Considering donating to Sigil? DONT

[tmyke70]

Ok, so.

A few days ago my coworker an I noticed that out of the blue, Sigil would automatically assign the semantics of "Cover" to the first chapter.

I uncheck it and then save it, and its reassigned again. This is an issue because those chapters aren't showing up in the Apple TOC in our iPads.

Previously this was not an issue, and we coded about 100-200 "Books" without experiencing the phenomenon.

Now, it is a fact that I am on a Power PC Mac and can only run 0.2.0, however this was occurring on my coworker's files as well. He is running 0.5.3 on an Intel Mac.

So like any experience internetor
I searched the Sigil website, found nothing.
Looked in the user manual, found nothing.
Searched this forum, found nothing.
Checked out the "Issues" page, found nothing.

After spending several hours scouring the internet and finding nothing, I submitted an issue on the issues page.

I probably should have included more information but this is what I said:

I'm using 0.2.0 on Mac OSX 10.4 PPC, and sigil is adding the semantics of "cover" to my first chapter automatically.
This is really annoying.

This is what john@nachtimwald.com said:

0.2.0 is 2 years and numerous version out of date.

So I said:

It is also happening on my co worker who is using 0.5.3 and is the newest version.

Oh and that response was SUPER helpful.

Thanks.

Then he said:
that bug report was SUPER helpful.

Thanks.

Now, he could have at least told me what I later found out on this very forum, that Sigil will automatically do that, its just part of the program. Which is fine, but it just started doing this week.

I then said:
Ok seriously?

I am using your product and I am having an issue, and all you say is it's out of date, and then mock me? then I went on and gave a more detailed explanation of what was happening.

At the end of the comment I said:
I understand that this is a free software, however I wouldn't pay for it if it wasn't free.

Also I really don't appreciate the lack of help you have been in this matter. When I got your second comment I was furrious.

The level of customer service you have show is leaps and bounds behind almost every company i have needed to contact.

Then Mr. John said:

> I understand that this is a free software, however I wouldn't pay for it if it wasn't free.

Use something else and stop wasting my time.

> The level of customer service you have show is leaps and bounds behind almost every company i have needed to contact.

I'm not a company and you are entitled to nothing. I recommend you find a product you can buy and pay to have someone hold your hand and take your shit. I on the other hand have better things to than put up with you.

If you are having a problem Sigil is open source. Learn to code and fix any perceived problems yourself.

In short go away and annoy someone else with your incompetence.

Ok, really? While I may not have known that the Issues site was solely for Bugs, at the time I thought it was a bug.

My ignorance of that fact (Which was caused by a lack of information on the Sigil website) does not allow the dickishness that I experienced.

Wouldn't a person who wants people to donate to their software project try to be a little professional or nice?

I mean come on, I can put up with a buggy software if you treat me with some respect as a person. Instead Mr. John choose to sit atop his high horse of "I CAN CODE, AND YOU CANNOT" and talk down to me like an infant.

I'm not stupid John. You could have just answered my question instead of acting like a total Douche.

Thanks.

[DaleDe]

I hope you got this out of your system but you were certainly as bad as John was, maybe worse. His original response was not to dish you at all. He only said that 2.0 was very old and no longer supported. This is very common for software. If you wrote an issue about Microsoft Word 97 you would likely get a very similar response. You seemed to take it personal but it was, I am sure, not meant as a dig to you personally except that you asked for support on software that none of the current coders wrote and most have never even seen. The first dishing was yours complaining he was SUPER helpful. Now that you said it was also in current software then this could be ok but you dished him and he responded in kind! What did you expect? You get the behavior you give often. In this forum there were all sorts of responses to your questions to try and get more details and help you solve the problem. Everyone here are trying to be helpful and eventually got to the resolution.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion but you are not likely to make friends with your attitude.

Dale

[Thalia Helikon]

tmyke70, I am using Mac 10.4 on PPC. I plan to keep using my G4 until the hardware bites the dust. I'm not always happy with the software versions I'm stuck with. and I am stuck with Calibre version 0.7.28 and Sigil version 0.2.4.

I'm surprised you are using an iPad, because Apple told me that 10.4 won't talk to the new generations of iPods/Pads. My processor can't handle Snow Leopard, but the new generations of iPods/Pads require 10.6++. Apple basically told me to abandon my G4 and get new hardware, in order to manage my books and music on my iPod.

So here's the deal. Some people are developing Sigil out of the goodness of their heart, to perform a task that helps us enjoy our books. They don't have the resources to support old versions. You can suck it up and take it like a grown up, or you can have a public tantrum with multicolored fonts to express your outrage.

[cybmole]

You can suck it up and take it like a grown up, or you can have a public tantrum with multicolored fonts to express your outrage.

+1

:-)

[morantis]

I had the same issue and found that there was some hidden formatting present on the first page.

[Toxaris]

Whoopopidoe. So, blown of steam? DaleDe already indicated that you started of wrong and I agree.
When you enter an issue in Sigil, there is a link describing how to issue a good report. It helps you even more by already giving you some questions to answer. In all fairness, your posts did not follow those strong recommendations. Your second post would have been accepted by John is you didn't put in the 'SUPERhelpful', but just added the information for the recent version. From there it went downhill of course.
Of course not everything can be described in manuals, especially a lot of automated stuff. That is not different from any other (paid) product. Also, support for older versions is almost never done. It is too expensive (hardware-wise) and too complicated code-wise.

This reaction is very, very childish. Numerous people work with Sigil, even professionals. They are all wrong?

Then again, you say 'This is an issue because those chapters aren't showing up in the Apple TOC in our iPads.'. I assume you mean iBooks. Does this also occur in ADE? If so, it might be that iBooks is in the wrong here. Not very unusual. Are you going to rant to Apple too? Good luck with that.

[Freeshadow]

Well had you said you have an issue which is still actual on the current version instead of complaining about the levels of helpfulness all d have gone a different path.
Instead you chose to use the c-word.
Never ever tell someone whom you haven't hired or paid that you are a customer. You are not.
Since you are not:
1. Give help yourself by providing as much data about a bug as possible, that's the kind of work users can do.
2. Or as John proposed: Sit down and code it yourself. The code is available, so feel free to do it better

[Billi]

Originally Posted by tmyke70

Previously this was not an issue, and we coded about 100-200 "Books" without experiencing the phenomenon.

Before previously, have you ever considered donating to Sigil? Or done it?

[exaltedwombat]

Originally Posted by Thalia Helikon

tmyke70, I am using Mac 10.4 on PPC. I plan to keep using my G4 until the hardware bites the dust. I'm not always happy with the software versions I'm stuck with. and I am stuck with Calibre version 0.7.28 and Sigil version 0.2.4.

So get unstuck! A computer is merely a device that enables software. It sounds like your software requirements have outgrown the G4. You'll be amazed how affordable and effecient a Windows 7 system is these days. Or even pay the Mac Tax if you see an advantage.

[Thalia Helikon]

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

So get unstuck! A computer is merely a device that enables software. It sounds like your software requirements have outgrown the G4. You'll be amazed how affordable and effecient a Windows 7 system is these days. Or even pay the Mac Tax if you see an advantage.

Thanks wombat! I'm not bitter about the G4-- it's close to end of life and I'll replace it with Windows 7. I would never pay the Mac Tax, I'm a PC person thru&thru. We have a half dozen computers in the house-- but I have exclusive rights to the g4 [probably because no one else wants to use it!!]

[twowheels]

Issue Submission, Post #1:

[...]This is really annoying.

Yep... off to a great start... and it went downhill from there.

You come across -- both in the messages you claim to have sent, and in this post -- as a self-entitled, spoiled brat. Maybe that doesn't describe you in real life, but given that I have no other post history to judge you on, being as you're new here, good job on the first impression.

Oh, and welcome to Mobile Read!

[ivanjt]

I too only have v0.2.0 to use on OS/2 and it does most of the basic things I need. I also use v0.5.3 in a virtual windows machine hosted on my OS/2.

Yes, I like v0.5.3 and hope that eventually one of the guys that ports QT4 apps to OS/2 will find the time to do so with it.

I don't know if the original poster has even thought to try a VM, or even if the mac os will support that, but I get the same impression that twowheels does and I must say it is not the way I would expect anyone to ask for help.

[user_none]

Originally Posted by tmyke70

Ok, really? While I may not have known that the Issues site was solely for Bugs, at the time I thought it was a bug.

Then why did you actively delete the bug format template and ignore the how to post a bug report link that is present to you when filing a bug report? The original report wasn't helpful in any way.

Originally Posted by tmyke70

My ignorance of that fact (Which was caused by a lack of information on the Sigil website) does not allow the dickishness that I experienced.

If by now you don't understand that people will treat you based on the way you treat them then you are hopeless.

Originally Posted by tmyke70

Wouldn't a person who wants people to donate to their software project try to be a little professional or nice?

If money was the object Sigil would be sold not given way freely.

Originally Posted by tmyke70

I mean come on, I can put up with a buggy software if you treat me with some respect as a person. Instead Mr. John choose to sit atop his high horse of "I CAN CODE, AND YOU CANNOT" and talk down to me like an infant.

You are an infant. You didn't get your way on the issue tracker so you come here and post about how terrible Sigil is and how badly you've been treated. You are vindictive. Every action you've taken since first opening an issue has been negative, nonconstructive, unhelpful and done out of malice.

Every action you have taken aside from the first unhelpful bug report has been to bad mouth Sigil and make yourself out to be a victim of software you get for free and choose to use. If you have a problem with Sigil I suggest you use something else.

Originally Posted by tmyke70

I'm not stupid John.

That I can't comment on but I can say you are a hateful person who think the world owes them everything. I especially like the uses selective quotes. Especially how you leave out your own responses.

[RobynsVeil]

Stepping up on my own podium, this is classic for "pay-for" software users who don't "get" OSS. Don't get it at all. Which is why they call themselves "customers". And is why they get demanding and don't even try to figure out how the "system" of OSS works.
We're seeing it now in the Linux community more and more, as people migrate from Windows and yet don't seem to understand that OSS is about community effort, not about clients and products and companies and market share.
In the "worst case", they throw their little 'tantie' (Aussie for tantrum) as T-Mikie did, and storm off, putting a bad taste in the mouth of those who are giving of their time and effort to make something useful. Please ignore these childish demanding 'customers' - like we say in the Linux community "and if you break it, you get to keep both pieces".

BTW, I did donate. Not much - because I'm on a tight budget - but I figure than if everyone does their little bit, incredibly fine products like these will continue to flourish. Thank you for your fine work, all who have been a part of this. This is a beautiful programme!

[Freeshadow]

personally I tought that after such a long lasting popularity FOSS in general experienced even the very last user understands what the "free" in it means.
To actually see that there are still exceptions to that is so astonishing that I can't even laugh about the whole matter.