04-06-2012, 11:38 AM | #16 | |
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04-06-2012, 12:01 PM | #17 |
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I don't agree with the implication, but this reinforces the principle that content providers want it both ways -- all ways, really. They want IP treated as a tangible product when you need to replace or transform your purchase but want it treated as something else when you want to share it.
If I cannot loan my Harry Potter eBook to a friend because I licensed the IP, then I expect that I should be able to transform my books into eBooks at no additional cost. In fact, I think I should be able to 'refresh' my IP when it is no longer consumable in its original form -- whether that be from wear and tear on a book or the fact that my new eReader does not support the format I specified when purchasing the IP. Only among content providers is an act that leaves the victim with no less than they started with called theft. |
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04-06-2012, 01:27 PM | #18 | |||||||||
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2. I'm also not sure whether the exchange would be considered "fair" or not. It's considered legal. Quote:
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As a suggestion for a business model for content providers...well, it sort of sounds like when you have preinstalled "trialware" on a computer you buy. I don't think that's a great model, but some content providers do use it. But I don't see the advantage for something like Amazon or iTunes - and it would require a fairly intrusive scheme to know whether I actually played the content at all. (Sort of like what Amazon and iTunes do for movie rentals, although those expire after a time even if you never watch the movie.) |
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04-06-2012, 01:34 PM | #19 |
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Businesses are in business to sell products. There is nothing implicit in the business model that a business has to accept back a properly-functioning product, just because the purchaser decided not to use it. The fact that a business won't allow you to return, for refund or exchange, one of their products is not a defacto reason of condemnation. |
04-06-2012, 01:46 PM | #20 | |
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04-06-2012, 02:08 PM | #21 |
what if...?
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To Andrew H: "if you sneak the skillet out of the store without paying for it: there is no requirement that you actually use it to make an omelette."
This comparison is wrong and misleading, for two reasons: 1. if I steal a skillet, the shopkeeper does not own it anymore and cannot sell it to someone else; if I illegally download a movie, the publisher does not lose property. 2. if I have a skillet, be it bought or stolen, it is mine. I can sell it, lend it, give it as a gift to a friend, or take it to my new house. If I download (DRM'd) content, I am not allowed to do these things (for "house" read "device"). "Content producers don't tie payment to the act of playing." My point is that in reality they DO, without saying it. Otherwise, how could they complain if you get and play the content (illegally) without any involvement on their part? "As a suggestion for a business model for content providers..." Mine is not a suggestion for a business model: it is a statement (in the form of proposal for legal action) about the unacceptable fact that media companies want all the advantages of selling physical media, AND all the advantages of selling software-like licenses. Wizwor explained this perfectly. |
04-06-2012, 02:12 PM | #22 | |
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04-06-2012, 02:16 PM | #23 | |
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04-06-2012, 02:18 PM | #24 | |||
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Also, they want to retain the right to file civil lawsuits instead of or in addition to criminal ones, so they can get damages. They don't want every downloader of a few dozen MP3s to be hit with a $500 fine and six month's of community service; they want BIIIG penalties. And they can't get that if the "piracy" is treated like replacements for physical objects. Last edited by Elfwreck; 04-06-2012 at 02:24 PM. |
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04-06-2012, 02:37 PM | #25 |
Illiterate
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Ummm, how do you know if you like it or not if you've never played it? If you can tell that you don't like it without playing it, why would you buy it in the first place?
I think the adage "Let the buyer beware." would apply here. |
04-06-2012, 02:37 PM | #26 | |
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1) Media companies sell you content (say, music) in exchange for money. 2) You don't own what you paid for: in fact, you are not allowed to do with it any of the things that you can do with your possessions (e.g., give it to someone else). Actually, the one thing you CAN do with it (so, by definition, the thing that you purchased) is play the content. What the media company has sold you is a license to play the content. 3) However, you don't own the license you paid for. In fact you cannot transfer it to someone else (losing the benefit yourself), even for free. And it can become invalid if you change your playing device. Last edited by BoldlyDubious; 04-06-2012 at 03:21 PM. |
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04-06-2012, 02:47 PM | #27 | |
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For "long-lasting art" that's not a problem: I have hundreds of DVDs and hundreds of CDs, and most of them have been played many times, over tens of years. All "classics" could be thought as belonging to this category. For "short lifespan art" (e.g., blockbuster movies), 24 hours could exhaust all the useful life of the content, though. That's why (in a previous post) I proposed that media companies can tag such items as "non-exchangeable". Of course they should not be allowed to tag all of their output this way ;-) |
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04-06-2012, 03:15 PM | #28 | |
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Suppose that someone illegally gets a movie without even using the Internet (say, because someone gave them the file). Then this person sees the movie and deletes the file, without giving it to someone else. According to the "copyright violation level" scenario, media companies should not care much if such things happen. Instead, it seems to me that they want them fought against. So really, media companies are trying to cover all bases here: the copyright-violation one, but also the "personal use" one. I was focusing on the last one. Mind you, my proposal is not intended as an operative one, but as a basis for debate. I think that media companies should try to empower their customers, keeping them affectionate by providing high-quality content and service, instead of trying to use the law to club them into submission. I am happy to pay for quality content, and do so even when there's no obligation. My "try and -if you don't like it- exchange it" scheme is an example of the customer empowerment I am talking of. |
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04-06-2012, 03:49 PM | #29 | |||
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Removing the barriers to quick & easy exchanges would increase them, which isn't good for businesses, and there's always the chance of fraud: Users who buy a book or movie, watch or read it, and return it, claiming to have not liked it. The hassles of exchange of physical media keeps this practice at a minimum--also, there's no ability to *keep* the physical object. With digital files, a person can keep the file at the same time they "return" it; with no ability to prevent massive returns under false pretenses, most digital business are unwilling to offer exchanges. |
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04-06-2012, 04:10 PM | #30 | ||
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Thank you Elfwreck for your critique. Yes, I know that the logic behind my proposal (it's actually the media companies' logic!) is a bit tortuous. However, my opening post was already too long :-)
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I keep thinking that, over the years of my passion for (obscure) music, I never had the possibility to try before buying. Maybe something I read about. I had to actually buy the LP or CD, bring it home, and find out if I liked the music or not. In this way I bought tens of records that I found out to be uninteresting (along with many other interesting ones). I would certainly have spent more money on music if I was certain that every purchase was worthwhile. And I cringe at the thought of all the exciting music that must have missed because I didn't want to risk the money. And now, that media companies could implement such a scheme at negligible cost... they don't. And they struggle fiercely to keep the old, outdated selling scheme of "first buy, then discover what you've actually bought". What a waste. |
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