<div> problem

[alheva]

Hi, I really love Marvin 2.9 but now I am learning to like many features of Marvin 3.

My main problem is with some tags that Marvin 3 seems not to understand.

Look at this, please:

Marvin 2.9



Marvin 3


In CSS the tags are:

<div class="cita"> or
<p class="cita">

And "cita" is defined this way:

.cita { margin:1.5em; font-size:.9em; }

When I change <p class="cita"> to <blockquote> every thing works well.

The problem is that changing tags will take a lot of time and it is worse when the tag is <div class="whatever">. Almost all my files are formated that way, with class="cita". But the same happens with any other name (quote, verso, etc) when following a <div or <p.

Curiously both Marvin 2.* and MapleRead -used to compare- don´t have any problem with those tags.

(I am using Ipad and just updated to M3.6.; so far no changes)

Thanks a lot in advance

[Turtle91]

Hello, welcome to MR!

Not sure why, but your images aren't displaying properly. If you used the "insert image" button, then the link doesn't seem to work. I would use the paperclip to attach the image instead.

As far as the <div> tags are concerned... Have you turned on "Publisher's layout" in Marvin 3? You have to do that each time a new book is opened.

Cheers,

[alheva]

Thanks. You are right: "publisher´s layout" works fine. But I would like to use Marvin´s. I don´t understand why it works on Marvin 2.9, but not on Marvin 3. Marvin layout gives more options .... specially for people with sight problems.

(Images are working for me, when logged)

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by alheva

I don´t understand why it works on Marvin 2.9, but not on Marvin 3.

Marvin 3 was "written from the ground up", so quite a few things that used to work in Marvin 2 do not (or initiallly did not) work in Marvin 3. Some of the lost features/capabilities were restored during the (imperfect) Marvin 3 beta-testing, but not all of them. Looks like this <div> issue might be one of them.

PS: Images indeed do not display in your opening post. You can't directly link images posted to MobileRead "albums" that way; that button only works for linking to images posted on external sites. You can attach images to your post using the attachment button, though, as has been mentioned.

[alheva]

Originally Posted by Faterson

Some of the lost features/capabilities were restored during the (imperfect) Marvin 3 beta-testing, but not all of them. Looks like this <div> issue might be one of them.

As I said before, it is not only a <div> but a <p> problem as well, when some margin definition is involved.... I guess...

In Marvin 2.9 I almost always use these tags:

<div class="xxx"> or
<p class="xxx">

And "xxx" is defined this way:

.xxx { margin:1.5em; font-size:.9em; }

Also the issue happens when I use:
.xxx { margin:15%; font-size:.9em; } or something like that...

I really will appreciate your comments

[JSWolf]

In the case of your .cita class, it's bad form to use it the way you are using it. a blockquote I what hold be used. Simulating a blockquote is a bad idea.

But I agree that the poor code should work.

[Turtle91]

The way I understand it - Marvin intentionally overrides the ebook's settings for margins, paragraph spacing, font size, etc. This allows the user to change them to their liking AND helps to clean up poorly formatted books...which is a very large portion of those found in the retail world (Amazon self-publishers I'm looking at you)...but it also results in losing the formatting as you have it coded in the CSS using the div or p tags. If you use a blockquote Marvin understands the intent and formats it fairly close. To get the exact formatting you've coded when designing your book, you must select publisher's layout.

[JSWolf]

Turtle91, it is not Marvin overriding the CSS. It's a bug.

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by alheva

As I said before, it is not only a <div> but a <p> problem as well, when some margin definition is involved.... I guess...

Yes, I believe you. As far as I'm aware, even Marvin 2 wasn't perfect in capturing all the margin (etc.) nuances, and it appears that Marvin 3 has some catching up to do so that it at least reaches Marvin 2's levels of rendering of those style properties. I can confirm that during Marvin 3 beta-testing, Kris ironed out some rendering bugs in this area, but, apparently, not all of them as of today.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Turtle91, it is not Marvin overriding the CSS. It's a bug.

Definitely. Let's not mention "publisher layout" in this connection at all – in my years of using Marvin, I haven't touched that button once. The whole point of using Marvin, as I understand it, is to get away from publisher's layout, thanks to all the wonderful Marvin customization options, right? But the type of style properties that Alheva talks about definitely should be preserved even when using Marvin's default presentation mode (the customizable one).

[Turtle91]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Turtle91, it is not Marvin overriding the CSS. It's a bug.

Not sure where you got the information to make this statement?? Especially when selecting publisher's layout actually fixes the problem as I said...

Thanks. You are right: "publisher´s layout" works fine. But I would like to use Marvin´s. I don´t understand why it works on Marvin 2.9, but not on Marvin 3. Marvin layout gives more options .... specially for people with sight problems.

I got my information from Kris when I talked to him about this kind of issue (not following publisher's margin settings) during beta testing. I could probably find the email with his exact response on it if you would pay me an hourly wage to find it... Granted, it was during beta testing of Marvin 2 - and I may be remembering imprecisely - but I'm pretty sure it is along those same lines. It is for exactly those reasons that I continue to use Publisher's Layout...it displays the book exactly as I design it. I don't have to worry about the book being put through Marvin's set of assumptions on what it thinks looks good. Yes, Marvin's layout looks good for most books, and it makes some of those awful editing jobs look better, but there are some things you have to deal with - like margins not being exactly like you wish. I choose to read the books exactly as I designed them - so publisher's layout!

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

Not sure where you got the information to make this statement??

It's not "information" – it's years of experience from using Marvin. Now that we can finally look at Alheva's two pictures in his opening post (thanks for re-uploading them), there is no excuse for Marvin 3 to mangle the display of paragraphs the way it can be seen in the second screenshot, especially when compared with the first screenshot. When Marvin 2 could treat these particular instances of styling reasonably, why should Marvin 3 fail to do so?

And as you know, there are many other examples, unrelated to rendering, in which Marvin 2 can do something that Marvin 3 currently cannot. So, as I said, Marvin 3 still has some catching up to do, which is understandable for a piece of software that was "(re-)written from the ground up".

[alheva]

Originally Posted by Faterson

The whole point of using Marvin, as I understand it, is to get away from publisher's layout, thanks to all the wonderful Marvin customization options, right?

Agreed. As an intense user of Marvin 2.9, I would like to know what Kguil thinks about this issue.

As JSWolf says: It's a bug

Anyway, thanks for your opinions and feed-backs....

[Turtle91]

Originally Posted by alheva

Agreed. As an intense user of Marvin 2.9, I would like to know what Kguil thinks about this issue.

As JSWolf says: It's a bug

Anyway, thanks for your opinions and feed-backs....

Just keep in mind the difference between a "bug" and a "feature" that you don't like or don't agree with.

A bug is something that is not intended.
A feature is intended to do what it does.

In this case - assuming Kris has stuck with the same methodology he was intentionally using before - then it is a feature of Marvin's that you don't agree with.

Personally speaking, I don't like that feature either, I would like Marvin to honor MY design specifications that I put into my CSS and clean up the bad css from other editors...while still giving me the options to change font/margins/colors/etc. If anyone has the programming chutzpah to make constructive suggestions, then I'm sure Kris will be happy to listen.

Cheers,

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

In this case - assuming Kris has stuck with the same methodology he was intentionally using before - then it is a feature

Of course it's not. Alheva, you may safely ignore Turtle – that is his standard response in all threads, regardless of the issue discussed: "It's a feature, not a bug. Don't you dare utter the slightest suggestion of the faintest criticism of Marvin."

[JSWolf]

I agree that Turtle is wrong here. It's not a design choice. It is a bug.