Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-22-2012, 03:26 PM   #46
spindlegirl
Wizard
spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.spindlegirl ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
spindlegirl's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,594
Karma: 21245891
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Canada
Device: Kobo Libra h20, Paperwhite 2017, Phone & Tablet w Moonreader
After reading all of the above posts I am glad I have liberated all my freebies and purchased material and kept it.
spindlegirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 03:27 PM   #47
Lutraa
Well Read
Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Lutraa ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Lutraa's Avatar
 
Posts: 84
Karma: 1983386
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Far North
Device: KK 3G, K4B, Nook HD+, Galaxy S3
To echo others' best practices:

1) Don't use your eReader to store your library. Use Calibre on a computer and back its library up often.

2) Don't rely on cloud storage alone for anything. If you do, you will be completely dependent on your internet connection, and on events beyond your control (like fire, bankruptcy, lawsuits, wars, etc.) that render the cloud servers temporarily or permanently inaccessible.

3) Don't keep your device's wireless connection "on" all the time. I know K users need this in order to synch between two devices, but it runs down your battery and makes it easier for Amazon to do things it shouldn't. I turn on my devices once or twice a month and monitor downloads etc. If I saw content start to disappear from my home screen, I'd turn the wireless off in a flash.

Finally, if this ever happened to me, I would seek redress through my credit card issuing bank, requesting a chargeback for the total value of all the books that disappeared. Even if Amazon is on the right side of the law with regards to deleting entire accounts when owners violate their terms of service, that does not give them the right to keep the money used to purchase the eBook licenses once the license has been revoked.
Lutraa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:03 PM   #48
BoldlyDubious
what if...?
BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BoldlyDubious ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
BoldlyDubious's Avatar
 
Posts: 209
Karma: 750870
Join Date: Feb 2011
Device: paper & electrophoretic
Even if Amazon will give back to the unfortunate (or willingly malicious: this is really not relevant here) Norwegian user the full price of her books, the fact remains that content distribution business models like Amazon's Kindle grant all the rights to the seller and none to the purchaser. So much so, that the "purchaser" does not actually own anything.

This is bad for many reasons. To name one that people usually don't think about: if things go on like this, most of our children will NOT be able to build on their parents' collection of media. Such collections, actually being services tied to physical persons, will die with them. Libraries (and music collections) will have to be rebuilt from scratch at each new generation. However, young people will simply not have the money to re-purchase all the culture that their parents needed a lifetime to accumulate: so they will not even try. It's easy to understand how over the long run this can be very bad for the literacy, and general cultural level, of populations.

Maybe this problem (and others, such as entire libraries vanishing when the companies that they were "bought" from cease operation) should be deemed as enough damaging to society to interest governments? We should start now to think about ways to make culture less volatile and less subject to the whims (read: whatever generates profit) of media providers.
BoldlyDubious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:06 PM   #49
jocampo
Layback feline
jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jocampo ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
jocampo's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,034
Karma: 6980745
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Device: Oasis 2nd gen, Sony DPTS1, iPad Pro 10.5"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lutraa View Post
Finally, if this ever happened to me, I would seek redress through my credit card issuing bank, requesting a chargeback for the total value of all the books that disappeared. Even if Amazon is on the right side of the law with regards to deleting entire accounts when owners violate their terms of service, that does not give them the right to keep the money used to purchase the eBook licenses once the license has been revoked.
Good luck :-)

Even if it's not fair, violating any contract or agreement won't give you the right to ask your money back. So yes, legally they can keep your money, even after taking your ebooks away.

Don't get me wrong, not saying I am not with you, just that such action will be futile.
jocampo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:28 PM   #50
DiapDealer
Grand Sorcerer
DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
DiapDealer's Avatar
 
Posts: 27,441
Karma: 192992430
Join Date: Jan 2010
Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD
Quote:
Originally Posted by sadievan View Post
This is true. I do 'liberate' and backup all my books. I think what bothers me about this whole thing is that, if the story is true and as the user stated them, that Amazon will not give a full explanation to her. They will not budge and give her a chance to respond to charges. That and the fact that they removed books she already bought and paid for.

And Amazon is not the only company that has this type of attitude.
I don't disagree at all with your assessment of Amazon's handling of that situation. I was only questioning why a user who already—by their own admission—strips the DRM and keeps local backups of all their ebook purchases, would be leery of purchasing ebooks from Amazon because of this story. That person would never have to worry about their library being taken from them regardless of where they buy from.

Last edited by DiapDealer; 10-22-2012 at 05:23 PM.
DiapDealer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:31 PM   #51
j.p.s
Grand Sorcerer
j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.j.p.s ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 5,257
Karma: 98507638
Join Date: Apr 2011
Device: pb360
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoldlyDubious View Post
You can read about it here (I got the news, and the link, from boingboing.net):

http://www.bekkelund.net/2012/10/22/...by-amazon-drm/

Saying that this is very disturbing is an understatement.
An update to the boingboing article says that Amazon did NOT wipe the kindle, which was already broken. http://boingboing.net/2012/10/22/kin...azon-dele.html

Amazon may be in the wrong for account deletion, but it looks like this is not a case of content deletion.
j.p.s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:41 PM   #52
Ken Maltby
Wizard
Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Ken Maltby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Ken Maltby's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,465
Karma: 6900052
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: The Heart of Texas
Device: Boox Note2, AuraHD, PDA,
Hmm... "Associated Account", would that be how the work of Identity Thieves appear to
a company like Amazon? If a thief can steal your good standing with a company, and
then the company compound the theft by taking your legitimate purchases as well, it
would seem to me that the company should feel some obligation to protect the
legitimate customer. The investigatory steps required for that, should provide all the
information to enable a much better explanation than has been described as coming
from Amazon. So, I do think Amazon's actions should be called to account.

It may not come as a surprise that I also feel that allowing any purchase to be subject
to the fate or whims of others is a very foolish price to pay for a little convenience.

What was it again that DRM is for? Is this "side effect" not something that should be
listed on the label? Shouldn't there be a warning sticker?

Luck;
Ken
Ken Maltby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:47 PM   #53
Kumabjorn
Basculocolpic
Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kumabjorn ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kumabjorn's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,356
Karma: 20181319
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Sweden
Device: Kindle 3 WiFi, Kindle 4SO, Kindle for Android, Sony PRS-350 and PRS-T1
Purchasing DRM content may be hazardous to your mental health.
Kumabjorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 04:59 PM   #54
sadievan
Wizard
sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
sadievan's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,931
Karma: 5456284
Join Date: Nov 2010
Device: Kindle Paperwhite 2, iPhone, Kindle Fire HD 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
I don't disagree at all with your assessment of Amazon's handling of that situation. I was only questioning why a user who already—by their own admission—strips the DRM and keeps local backups of all their ebook purchases, would be leery of purchasing ebooks from Amazon. That person would never have to worry about their library being taken from them regardless of where they buy from.
Ah! Ok. We are in total agreement then. I never worry about where I buy my books because I'm friends with Alf and his 'gang'.
sadievan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 05:03 PM   #55
tompe
Grand Sorcerer
tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,452
Karma: 7185064
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Linköpng, Sweden
Device: Kindle Voyage, Nexus 5, Kindle PW
Quote:
Originally Posted by j.p.s View Post
An update to the boingboing article says that Amazon did NOT wipe the kindle, which was already broken. http://boingboing.net/2012/10/22/kin...azon-dele.html

Amazon may be in the wrong for account deletion, but it looks like this is not a case of content deletion.
So the subject header need to be changed here.

Also, if I remember correctly Amazon just guarantees that the book will be available to download a short time after you buy it which is perfectly reasonable and would not have been any problem if the books were without DRM.
tompe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 05:15 PM   #56
chilady1
I devour books!
chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.chilady1 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
chilady1's Avatar
 
Posts: 789
Karma: 1285226
Join Date: Mar 2009
Device: iPad Air, Kindle 3/Kobo Aura HD, iPhone 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by sadievan View Post
Ah! Ok. We are in total agreement then. I never worry about where I buy my books because I'm friends with Alf and his 'gang'.
chilady1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 05:19 PM   #57
detayls
Addict
detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.detayls ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
detayls's Avatar
 
Posts: 235
Karma: 1355374
Join Date: Aug 2007
Device: iPad, iPhone, Kindle Voyage
Amazon did NOT wipe her Kindle...

https://twitter.com/webmink/status/260432600814981120
detayls is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 05:27 PM   #58
sadievan
Wizard
sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.sadievan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
sadievan's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,931
Karma: 5456284
Join Date: Nov 2010
Device: Kindle Paperwhite 2, iPhone, Kindle Fire HD 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by chilady1 View Post
Hi chilady. We belong to the same club.
sadievan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 05:54 PM   #59
CommonReader
Fanatic
CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.CommonReader ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 528
Karma: 2530000
Join Date: Dec 2010
Device: Sony PRS-T3, PRS-650, Vaio Tap 11, iPad Mini
Quote:
Originally Posted by jocampo View Post
Good luck :-)

Even if it's not fair, violating any contract or agreement won't give you the right to ask your money back. So yes, legally they can keep your money, even after taking your ebooks away.

Don't get me wrong, not saying I am not with you, just that such action will be futile.
I very much doubt that these t&c would survive the first challenge in court, at least in Europe.
CommonReader is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2012, 06:41 PM   #60
Sydney's Mom
Wizard
Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sydney's Mom ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Sydney's Mom's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,895
Karma: 6995721
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Idaho, on the side of a mountain
Device: Kindle Oasis, Fire 3d Gen and 5th Gen and Samsung Tab S
I'm so paranoid, I convert Amazon books, even though I am friends with Dark and Alf. Then I delete the Amazon version-figure I can always get that back from Amazon, although why I would want to, I don't know.

If you have and account in the cloud, there is a file on your computer with the books in it. Now, of course, if your account is deleted, it would probably wipe out the file on your computer as well. I just back up my Calibre library monthly.
Sydney's Mom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Kobo Touch User Guide Updated Thasaidon Kobo Reader 3 01-12-2012 12:20 PM
Wish Amazon would post the KFire User Guide jswinden Kindle Fire 9 11-14-2011 03:21 PM
How can an international user buy and use Amazon Kindle? Over Amazon Kindle 16 10-29-2009 06:17 PM
Petition Started to Stop Amazon from Remotely Deleting eBooks from the kindle eReaderPlanet News 14 08-06-2009 03:10 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:54 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.