iPad iPad Air and iPad Mini with Retina announced

[jocampo]

Originally Posted by Faterson

That's a humorous statement. Apple nearly went bankrupt in the 1990s, employing that strategy. Being overly confident in one's position as a market leader (is Apple even that at this point?) can be dangerous

That is not totally correct.

Apple almost went to bankruptcy because prices AND poor leadership, AND lack of innovation. The company started focusing on profit and pretty much cut much if not all, the budget that was assigned to the R&D department.

Once Steve Jobs brought those all elements back, together, the company started getting traction again. If you need more evidence, see where Apple is now. So it is not only about prices. Because if you have a product that people like and has some innovation on it, people will buy it. Hey! ... iPhones were not cheap when they were initially sold and they ran out of stores in a matter of weeks.

Rolex are expensive watches. Can you afford one? Most people can't. But that does not mean that because they are expensive, people won't but them. They are luxury watches. Most Apple products take advantage of that, the brand, but they still sell well, people are ok paying those high prices.

Now, I do not know if the absent of a good leader like Jobs will affect things later on the road, it may be, but the argument that high prices alone can affect sales, it's not complete or accurate.

My take is that new iPad mini will sell well and better than the Nexus 7 and/or any similar Android tablet at that size. Difficult to confirm at this moment, so we will have to seat and watch.

However, long term (2 or more years), I think that Apple will have to start bringing new products and ideas into the market or people, eventually, will start looking for something else.

[jocampo]

Originally Posted by ilovejedd

Perhaps the higher pay is also a matter of skill set? Given the variety of Android devices, I imagine it's harder to develop for Android than it is for iOS.

We do develop for Android and iOs at work. We have very good developers but one thing that we noticed is that Apple does not publish your app immediately, while Google takes almost no time (same day or so) I've been told that there is human being intervention on new Apple apps. This is in order to bring more quality and a uniform experience across devices.

Again, I have Android devices so I am an Android fan too, but you can see the difference in some applications when you use them on an iPad vs the Android counterpart.

Also, developers do not have to worry (on iPads) about screen sizes, resolution and so on, because they are pretty much consistent. On the other hand, Google tablets can have "n" sizes and "m" variations of Android. So it's harder to develop a consistent and fluid experience when the hardware is so different among devices.

[Strether]

Originally Posted by jocampo

Again, I have Android devices so I am an Android fan too, but you can see the difference in some applications when you use them on an iPad vs the Android counterpart.

To give an example: I use the Tune In application to listen to a few internet radio stations. Have no trouble receiving them in my ipod touch, nor the Sonos system I have which also uses that application. But I can only receive one of the stations on the app on my Kindle Fire. An email to Tune In didn't really respond totally to my questions, and suggested that I contact the station to try to improve their transmissions.

Jim

[FlorenceArt]

Originally Posted by PatNY

The point in my post that you missed is that market forces drive pay scales. There has to be a reason why Android developers make more when on staff. And it's likely market driven -- at least to a large degree.

--Pat

Originally Posted by PatNY

It could be skill set ... or it could be simply demand (driven by market forces).

--Pat

You're forgetting half of the equation here. Market prices are determined not just by demand, but by tension between demand and supply. If, say, there are 1000 job offers for skill A but only 500 people with this skill looking for work, the price will go up. On the other hand, if there are 5000 jobs for skill B but 6000 people looking for work, there's no reason for prices to go up. So skil B may end up being less rewarded than skill A even though there is more demand for it.

In other words, it's possible that there is more demand for Apple developers but also more supply, because more developers think they can make a lot of money if they learn to make iOS apps.

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by jocampo

Apple almost went to bankruptcy because prices AND poor leadership, AND lack of innovation.

Definitely. So, we now have luxury pricing for iPad mini Retina.

What about innovation? If the hideous iOS 7 is any indication of where we're headed now, the outlook couldn't be bleaker: focus on cosmetics (butt-ugly cosmetics, too) instead of functionality.

Leadership? I was underwhelmed by yesterday's keynote. When Steve Jobs used bombastic adjectives like "revolutionary" and "magical", you could just barely believe him, thanks to the famed "reality distortion field". When his successors use the same adjectives on the stage, it sounds like marketing fluff. Or, as someone described it here yesterday, "snake oil salesmen's talk".

By the way, you couldn't give a more irrelevant analogy than Rolex watches. A completely outdated device (a wrist-watch) that many people consciously excluded from their lives. I can't see that happening for mobile phones or tablets or computers anytime soon. Also, a wrist-watch is a self-sufficient device; not so our computer devices. If Apple's user base shrinks significantly, 3rd-party software support for their devices may shrink as well, driving Apple to the same dead end they experienced in the 1990s. (Also think of Blackberry, Web OS.)

[MeSue]

Originally Posted by meeera

I wonder if an original iPad will fetch anything at all on ebay... doubt it.

I always do very well selling used Apple products.

[PatNY]

Also, developers do not have to worry (on iPads) about screen sizes, resolution and so on, because they are pretty much consistent. On the other hand, Google tablets can have "n" sizes and "m" variations of Android. So it's harder to develop a consistent and fluid experience when the hardware is so different among devices.

Even if you're limiting yourself like that to tablet size devices, iOS is little different than Android in terms of having to accommodate different screen resolutions. In either case, developers will have to embed different size artwork into their apps to cover multiple screen resolutions.

And if you're just developing for iOS tablets to make the process simpler, then you're leaving out a big portion of iOS users. Marvin is an example of an app which had such a limitation for a long time.

--Pat

[PatNY]

Originally Posted by Strether

To give an example: I use the Tune In application to listen to a few internet radio stations. Have no trouble receiving them in my ipod touch, nor the Sonos system I have which also uses that application. But I can only receive one of the stations on the app on my Kindle Fire.

Jim

Aren't Kindle Fires very locked down Android devices? You don't have pure Android there or a pure Android experience. So perhaps that is why some apps don't work as well on the Amazon-Android hybrid OS as they do on a more open Android tablet. That could be a big difference there.

--Pat

[PatNY]

Originally Posted by FlorenceArt

You're forgetting half of the equation here. Market prices are determined not just by demand, but by tension between demand and supply. If, say, there are 1000 job offers for skill A but only 500 people with this skill looking for work, the price will go up. On the other hand, if there are 5000 jobs for skill B but 6000 people looking for work, there's no reason for prices to go up. So skil B may end up being less rewarded than skill A even though there is more demand for it.

In other words, it's possible that there is more demand for Apple developers but also more supply, because more developers think they can make a lot of money if they learn to make iOS apps.

No, I'm not forgetting that possibility. Multiple scenarios could be possible. But, based on the fact that Android apps for the last few years have grown faster than iOS apps in terms of sheer numbers, and the fact that currently there are more Android apps than iOS apps, it's logical to assume that Android developers outnumber iOS developers. It's also therefore logical to assume that the higher salaries for senior Android developers are due primarily to increased market demand for their services and not because of a limited supply of those with the requisite experience. I don't know if this is true, but they are logical inferences to make from the known facts. It isn't pure speculation.

--Pat

[Strether]

Originally Posted by PatNY

Aren't Kindle Fires very locked down Android devices? You don't have pure Android there or a pure Android experience. So perhaps that is why some apps don't work as well on the Amazon-Android hybrid OS as they do on a more open Android tablet. That could be a big difference there.

--Pat

You're probably right, but if you aren't able to get your app to function correctly, seems to me you shouldn't offer it for that device, instead of, when it doesn't work, blaming the stations. The one I'm trying is free, but they do offer an ad-free version for six or seven dollars, which allows you to record the music. Assuming you can get it.

Jim

[FanciFreez]

I have to have the New Mini with the Retina display.. Now it matches up with the Nexus 7 (2013) and the Kindle Fire HDX.. it should be AWESOME.. for the few extra dollars.. no Brainer.. I have the Original iPad Mini and the screen resolution is not good in TODAYS World.. buy it today, and tomorrow it's OLD.. that is the way it goes in the modern changing Technology world .. plus the NEW Nexus 10 (2013) is going to be announced tomorrow.. sheesh.. I can't keep up.. I want the New Nexus 10 as well.. but I will hide it from my wife.. she will not know the difference, because of the look..

[leebase]

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

Even if I bought an iPad, I still wouldn't buy apps

You wouldn't have too as there are hundreds of thousands of free ones.

Still, at $1-$5 for most, it's very reasonable for apps.

Of course, for people that price sensitive, Android is likely a better match.

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by leebase

You wouldn't have too as there are hundreds of thousands of free ones.

Exactly ...Android or iOS; either one would work for me. Android wins because the devices are cheaper and have more features.

[Faterson]

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

Exactly ...Android or iOS; either one would work for me. Android wins because the devices are cheaper and have more features.

Not really. I find that iOS apps typically have more features than Android apps, so overall, I'd say iOS devices offer more features currently. But, we are off-topic.

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by Faterson

Not really. I find that iOS apps typically have more features than Android apps, so overall, I'd say iOS devices offer more features currently. But, we are off-topic.

The apps may have more features, but I'm more interested in device features; such as GPS and NFC. They're available on my N7.2, but not on base iPads. To get GPS, you need to spend another $130; and NFC is non-existent.