Keep text together in EPUB

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by slm

Scrolls are 2000+ years ago. I doubt unrolling a scroll to go to the next page was ever referred to as "scrolling."

Line perhaps. Scrolls do not have pages.

[slm]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Line perhaps. Scrolls do not have pages.

It sounds like you've never actually read from a scroll.

Actually, a scroll has pages (unless it is very short)--the sheets are sewn together to make a roll, but you read them one column at a time. When the next column is not visible, you unroll the scroll a bit more (and roll up the scroll to cover part of what was already read).

See, for example, this image of a scroll open for reading:
https://www.worldhistory.org/image/637/torah/
(I would include the image, but I know Mobileread has size restrictions that I don't know how to deal with.)

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by slm

It sounds like you've never actually read from a scroll.

Actually, a scroll has pages (unless it is very short)--the sheets are sewn together to make a roll, but you read them one column at a time. When the next column is not visible, you unroll the scroll a bit more (and roll up the scroll to cover part of what was already read).

See, for example, this image of a scroll open for reading:
https://www.worldhistory.org/image/637/torah/
(I would include the image, but I know Mobileread has size restrictions that I don't know how to deal with.)

Actually I have. The scroll was scrolled sideways 6-8 centimetres at a time by the person handling it. The whole white gloves and temperature and humidity controlled environment. Admittedly, it was written top to bottom and read right to left so different from the Torah which is read top to bottom and written right to left so breaking the text into columns makes sense. Us menial techs were needed for a project digitizing some scrolls to make them easier and safer to study but we left actually touching the scrolls to the professionals. We also had some bamboo/wooden stick stitched together items which dated back before the invention of paper which were equally fun to work with.

Edit: added image from Wikipedia of the bound stick book though this one is (I think) an 18th century reproduction of The Art of War.

As for adding the image you linked? In Advanced mode, click on Download Full Size Image link. Once it is downloaded, click on either the paperclip icon at the top of the message box or the Manage Attachments button below the message box. To add another image, just click on the next browse button.

[RbnJrg]

All epub3 eresders I know honor orphans and widows. And if you (I mean the OP) wants to avoid widows, use the following code:

p {
   ...
   orphans: 1;
   widows: 2;
}

or

p {
   ...
   orphans: 2;
   widows: 2 !important;
}

The last option deals with paragraph of three lines forcing a single line at the end of the page and two lines at the beginning of the next. In all others cases will have (at least) two lines of text at the beginning and end of a page (with the last option). But personally, I prefer the first option.

[swepub]

Thanks for all feedback!!
Now I got
som
e interesting ideas to p
ick and choose
from

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by swepub

Thanks for all feedback!!
Now I got
som
e interesting ideas to p
ick and choose
from

IMHO, most people will not like widows and orphans being used with a phone or Reader. So turn them off with a vale of 1.

[Turtle91]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

IMHO, most people will not like widows and orphans being used with a phone or Reader. So turn them off with a vale of 1.

YOU don't like it - got it. Other people, like the OP, actually want to know how to do it...that's why they ask their question.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

YOU don't like it - got it. Other people, like the OP, actually want to know how to do it...that's why they ask their question.

But for commercial use, widows and orphans should be turned off as most people do not edit eBooks and (IMHO) would want them off.

[Turtle91]

And what study/research/survey/poll is your assumption based upon??

Not everyone always agrees with you, and your opinion is just that. Nothing wrong with your opinion, just don’t put it out there as what everybody should do.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

IMHO, most people will not like widows and orphans being used with a phone or Reader. So turn them off with a vale of 1.

Can you cite a poll?

Again you are misusing the term. This word does not mean what you think it means.

Having maximum whitespace and doing nothing (widows and orphans =1) creates widows and orphans. A single line at the bottom of a page that's actually the start of a paragraph, or single word (or a line) at the top of a page, which might otherwise be empty. The setting was invented before ebooks so as this doesn't happen or can be controlled. A setting of 2 was thought to be a minimum for readability. A higher setting might be appropriate in some situations.

I know some people like to have the screen filled (see also TV screens, either 4:3 or 16:9 and movies can have nearly any aspect, so unless you want bits chopped off, the black bars are good), but other people prefer readability.

Perhaps there should be a GUI setting to override widows and orphan reduction, padding and margins so as to "fill the screen" like TVs have. But I think (without any meaningful poll) that most people haven't thought about it at all, or wouldn't like seeing single orphaned or widowed lines (but they don't because the default is 2 and most never edit ebooks).

[JSWolf]

Actually, this is the way it's recommended to do widows and orphans.

orphans: 1
widows: 2

https://raider.pressbooks.pub/pressb...ttom-balancing

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Actually, this is the way it's recommended to do widows and orphans.

orphans: 1
widows: 2

https://raider.pressbooks.pub/pressb...ttom-balancing

By one organisation. Different places have different views. There is no "right" answer, which it why it's in many style guides. Clue in calling them "guides"!

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Quoth

By one organisation. Different places have different views. There is no "right" answer, which it why it's in many style guides. Clue in calling them "guides"!

Given that we cannot come up with the best way to handle widows and orphans for eBooks, I go with values of 1 so we don't have them. You don't have them, they cannot bother anyone who does not like them and I think most others would not notice.

[RbnJrg]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Given that we cannot come up with the best way to handle widows and orphans for eBooks, I go with values of 1 so we don't have them. You don't have them, they cannot bother anyone who does not like them and I think most others would not notice.

When at the end of a chapter you have the last page with only one word and the rest of that page is blank, take for sure that the widow is noticiable (and unwanted). At least, the last paragraph of a chapter must have a style with widows: 2.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by RbnJrg

When at the end of a chapter you have the last page with only one word and the rest of that page is blank, take for sure that the widow is noticiable (and unwanted). At least, the last paragraph of a chapter must have a style with widows: 2.

That's actually a good idea.