07-11-2013, 01:09 PM | #1 |
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Buddenbrooks by Thomas Mann
This is the MR Literary Club selection for July 2013. Whether you've already read it or would like to, feel free to start or join in the conversation at any time! Guests are also always welcome.
Some ebook availability- Amazon Canada Amazon US Blackwell's UK Inkmesh search (some may be in German) Some pbook availability- Amazon UK Random House UK Waterstones UK WH Smith UK Bookworld Australia Dymocks Australia Fishpond Australia So, what are your thoughts on it? Last edited by sun surfer; 07-11-2013 at 01:22 PM. |
07-11-2013, 04:13 PM | #2 |
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just thought I'd add this brief link discussing the two translations:
http://www.editoreric.com/greatlit/t...denbrooks.html it reports the opening and closing, so watch out, of the two translations. |
07-11-2013, 09:32 PM | #3 | |
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07-14-2013, 10:07 PM | #4 |
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I'm slogging through this and have to admit that the odd dialects are jarring. Part of this is my own bias, since most Victorian books/movies I've been exposed are exclusively upper crust. It does come into play in the story with one of the characters and his ability to fit into the society that the Buddenbrooks inhabit, so I can see the necessity.
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07-15-2013, 03:34 AM | #5 | |
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07-15-2013, 02:13 PM | #6 |
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I've barely started, but can see how Mann is laying the groundwork for his tale. The significant differences in dress, politics and religion between the oldest and the next generation speak to a seismic shift between the Age of Enlightenment and the Industrial Age (I had to snicker at one character's being named Jean-Jacques, no doubt by "enlightened" parents). And the reference to the previous owners of the Buddenbrooks' new house and their decline and fall is rather heavy-handed.
I'm reading Woods but may take a look around and see if I can find my old paperback of Lowe-Porter, as some of the translations seem a little off to me. I've never seen a reference to leg of mutton sleeves in a man's coat before, for example, and Gotthold is clearly Jean's half-brother, not his stepbrother. There's probably no good solution to rendering various character's peculiarities in German pronunciation, however. ETA: It occurs to me that the initial scene in this book--the Victorian family gathering of the generations over a stodgy meal--is virtually identical to the opening of Man of Property, the first novel of Galsworthy's Forsyte Saga, although set close to 50 years later (going by memory here). Man of Property, I see, was published a few years after Buddenbrooks, but the Lowe-Porter translation didn't come out for another two decades. Did Galsworthy read German, was it coincidence, or just part of the zeitgeist? In any case, the Nobel committee seems to like hearty eating. ETA2: Of course a big meal is a handy device for introducing a big cast of characters, sigh. Not very creative. ETA3: On further reflection, this isn't quite Victorian yet, but the waning years of William IV. Victoria ascended in 1837. I need to compose my thoughts first, clearly, instead of typing in odd moments! Last edited by issybird; 07-15-2013 at 02:39 PM. |
07-15-2013, 07:08 PM | #7 |
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But we enjoy watching your brain work!
I'm away for a couple of days and will be scouring the secondhand bookshops (some quite good ones) where we are going. |
07-15-2013, 08:22 PM | #8 | |
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07-16-2013, 04:16 PM | #9 | |
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but I think once I touch base again I'll have comparisons here and there. |
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07-17-2013, 04:15 PM | #10 | |
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07-17-2013, 05:21 PM | #11 | |
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Or would it resemble the dialect of the north of the Netherlands? I lived there as a child. Anyway, I'll be reading, if I can get to it this month, the free German version. Last edited by desertblues; 07-17-2013 at 05:24 PM. Reason: Two(2)grammatical errors = creative, living language? |
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07-17-2013, 11:10 PM | #12 | ||
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07-18-2013, 02:34 AM | #13 |
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I'm not that advanced in the book but there are many dialects in Germany. I can only imagine they were more pronounced at the time Thomas Mann wrote this book. I remember Schwebisch (from the Constance lake? = Bodensee) which is even worse than the usual Swiss German. Even when those people tried to speak High German, so that I could understand, the words they used and how they phrased things was indeed strange...
I need to install a German dictionary on my reader before I go any further, I fear I'm missing too much from the descriptions without it... |
07-18-2013, 07:45 AM | #14 |
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Hooray! I just managed to get a secondhand copy of the Lowe-Porter translation which I should receive in the next few days. Thanks for your comments, issybird and paola, which gave me confidence in that original translation rather than the more recent Woods one, as that is what I'm getting.
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07-18-2013, 08:44 AM | #15 | |
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