What do you think the Amazon Kindle means for the Sony Readers?

edsohsmith · 11-18-2007, 12:39 PM

I am curious what the members of this Forum think. Will the Kindle have a positive or negative effect on:

The ebook market as a whole?

The sales of rival ebook readers, in particular the Sony Reader?

If Amazon were to allow it, do you think Sony would adopt Amazon's DRM ebook format? Would the pending Borders / Sony agreement bar Sony from attempting to add compatibility with Amazon's store?

Bob Russell · 11-18-2007, 12:55 PM

Sony had indicated not too long ago that they are interested in adopting other formats on the Reader, which likely implies or at least includes MobiPocket. But it seems Amazon is either not interested in sharing, or not interested in investing resources toward that end.

Wouldn't you like to be a fly on the wall and hear the inside scoop on discussions of that type!? Unfortunately, barring that extreme form of horror film metamorphisis, we'll just have to guess based on obscure hints from the actual players.

vivaldirules · 11-18-2007, 12:57 PM

Competition for providing ebooks and ebook readers has to be a good thing. If 88,000 titles are immediately available for the Kindle, that's still only 1% of the total number of pbooks available at Amazon. So there's a long way to go and I think this is a very positive step for ebooks in general. For Sony, I will guess that this will hurt them in the short term. But if they stay competitive in technology (i.e., for future Reader models) and in providing content, this competition will only help drive demand and will be positive for them in the future.

vivaldirules · 11-18-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edsohsmith

If Amazon were to allow it, do you think Sony would adopt Amazon's DRM ebook format? Would the pending Borders / Sony agreement bar Sony from attempting to add compatibility with Amazon's store?

Oh, yes. Someone please explain this again. I'm lost over the Borders / Sony agreement. Right now, if you look at Border's web site, they show prominently at the top "Teamed with Amazon.com". So Sony is climbing in bed with Borders who is already in bed with Amazon. Amazon is about to become Sony's major competitor in this business. Is Amazon breaking up with Borders or is this going to be some very strange threesome? And is the Borders / Sony relationship still pending or is it certain?

Alexander Turcic · 11-18-2007, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vivaldirules

Is Amazon breaking up with Borders or is this going to be some very strange threesome? And is the Borders / Sony relationship still pending or is it certain?

I know Sony and Border were still cooperating when the PRS-505 was introduced. What happened since then, I don't know.

I also recall that in March 2007, Borders announced that it it would end its partnership with Amazon and launch its own sales Web site early next year.

vivaldirules · 11-18-2007, 01:31 PM

Thanks, Alexander. That explains a lot. I hope we see something soon from the Borders / Sony collaboration.

kezza · 11-18-2007, 02:15 PM

Yeah, early next year Borders is relaunching borders.com as its own e-commerce site, and will supposedly start selling Sony books there. The article I found that stated all this was from September, so the timing may no longer be accurate. I did notice, however, that within the first week of owning my 505 the Sony Connect software added a Borders logo to the top of the store.
Here's the article about Borders and Sony, and the new borders.com:
http://www.publishersweekly.com/article/CA6480000.html

About 10 years ago I had a large number of friends working for Borders, and they all lamented how poorly borders.com was doing. A few years later they had closed up shop and just slapped their name on an amazon.com store. I'm not exactly holding my breath that borders.com will survive this time around.

RWood · 11-18-2007, 02:39 PM

Since we know very little of what the Kindle really does it is hard to speculate if there is even the ability to load non-Amazon content to the unit except through their dedicated email interface. If that is true then, like the iPod at the start, it is the world vs. the Kindle. If all of PG is off-limits except for those books forwarded as docs or pdfs in email then there is a bright future for all of the other readers.

If the Kindle sells then there is a good chance that more and more books will be available in other formats unless Amazon has an exclusive agreement for a lot of the content.

NatCh · 11-18-2007, 03:12 PM

I think this will be good for e-books in general, as it will demonstrate to the general public that yet another heavy hitter in the book world thinks they're a good idea. Amazon has a lot of weight to throw around, so they can potentially knock a lot of publishers off the fence on the matter.

I think the biggest potential to negatively impact the Sony Reader is if mobi were to become the de-facto standard for e-books. If that happens, then all Sony would really have to do is support mobi format on their devices.

The impression I have is the same as Bob Russell on the matter: Amazon isn't interested in talking about that presently, or more accurately the impression I get is that Amazon isn't real interested in discussing mobi support as anything other than a sole option on a dedicated reading device. If that is the case, and they stick to it, I s'pose that as a last resort Sony could convert to sole mobi support and convert their existing holdings to mobi format for their ConnStore customers to re-download.

But I wouldn't look for that to happen unless mobi pretty much squeezes all the other formats totally out, and still won't entertain cohabitation with support of other formats, and I wouldn't expect it for quite some time in the future, if at all.

Barcey · 11-18-2007, 03:28 PM

If it's successful it can only be a good thing for the whole electronic book market. When people see the potential to make money they'll throw more money at it and we'll see better cheaper devices. The increased competition should see the cost of the electronic books drop to reflect the true cost savings in not have to print, ship, store, display and return paper books.

If they become the dominant format for electronic books then maybe it will follow the iTunes example where other companies will decide that the only way they can compete is to offer DRM free distributions and Amazon will have to get rid of DRM as well so they don't lose the market. I can only dream.

vivaldirules · 11-18-2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatCh

...then all Sony would really have to do is support mobi format on their devices.

But that would require Amazon to agree to let Sony use that format, wouldn't it? Seems pretty unlikely to me that Amazon would do that.

Barcey · 11-18-2007, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vivaldirules

But that would require Amazon to agree to let Sony use that format, wouldn't it? Seems pretty unlikely to me that Amazon would do that.

If they are in the business of selling books why would they care? They allow other online vendors to sell Mobipocket formatted books and they allow other vendors to run Mobipocket readers on their devices. Maybe this is the business model they inherited when they purchased Mobipocket but I haven't seen them reverse it yet.

They might be trying to hardball Sony into giving up their BBEB format but I'm not on the inside to know. I haven't seen Sony allow anyone else to sell their BBEB format or allow it to run on other readers.

vivaldirules · 11-18-2007, 04:04 PM

Good points! Maybe hope is not lost that ebooks that Amazon sells will show up on my Sony Reader afterall.

wheels2040 · 11-18-2007, 06:17 PM

For me, the Kindle is no competition. As a new user, I like the 505 for what it is, a reader. I dont have a need to search for text, highlight or browse the internet. I like the form factor of the Sony too. Now if the Kindle causes Sony to support more ebook formats and increases my selection of books, thats great and I welcome that.

Nate the great · 11-18-2007, 06:44 PM

It means Sony blew their chance to lead the market.

I want to add one caveat. I only make this prediction because I believe Amazon won't screw up this golden opportunity.

11-18-2007, 12:39 PM	#1
edsohsmith Connoisseur Posts: 69 Karma: 11 Join Date: Oct 2007 Device: Sony PRS 505 (soon)	What do you think the Amazon Kindle means for the Sony Readers? I am curious what the members of this Forum think. Will the Kindle have a positive or negative effect on: The ebook market as a whole? The sales of rival ebook readers, in particular the Sony Reader? If Amazon were to allow it, do you think Sony would adopt Amazon's DRM ebook format? Would the pending Borders / Sony agreement bar Sony from attempting to add compatibility with Amazon's store?

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11-18-2007, 12:55 PM	#2
Bob Russell Recovering Gadget Addict Posts: 5,381 Karma: 676161 Join Date: May 2004 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Device: iPad	Sony had indicated not too long ago that they are interested in adopting other formats on the Reader, which likely implies or at least includes MobiPocket. But it seems Amazon is either not interested in sharing, or not interested in investing resources toward that end. Wouldn't you like to be a fly on the wall and hear the inside scoop on discussions of that type!? Unfortunately, barring that extreme form of horror film metamorphisis, we'll just have to guess based on obscure hints from the actual players.

11-18-2007, 12:57 PM	#3
vivaldirules When's Doughnut Day? Posts: 10,059 Karma: 13675475 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Houston, TX, US Device: Sony PRS-505, iPad	Competition for providing ebooks and ebook readers has to be a good thing. If 88,000 titles are immediately available for the Kindle, that's still only 1% of the total number of pbooks available at Amazon. So there's a long way to go and I think this is a very positive step for ebooks in general. For Sony, I will guess that this will hurt them in the short term. But if they stay competitive in technology (i.e., for future Reader models) and in providing content, this competition will only help drive demand and will be positive for them in the future.

11-18-2007, 01:31 PM	#6
vivaldirules When's Doughnut Day? Posts: 10,059 Karma: 13675475 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Houston, TX, US Device: Sony PRS-505, iPad	Thanks, Alexander. That explains a lot. I hope we see something soon from the Borders / Sony collaboration.

11-18-2007, 02:15 PM	#7
kezza Lowlife of the Party Posts: 266 Karma: 4038 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: seattle Device: nook, iphone	Yeah, early next year Borders is relaunching borders.com as its own e-commerce site, and will supposedly start selling Sony books there. The article I found that stated all this was from September, so the timing may no longer be accurate. I did notice, however, that within the first week of owning my 505 the Sony Connect software added a Borders logo to the top of the store. Here's the article about Borders and Sony, and the new borders.com: http://www.publishersweekly.com/article/CA6480000.html About 10 years ago I had a large number of friends working for Borders, and they all lamented how poorly borders.com was doing. A few years later they had closed up shop and just slapped their name on an amazon.com store. I'm not exactly holding my breath that borders.com will survive this time around.

11-18-2007, 02:39 PM	#8
RWood Technogeezer Posts: 7,233 Karma: 1601464 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Virginia, USA Device: Sony PRS-500	Since we know very little of what the Kindle really does it is hard to speculate if there is even the ability to load non-Amazon content to the unit except through their dedicated email interface. If that is true then, like the iPod at the start, it is the world vs. the Kindle. If all of PG is off-limits except for those books forwarded as docs or pdfs in email then there is a bright future for all of the other readers. If the Kindle sells then there is a good chance that more and more books will be available in other formats unless Amazon has an exclusive agreement for a lot of the content.

11-18-2007, 03:12 PM	#9
NatCh Gizmologist Posts: 11,615 Karma: 929550 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Republic of Texas Embassy at Jackson, TN Device: Pocketbook Touch HD3	I think this will be good for e-books in general, as it will demonstrate to the general public that yet another heavy hitter in the book world thinks they're a good idea. Amazon has a lot of weight to throw around, so they can potentially knock a lot of publishers off the fence on the matter. I think the biggest potential to negatively impact the Sony Reader is if mobi were to become the de-facto standard for e-books. If that happens, then all Sony would really have to do is support mobi format on their devices. The impression I have is the same as Bob Russell on the matter: Amazon isn't interested in talking about that presently, or more accurately the impression I get is that Amazon isn't real interested in discussing mobi support as anything other than a sole option on a dedicated reading device. If that is the case, and they stick to it, I s'pose that as a last resort Sony could convert to sole mobi support and convert their existing holdings to mobi format for their ConnStore customers to re-download. But I wouldn't look for that to happen unless mobi pretty much squeezes all the other formats totally out, and still won't entertain cohabitation with support of other formats, and I wouldn't expect it for quite some time in the future, if at all.

11-18-2007, 03:28 PM	#10
Barcey Wizard Posts: 1,531 Karma: 8059866 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Canada Device: Kobo H2O / Aura HD / Glo / iPad3	If it's successful it can only be a good thing for the whole electronic book market. When people see the potential to make money they'll throw more money at it and we'll see better cheaper devices. The increased competition should see the cost of the electronic books drop to reflect the true cost savings in not have to print, ship, store, display and return paper books. If they become the dominant format for electronic books then maybe it will follow the iTunes example where other companies will decide that the only way they can compete is to offer DRM free distributions and Amazon will have to get rid of DRM as well so they don't lose the market. I can only dream.

11-18-2007, 04:04 PM	#13
vivaldirules When's Doughnut Day? Posts: 10,059 Karma: 13675475 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Houston, TX, US Device: Sony PRS-505, iPad	Good points! Maybe hope is not lost that ebooks that Amazon sells will show up on my Sony Reader afterall.

11-18-2007, 06:17 PM	#14
wheels2040 Member Posts: 12 Karma: 10 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Device: Sony PRS-505 Reader	For me, the Kindle is no competition. As a new user, I like the 505 for what it is, a reader. I dont have a need to search for text, highlight or browse the internet. I like the form factor of the Sony too. Now if the Kindle causes Sony to support more ebook formats and increases my selection of books, thats great and I welcome that.

11-18-2007, 06:44 PM	#15
Nate the great Sir Penguin of Edinburgh Posts: 12,375 Karma: 23555235 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: DC Metro area Device: Shake a stick plus 1	It means Sony blew their chance to lead the market. I want to add one caveat. I only make this prediction because I believe Amazon won't screw up this golden opportunity.

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