Request addition to reader matrix.

Icarusbop · 06-25-2007, 11:21 AM

Hello:

Please forgive me if this is in the wrong place, I cannot find anywhere appropriate to post this message.
I was wondering who maintains the eReader matrix and would like to suggest an addition.
I think it would be useful to add another row which indicates which readers (if any) successfully display text in BOLD and ITALIC, as (as far as I can see) quite a few of the readers / formats, remove formatting and show only plain text.
This is quite an important feature for me as a lot of authors are now using text formatting to stress points in the story, and the removal of formatting can very often, drastically change the way the story reads.

NatCh · 06-25-2007, 12:31 PM

Hey, Icarusbop, the wiki is group maintained. If you'd like to add such a row, knock yourself out, it sounds like a good addition to me.

I'd probably have put this post in the Dedicated Readers forum, but I can move it there for you easily enough.

igorsk · 06-25-2007, 12:54 PM

I don't really see a point for this column. As far as I know, all current readers display formatting if the file format supports it. For example, the Reader displays it in LRF, PDF and RTF, but TXT files don't support any formatting.

JSWolf · 06-25-2007, 12:57 PM

If the book is from PG as a text file, most of the time there are no attributes. That's why if there is an HTML from PG, I will use that as the attributes are there if they are supposed to be.

Icarusbop · 06-26-2007, 04:17 AM

NatCh - I know theoretically I can do it; I hit the Edit button on the matrix page - took one look at the result and bailed out. I don't really know that much about this stuff and didn't want to break anything...

astra · 06-26-2007, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by igorsk

I don't really see a point for this column. As far as I know, all current readers display formatting if the file format supports it. For example, the Reader displays it in LRF, PDF and RTF, but TXT files don't support any formatting.

Agree. I don't see any point in adding this column as well. Displaying bold and italic has nothing to do with ebook reader hardware. It solely depends on a file you upload to your ebook reader.

Icarusbop · 06-26-2007, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by astra_lestat

Agree. I don't see any point in adding this column as well. Displaying bold and italic has nothing to do with ebook reader hardware. It solely depends on a file you upload to your ebook reader.

Not strictly true - even though formatting is nothing to do with hardware, it has everyting to do with software. For example, my favourite current reader was the Hanlin, until I discovered that their proprietary WOL file, removes text formatting during conversion (not sure about the new V2 however). The same goes for the Star eBook (as far as I can tell).

astra · 06-26-2007, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icarusbop

Not strictly true - even though formatting is nothing to do with hardware, it has everyting to do with software. For example, my favourite current reader was the Hanlin, until I discovered that their proprietary WOL file, removes text formatting during conversion (not sure about the new V2 however). The same goes for the Star eBook (as far as I can tell).

Do you mean that your reader might show only WOL format and when you are converting other formats into WOL it strips all the nicities and your reader is incapable of displaying anything beyond simple text?

Icarusbop · 06-26-2007, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by astra_lestat

Do you mean that your reader might show only WOL format and when you are converting other formats into WOL it strips all the nicities and your reader is incapable of displaying anything beyond simple text?

I dont actually have one (it was top of my list of the readers to get) but as far as I'm aware yes - the WOL formatter pulls all the formatting off the text. I think it displays pictures though (JPEG).
I discovered this by trying their WOL file creator and testing it with the PC emulator - resulting books only had simple text, no matter the formatting of the original source) - of course, this may be inaccurate, the actual device may be different and / or the firmware may have been changed recently. Hence my request to simplyfy things by adding the extra rows on the matrix.

astra · 06-26-2007, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icarusbop

I dont actually have one (it was top of my list of the readers to get) but as far as I'm aware yes - the WOL formatter pulls all the formatting off the text. I think it displays pictures though (JPEG).
I discovered this by trying their WOL file creator and testing it with the PC emulator - resulting books only had simple text, no matter the formatting of the original source) - of course, this may be inaccurate, the actual device may be different and / or the firmware may have been changed recently. Hence my request to simplyfy things by adding the extra rows on the matrix.

Well. I have only sony reader so I cannot really argue. However, I have a strong feeling that any reader either supports more than just one proprietary format, such as RTF,HTML,CHM etc., and is capable of displaying the right formatting or its proprietary format is capable of displaying the text correctly. (I think), no one would buy a reader that is incapable of displaying anything beyong simple text.

kovidgoyal · 06-26-2007, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icarusbop

I dont actually have one (it was top of my list of the readers to get) but as far as I'm aware yes - the WOL formatter pulls all the formatting off the text. I think it displays pictures though (JPEG).
I discovered this by trying their WOL file creator and testing it with the PC emulator - resulting books only had simple text, no matter the formatting of the original source) - of course, this may be inaccurate, the actual device may be different and / or the firmware may have been changed recently. Hence my request to simplyfy things by adding the extra rows on the matrix.

I'm sure someone will write a better converter once the device becomes more popular.

JSWolf · 06-26-2007, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

I'm sure someone will write a better converter once the device becomes more popular.

But how can the reader become more popular with the software being so poor? You can't get a good feel for how the device really can perform if the source you give it is no better off then a well formatted text file? if WOL is really that bad, then it's going to fail for sure.

To be honest, I think Sony may very well be the last ones to get away with a new format.

RWood · 06-26-2007, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But how can the reader become more popular with the software being so poor? You can't get a good feel for how the device really can perform if the source you give it is no better off then a well formatted text file? if WOL is really that bad, then it's going to fail for sure.

To be honest, I think Sony may very well be the last ones to get away with a new format.

Someone with a lot of market clout could. The only player I see on the sidelines at the moment that looks poised to move into the ebook reader market is Amazon and they already own Mobipocket. Mobi is well established so I expect they will stay with that one and not introduce something new.

JSWolf · 06-27-2007, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWood

Someone with a lot of market clout could. The only player I see on the sidelines at the moment that looks poised to move into the ebook reader market is Amazon and they already own Mobipocket. Mobi is well established so I expect they will stay with that one and not introduce something new.

Amazon dumped all the other formats they used to sell. So I would have to agree that when Amazon does come out with a reader, it will be supporting Mobi.

But book formats are important. For example, the Cybook is going to make it or not based on what it's able to read. Hanlan is going to fail miserably from what I have been reading and it support WOL which if they conversion to WOL software is any indication, not good.

I don't see any company with enough clout coming out with a reader. So all the readers that are coming out will have to pick and existing format. And to be 100% honest, the best format is Mobi or eReader to try to grab some of the Palm reading public. Heck, I know someone on another forum that reads ebooks on a PDA. If the Sony read the book she already has, then I could have sold one to her (so to speak). But for her needs, the iLiad is way way too expensive.

kovidgoyal · 06-27-2007, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But how can the reader become more popular with the software being so poor?

Hanlin has all of china to play with.

06-25-2007, 11:21 AM	#1
Icarusbop Groupie Posts: 156 Karma: 25846 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: UK Device: PRS505	Request addition to reader matrix. Hello: Please forgive me if this is in the wrong place, I cannot find anywhere appropriate to post this message. I was wondering who maintains the eReader matrix and would like to suggest an addition. I think it would be useful to add another row which indicates which readers (if any) successfully display text in BOLD and ITALIC, as (as far as I can see) quite a few of the readers / formats, remove formatting and show only plain text. This is quite an important feature for me as a lot of authors are now using text formatting to stress points in the story, and the removal of formatting can very often, drastically change the way the story reads.

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06-25-2007, 12:31 PM	#2
NatCh Gizmologist Posts: 11,615 Karma: 929550 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Republic of Texas Embassy at Jackson, TN Device: Pocketbook Touch HD3	Hey, Icarusbop, the wiki is group maintained. If you'd like to add such a row, knock yourself out, it sounds like a good addition to me. I'd probably have put this post in the Dedicated Readers forum, but I can move it there for you easily enough.

06-25-2007, 12:54 PM	#3
igorsk Wizard Posts: 3,442 Karma: 300001 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Belgium Device: PRS-500/505/700, Kindle, Cybook Gen3, Words Gear	I don't really see a point for this column. As far as I know, all current readers display formatting if the file format supports it. For example, the Reader displays it in LRF, PDF and RTF, but TXT files don't support any formatting.

06-25-2007, 12:57 PM	#4
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 73,897 Karma: 128597114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	If the book is from PG as a text file, most of the time there are no attributes. That's why if there is an HTML from PG, I will use that as the attributes are there if they are supposed to be.

06-26-2007, 04:17 AM	#5
Icarusbop Groupie Posts: 156 Karma: 25846 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: UK Device: PRS505	NatCh - I know theoretically I can do it; I hit the Edit button on the matrix page - took one look at the result and bailed out. I don't really know that much about this stuff and didn't want to break anything...