What are your views on illegal copying?

Ben Thornton · 02-19-2010, 06:13 AM

I'm interested to see what people's how people feel about different kinds of illegal copying of ebooks. Please check ALL the statements that you AGREE with. The question is how you feel, not what you think the social consensus is, or what the law means. By "copy a book" I mean obtain an electronic copy by any means - darknet, a friend, etc.

1. All illegal copying of books is wrong
2. It's OK to copy a book that is Public Domain in a different country
3. It's OK to copy a book if I bought it new in print (I've paid the author)
4. It's OK to copy a book if I own it in print (I own a paid-up copy)
5. It's OK to copy a book that is not published electronically (I can't buy it)
6. It's OK to copy a book that is not published in my country (I can't buy it here)
7. It's OK to copy a book if the author is dead
8. It's OK to copy a book if I think that the author is rich
9. It's OK to copy a book from mainstream publishers
10. It's always OK to copy (information wants to be free)

kennyc · 02-19-2010, 06:23 AM

I don't call it illegal copying, I call it theft because we have to look at things differently in the Digital age.

I don't like the choices very much either. I think the same concepts should apply to digital as to print. If you make a copy for your own uses without giving it away or sharing with others, then all it's fine. If you "distribute" it to someone else, then it's not. It's boils down to an author's (creator's) rights to me.

Zetmolm · 02-19-2010, 06:24 AM

How about this option:
It's OK to copy a book if I borrowed from the public library (I've paid the author through my library subscription)

And by the way, copying a book for my own use is not illegal in my country (NL).

sabredog · 02-19-2010, 06:31 AM

Geo restrictions prevent readers from buying books they want to pay for. In the end they will consider getting a free copy.

LDBoblo · 02-19-2010, 06:34 AM

Pirates make every story better.

Ben Thornton · 02-19-2010, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyc

I don't call it illegal copying, I call it theft because we have to look at things differently in the Digital age.

I know you do, Kenny, but I was trying to canvas opinion using neutral language.

kennyc · 02-19-2010, 06:37 AM

I get a chuckle out of that last choice. "Information wants to be free" -- maybe we we should pass a lay making

information = corporation = person....

and then we can lobby for information rights and stopping China from Information Rights Abuses!

"Free Information" Now!

kennyc · 02-19-2010, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LDBoblo

Pirates make every story better.

When is "Talk like a Pirate Day" anyway?

kennyc · 02-19-2010, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Thornton

I know you do, Kenny, but I was trying to canvas opinion using neutral language.

Thanks, I appreciate that. I still have to say it though.

LDBoblo · 02-19-2010, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyc

When is "Talk like a Pirate Day" anyway?

September, so we've got a ways to go. However, every day is Act like a Pirate Day!

Ben Thornton · 02-19-2010, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zetmolm

How about this option:
It's OK to copy a book if I borrowed from the public library (I've paid the author through my library subscription)

That's an interesting one. I don't think that I can edit a poll once it's started, but we could repeat in a few months perhaps. Personally, I wouldn't go for that option - authors only get a very small payment for a library loan.

Zetmolm · 02-19-2010, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Thornton

Personally, I wouldn't go for that option - authors only get a very small payment for a library loan.

I don't quite see your point. Whether I borrow a book and read the paper copy, or borrow a book and read an electronic copy I downloaded from elsewhere, the author gets the same payment. Or do you mean to say that you're against library loans in general?

Anyway, interesting poll!

Ben Thornton · 02-19-2010, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zetmolm

I don't quite see your point. Whether I borrow a book and read the paper copy, or borrow a book and read an electronic copy I downloaded from elsewhere, the author gets the same payment. Or do you mean to say that you're against library loans in general?

I think that libraries are great, and have written to mine to try to get them to stock ebooks.

There is a difference between owning a book and borrowing it, which I think it is reasonable to carry through to the digital world. If it's OK to copy a book when you borrow it, authors will lose more profitable sales to library loan + copy.

Katti's Cat · 02-19-2010, 07:23 AM

Well Libraries are free here unless you pre-order a book. Then you pay a nominal fee of AUS$0.55 so the last choice fell out for not applicable.

When is copying unlawful - if I finish a pBook I borrow it to a friend. That's ok, isn't it. When I finish an eBook and send it to friend it's not? Even though I paid the same amount for it? Hmm. Still confused.

I am against pirated books however, I am sure that one day I will give in to temptation just because geo restrictions prevent me from getting the book I want.

I voted for the first option because anything illegal is wrong. Doesn't mean I don't do it just trying not to get caught

Moejoe · 02-19-2010, 07:37 AM

It's always okay, and not only is it always okay on a philosophical and ideological level (pro human, anti-greed), it's also okay because of the practicalities of the digital medium. There is no way to stop sharing, no physical or digital process by which control of a digital object can be achieved. It will occur even if you lock off and put a wall around every part of the internet.

I support and encourage all forms of what you might call 'piracy' and what I would call 'sharing'. My hope is that all digital objects will be reduced to zero in worth and that only those with no idea of profit or gain will create our culture, or that we create our culture together with the culture itself being the reward. What is bad for the coffers of multi-nationals is always good for people.

View Poll Results: What are your views on illegal copying?
All illegal copying of books is wrong	43	13.78%
It's OK to copy a book that is Public Domain in a different country	134	42.95%
It's OK to copy a book if I bought it new in print (I've paid the author)	172	55.13%
It's OK to copy a book if I own it in print (I own a paid-up copy)	181	58.01%
It's OK to copy a book that is not published electronically (I can't buy it)	126	40.38%
It's OK to copy a book that is not published in my country (I can't buy it here)	125	40.06%
It's OK to copy a book if the author is dead	79	25.32%
It's OK to copy a book if I think that the author is rich	19	6.09%
It's OK to copy a book from mainstream publishers	17	5.45%
It's always OK to copy (information wants to be free)	61	19.55%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 312. You may not vote on this poll

02-19-2010, 06:13 AM	#1
Ben Thornton Guru Posts: 900 Karma: 779635 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: UK Device: Kindle 3, iPad 2 (but not for e-books)	What are your views on illegal copying? I'm interested to see what people's how people feel about different kinds of illegal copying of ebooks. Please check ALL the statements that you AGREE with. The question is how you feel, not what you think the social consensus is, or what the law means. By "copy a book" I mean obtain an electronic copy by any means - darknet, a friend, etc. 1. All illegal copying of books is wrong 2. It's OK to copy a book that is Public Domain in a different country 3. It's OK to copy a book if I bought it new in print (I've paid the author) 4. It's OK to copy a book if I own it in print (I own a paid-up copy) 5. It's OK to copy a book that is not published electronically (I can't buy it) 6. It's OK to copy a book that is not published in my country (I can't buy it here) 7. It's OK to copy a book if the author is dead 8. It's OK to copy a book if I think that the author is rich 9. It's OK to copy a book from mainstream publishers 10. It's always OK to copy (information wants to be free)

02-19-2010, 06:23 AM	#2
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,872 Karma: 118716293 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	I don't call it illegal copying, I call it theft because we have to look at things differently in the Digital age. I don't like the choices very much either. I think the same concepts should apply to digital as to print. If you make a copy for your own uses without giving it away or sharing with others, then all it's fine. If you "distribute" it to someone else, then it's not. It's boils down to an author's (creator's) rights to me. Last edited by kennyc; 02-19-2010 at 06:27 AM.

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02-19-2010, 06:24 AM	#3
Zetmolm Guru Posts: 612 Karma: 2031728 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: PocketBook Touch (622), PocketBook Touch Lux 2, Pocketbook Touch HD 3	How about this option: It's OK to copy a book if I borrowed from the public library (I've paid the author through my library subscription) And by the way, copying a book for my own use is not illegal in my country (NL).

02-19-2010, 06:31 AM	#4
sabredog Geographically Restricted Posts: 2,629 Karma: 14933353 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Perth, Australia Device: Sony PRS-T3, Kindle Voyage, iPad Air2, Nexus7v2	Geo restrictions prevent readers from buying books they want to pay for. In the end they will consider getting a free copy.

02-19-2010, 06:34 AM	#5
LDBoblo Wizard Posts: 1,385 Karma: 16056 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Asia Device: Kindle 3 WiFi, Sony PRS-505	Pirates make every story better.

02-19-2010, 06:37 AM	#7
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,872 Karma: 118716293 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	I get a chuckle out of that last choice. "Information wants to be free" -- maybe we we should pass a lay making information = corporation = person.... and then we can lobby for information rights and stopping China from Information Rights Abuses! "Free Information" Now!

02-19-2010, 07:23 AM	#14
Katti's Cat Wizard Posts: 2,259 Karma: 175640 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Brisbane Australia Device: Sony PRS-600	Well Libraries are free here unless you pre-order a book. Then you pay a nominal fee of AUS$0.55 so the last choice fell out for not applicable. When is copying unlawful - if I finish a pBook I borrow it to a friend. That's ok, isn't it. When I finish an eBook and send it to friend it's not? Even though I paid the same amount for it? Hmm. Still confused. I am against pirated books however, I am sure that one day I will give in to temptation just because geo restrictions prevent me from getting the book I want. I voted for the first option because anything illegal is wrong. Doesn't mean I don't do it just trying not to get caught

02-19-2010, 07:37 AM	#15
Moejoe Banned Posts: 5,100 Karma: 72193 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: South of the Border Device: Coffin	It's always okay, and not only is it always okay on a philosophical and ideological level (pro human, anti-greed), it's also okay because of the practicalities of the digital medium. There is no way to stop sharing, no physical or digital process by which control of a digital object can be achieved. It will occur even if you lock off and put a wall around every part of the internet. I support and encourage all forms of what you might call 'piracy' and what I would call 'sharing'. My hope is that all digital objects will be reduced to zero in worth and that only those with no idea of profit or gain will create our culture, or that we create our culture together with the culture itself being the reward. What is bad for the coffers of multi-nationals is always good for people.

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