Advertisements in Ebooks-Good Idea?

[Canuck_in_Japan]

If it made books cheaper, I would be all for it if it meant having ads ad the beginning or end of the book or even between chapters occasionally. But on the same page as I'm reading? Hells no!

[Freeshadow]

the best proof that ads are plummeting is that companies offering money/giftcards/etc for surveys emerge and do fine.
wihle i know more and more people quitting TV and similar services (my family and me included) because of this annoyance (we own over 500 DVDs instead still collecting)
(altough aired advertising here is as far as regulation goes similar to what our UK MR fellows reported; thus only a fraction of annoyance as in the US) I financed several books and movies with collecting points for consumer surveys.
they annoy me once per survey and I get something back, while in case of ad supported stuff (as was already pointed out) the only thing to expect is more and more ads to come.
I still remember the times when ads here were placed

• so seldom that we referred to them as "piss break"
• so precise, that it was possible to cut them out manually with a VHS
  recorder

now both is past since for the 1st you 'd need an extremely weak bladder and for the 2nd video editing software, which given the prices a movie drops to when it's aired isn't worth the effort. (cassetes never became that cheap, so I had build up an impressive collection of movies back then)

aparrt from that in case of books - as it was already pointed out ads in the mid of a novel are extremely deadly for the dive into the story effect.

You refer to books serialized in papers.
I remember them from Poland where they survived a bit longer - they were collectable pages meant to be taken out refolded and recut so in the end you had a pulp quality book. Still no annoyances in the mid of the text.

the only approach I imagine might work would be ads for firearms in the mid of tax forms but I somehow don't belive that to happen.

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

the only approach I imagine might work would be ads for firearms in the mid of tax forms but I somehow don't belive thatto happen.

[Sil_liS]

I see that there is a difference in perspective. Some consider the situation as paying more to get ad-free versions, but I think of it as paying less (or nothing) if there are ads. It works great with online things and I see it as a win-win-win situation: I get to play games and read webcomics for free, the authors get payed, and others get to display their products. If the ads are annoying then the system doesn't work because less people will visit the site so advertisement on it becomes worthless.

[Kevin8or]

Originally Posted by Sil_liS

I see that there is a difference in perspective. Some consider the situation as paying more to get ad-free versions, but I think of it as paying less (or nothing) if there are ads.

You're correct but only from a short-term perspective.

The point made in earlier posts was that you pay less in the beginning but only for a while. In time, prices migrate so that you are indeed gouged to get ad-fee versions, while the ad-supported versions cost what you would have expected for the ad-free product.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...3&postcount=80


https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...&postcount=148

[Sil_liS]

Originally Posted by Kevin8or

You're correct but only from a short-term perspective.

The model seems to be going strong for webcomics. Penny Arcade for example has been around since 1998. It's still free.

Originally Posted by Kevin8or

The point made in earlier posts was that you pay less in the beginning but only for a while. In time, prices migrate so that you are indeed gouged to get ad-fee versions, while the ad-supported versions cost what you would have expected for the ad-free product.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...3&postcount=80


https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...&postcount=148

How much did book prices increase in the last decade, without ads being involved?

[Kevin8or]

Originally Posted by Sil_liS

How much did book prices increase in the last decade, without ads being involved?

Maybe someone from the publishing industry can answer. As for the price of ad-supported e-books, I expect their price, as with most prices, will become as high as the market allows.

[stonetools]

One person says why ebook ads will succeeed where printads won't:

But times have changed. Single-purpose ereader devices like the Amazon Kindle, multi-purpose tablets like the Apple iPad and smart phones running the Apple iOS and Android operating systems have made it possible for advertising to be delivered with laser-like precision to consumers. Today, ads can be served up on demand, and delivered in ebooks and apps based on the location of the reader, his/her profile information, purchase history, browsing behavior, and other factors.

Gone are the mysteries that accompanied old school, in-book advertising. Advertisers will no longer have to settle for ambiguous measurements and buying ads on a hunch. When they place ads in ebooks and apps, advertisers will be able to tell how many people interacted with their ads (and how many didn't), how long they spent viewing them, on what devices, what they were reading, and where they were located (geographically) when they encountered the ad. They'll also be able to know who -- exactly -- saw their ad (and who didn't) and be able to create engaging, interactive ads that lure readers in and encourage them to provide additional information about themselves and their interests.

Publishers will be able to deliver location and context-aware content (including advertisements) in ebooks and apps that are targeted to the unique characteristics of the consumer. This means that publishers will be able to sell a new breed of personalized advertisements (and generate new streams of recurring revenue) by moving advertisers away from the "spray and pray" approach that has dominated the advertising industry for decades. And, it means that advertisers will be able to gain in depth information about their prospects that was previously impossible to obtain.

LINK

I think the ad haters have two problems. I think they really do seem to think the new ebook ads will be just print ads in a different form, as if fresh ads can't be downloaded every day or ads can't be tailored to the viewer's profile.Second, they really just think that viewers will be repelled by the very idea of ads, no matter what, just as they are . If these things are not true, then there is an opportunity.

Without a concrete example of a model, I'm not sure there is much point in further discussion, really. When the ad-haters think of an ad supported model, they immediately think of the worst ads they've ever seen and can't imagine anyone would want anything like thing to sully their pure novel reading experience, which has always been ad-free (except where it was'nt). They then think up every reason why ad support won't work, although ad support seems to work in every other type of media.

Whether ad support will work in ebooks is really going to depend on its implementation, not on abstract discussion on why ads will never work in ebooks. Ads were never supposed to work on ebook readers either-until they did.

[Kevin8or]

Originally Posted by stonetools

I think the ad haters have two problems.

*raises hand* Ad-hater, here.

I think they really do seem to think the new ebook ads will be just print ads in a different form

Nope, don't think that.

Second, they really just think that viewers will be repelled by the very idea of ads, no matter what, just as they are.

Nope. Don't think that either. The evidence demonstrates otherwise.

Without a concrete example of a model, I'm not sure there is much point in further discussion, really.

That, I agree with.

[John F]

Originally Posted by stonetools

One person says why ebook ads will succeeed where printads won't:



LINK

I think the ad haters have two problems. I think they really do seem to think the new ebook ads will be just print ads in a different form, as if fresh ads can't be downloaded every day or ads can't be tailored to the viewer's profile.Second, they really just think that viewers will be repelled by the very idea of ads, no matter what, just as they are . If these things are not true, then there is an opportunity.

Without a concrete example of a model, I'm not sure there is much point in further discussion, really. ...

And yet, you continue to post.

[sabredog]

Originally Posted by stonetools

When the ad-haters think of an ad supported model, they immediately think of the worst ads they've ever seen and can't imagine anyone would want anything like thing to sully their pure novel reading experience, which has always been ad-free (except where it was'nt).

What a load of crock

I have not had to put up with ads in paperback novels for FORTY years and I am not going to put up with them in ebooks I buy now or in the future.

This is yet another stupid idea that will push purchasers of ebooks towards ad free ebooks from alternative sources. Mark my words. If ads appear, so too will a bigger, thriving market for ad-less ebooks appearing at a file sharing forum/site near you.

Do you want to know why readers are opposed to ads in ebooks? Readers of novels want to be immersed in the story line and not interrupted by a bloody ad for a packet of Doritos. It might work for a magazine which consists of articles, but not a novel.

Instead of moving forward with a better business model suited for the digital age, publishers seem content to dig up ideas for 40 plus years ago.

Stone age thinking from stone age companies.

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by stonetools

One person says why ebook ads will succeeed where printads won't:



LINK

Yeah, that guy doesn't do a great job of making his case. Specifically, he claims:

Today, ads can be served up on demand, and delivered in ebooks and apps based on the location of the reader, his/her profile information, purchase history, browsing behavior, and other factors.

Gone are the mysteries that accompanied old school, in-book advertising. Advertisers will no longer have to settle for ambiguous measurements and buying ads on a hunch. When they place ads in ebooks and apps, advertisers will be able to tell how many people interacted with their ads (and how many didn't), how long they spent viewing them, on what devices, what they were reading, and where they were located (geographically) when they encountered the ad. They'll also be able to know who -- exactly -- saw their ad (and who didn't) and be able to create engaging, interactive ads that lure readers in and encourage them to provide additional information about themselves and their interests.

Publishers will be able to deliver location and context-aware content (including advertisements) in ebooks and apps that are targeted to the unique characteristics of the consumer. This means that publishers will be able to sell a new breed of personalized advertisements (and generate new streams of recurring revenue) by moving advertisers away from the "spray and pray" approach that has dominated the advertising industry for decades. And, it means that advertisers will be able to gain in depth information about their prospects that was previously impossible to obtain.

This is basically BS. Amazon isn't going to share any of this information with publishers, neither is Apple. Nor, I suspect will B&N or anyone else. This "in depth information" simply won't be available.

And, as per my earlier post, even at 10 times the going rate for website ads (which do incorporate a certain amount of information about people viewing the ads, albeit not as much as could perhaps be gleaned from my Amazon account) this is not a sustainable model. And all of the in depth information on my purchasing habits still won't make an ad in a novel I happen to be reading as relevant as an ad for a plasma TV that is placed on a website for people interested in purchasing plasma TVs.

I think the ad haters have two problems.

I think your constant reliance on ad hominem arguments - whether characterizing people who disagree with you as "ad-haters" or people who agree with you as "wise authors" or "wise businessmen" shows the absence of any real evidence on your part.

Why not stop the name calling and address the substance?

Without a concrete example of a model, I'm not sure there is much point in further discussion, really. When the ad-haters think of an ad supported model, they immediately think of the worst ads they've ever seen and can't imagine anyone would want anything like thing to sully their pure novel reading experience, which has always been ad-free (except where it was'nt). They then think up every reason why ad support won't work, although ad support seems to work in every other type of media.

No, there have been plenty of substantive reasons put forth by "ad-haters" about why this wouldn't work.

Whether ad support will work in ebooks is really going to depend on its implementation, not on abstract discussion on why ads will never work in ebooks. Ads were never supposed to work on ebook readers either-until they did.

A lot of the discussion, as mentioned above, has been quite concrete. Feel free to offer your own concrete examples, preferably with numbers.

[MovieBird]

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

YI think your constant reliance on ad hominem arguments - whether characterizing people who disagree with you as "ad-haters" or people who agree with you as "wise authors" or "wise businessmen" shows the absence of any real evidence on your part.

Why not stop the name calling and address the substance?

I agree. Please stone, stop with the name calling. It's really tiring to constantly see anyone who disagrees with you demonized with some asinine label.

Repeat after me, "No two people are alike. I should not ascribe general thoughts and actions to wide swaths of humanity."

[stonetools]

Originally Posted by John F

And yet, you continue to post.

Well, I wasn't intending to post anymore but:

think your constant reliance on ad hominem arguments - whether characterizing people who disagree with you as "ad-haters" or people who agree with you as "wise authors" or "wise businessmen" shows the absence of any real evidence on your part.

I wasn't intending an ad-hominem. I was just using it as a descriptive term in oppposition to ad-intolerant. Would you prefer "true believer in ad-free books"?

I agree. Please stone, stop with the name calling. It's really tiring to constantly see anyone who disagrees with you demonized with some asinine label.

Coming from a guy who told me that I wasn't welcome on this site because of my opinions, that's pretty rich.

I have not had to put up with ads in paperback novels for FORTY years and I am not going to put up with them in ebooks I buy now or in the future.

The problem is that you and others seem to oppose , not merely the possibilityof ads in ebooksyou want to buy, but even the possibility of ads in ebooks that ad-tolerant people want to buy. As I've said repeatedly, there should be ad-free versions of ebooks and ad-supported versions of ebooks

[Kevin8or]

Originally Posted by stonetools

I wasn't intending an ad-hominem. I was just using it as a descriptive term in oppposition to ad-intolerant.

I didn't take it as an ad-hominem. Indeed, I hate the idea of ads in e-books. It was, however, a straw-man argument.

In any case, I think we've arrived at this point: