The beauty of the rings were that the recording, and the replay system, were self-contained, requiring only kinetic energy to function.

This is the optimum goal for any sound (or motion) based recording system: Making sure it can essentially play itself, powered by the simplest of energy sources.

So here's an idea: A holographic crystal is placed in the sun. Sunlight passes through the crystal, and illuminates a discrete holographic image at that particular angle. As the sun moves in the sky, it illuminates a new image at each angle... if you can pack enough holographic information to create, say, 30 images for each second of the sun's motion, you have a movie. (Okay... I am writing this one down...)

[yvanleterrible]

Hey! you gave me an idea.

Just send retransmitters into space at regular intervals.

Since it takes time for data to come back. There would always be one of the bounced back signals that would be as fresh as when it was sent. Sagan used the old signals idea when Aliens sent back a message in "Contact".

There are old TV shows that weren't taped because the technology was so expensive. Old timers remember them but that's all we have; and maybe a script on paper(Again)

If someone found a way to go deep in space really fast they could record all radiophonic and televised history. Sometimes I gett really ashamed of what was broadcast.

[Bob Russell]

I'm getting excited about what your next book might be like, Steve!!! What are the chances you could work a MobileReader name or two into it in a non-intrusive way?!!!!

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

Hey! you gave me an idea.

Just send retransmitters into space at regular intervals.

I like that idea too... as long as someone's got a radio, and can wait for the signal to come back...

You could also store that data off-planet, but close-by... say, on the Moon... with a simple way to order it to transmit when needed. (And it better be simple! Can you imagine a planetary disaster, leaving people with the knowledge that everything they needed to rebuild civilization is locked up on the Moon?... )

[kovidgoyal]

Here's a new idea:
Make humans immortal and augment their memory capacity. There's your easily decipherable and robust storage mechanism.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Bob Russell

I'm getting excited about what your next book might be like, Steve!!! What are the chances you could work a MobileReader name or two into it in a non-intrusive way?!!!!

Anything's possible!