Mysterious font information in AZW3 file

salty-horse · 08-15-2022, 02:19 PM

Reading a recently-purchased Kindle file in the Kindle app in KFX format, I see that "computer text" sections in the book are styled with "font-family: monospace".

When I ask the Kindle software for the ebook in AZW3 format, those text sections are not monospace, but in the CSS file, the style definition for it contains a font name.

Looking at a copy of the physical book, I see it uses this font for those sections.

What's going on here? I assumed the KFX format is the "best" one provided by Amazon, as it includes embedded fonts. Why doesn't it include the actual fonts that the AZW3 file hints at?

Is it a quirk of this particular ebook, something the ebook creation software left in? Or is this a case of information loss in the Kindle publishing system when it converts between formats?

JSWolf · 08-15-2022, 02:23 PM

When I see font names in the CSS that are not embedded, I change the code to use the same sort of font type when possible.

For serif, I just delete the line as I use serif anyway.
For sans serif, I use font-family: sans-serif;
For monospace, I use font-family: monospace;
For some other type, what I use depends on the font and what it's used for.

salty-horse · 08-15-2022, 02:25 PM

I added the relevant font to the file, myself. Looks much better now, just like the print edition.

But where are those commented font names coming from?

Quoth · 08-15-2022, 02:40 PM

AZW3 / KF8 also can have embedded fonts. Download for USB transfer to to get that instead of KFX.
You do have to go to Aa menu and select Publisher.

if the fonts are declared properly you'll get some sort of built-in monospace, even with mobi-KF7 format or azw3/KF8 without any embedded monospace.

KFX uses different rendering and more DRM. I'd not call it the best Amazon format.

Even big publishers often code / format ebooks badly, using inept people with very expensive packages, whereas free Calibre or Sigil from a properly formatted MS Word (or LO Writer via extra docx Save As) can produce a near perfect epub for upload to Amazon. Amazon then convert that to at least 3 formats and send the one they think is appropriate.

Quoth · 08-15-2022, 02:58 PM

Quote:

But where are those commented font names coming from?

The file should start (but doesn't always) as an MS Word or LO Writer document with Paragraph Styles (translate to or <hn class="whatever-body"> where n is the heading level.
Then the CSS has .whatever-etc{ ... } where ... is the font name, size, style, paddings, margin etc in the original Word docx paragraph, heading or character styles. Character styles become text in a paragraph 
Naked tags will use outer <div> or <body> styles.
CSS = Cascading Style Sheets

jhowell · 08-15-2022, 04:45 PM

I have seen books that call for a font that is not actually present either because the publisher failed to include it or because Amazon stripped it out.

Also KF8 and KFX deal differently with embedded fonts. In KF8 you usually need to choose the Publisher Font option in the Aa menu in order to see them.

It would be helpful to know the ASIN of the book in order to be able to research this issue.

salty-horse · 08-15-2022, 05:03 PM

The book is Planetfall by Emma Newman, ASIN B00SI0B65W
A physical copy can be borrowed on the Internet Archive.

The "computer text" is on the first chapter. Search for "come to the west gate".

I'm using the Kindle app for Android and I don't see a "Publisher Font" option.

The AZW3 CSS looks like this:

Code:

p.x06-Text-Message {
   /*"Briem Akademi Std"*/
  font-size:0.83em;
  margin: 1.82em 10%;
  text-indent:0;
}

jhowell · 08-15-2022, 07:19 PM

Thanks for sharing the ASIN. There is something strange going on with that book.

Usually KF8 format is closest to what the publisher originally provided and KFX format is derived from the same source. That does not seem to be the case here.

For this book KFX contains formatting elements that are not present or are broken in the KF8 version. I have never seen this before and I don't know how it could happen. My best guess is that the publisher (Penguin) provided the book to Amazon in an unusual format (perhaps Adobe InDesign) that was then converted to both KF8 (badly) and KFX (better) by Amazon.

JSWolf · 08-15-2022, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salty-horse

The book is Planetfall by Emma Newman, ASIN B00SI0B65W
A physical copy can be borrowed on the Internet Archive.

The "computer text" is on the first chapter. Search for "come to the west gate".

I'm using the Kindle app for Android and I don't see a "Publisher Font" option.

The AZW3 CSS looks like this:

Code:

p.x06-Text-Message {
   /*"Briem Akademi Std"*/
  font-size:0.83em;
  margin: 1.82em 10%;
  text-indent:0;
}

Here is the same CSS class from the ePub version.

Code:

p.x06-Text-Message {
  font-family: monospace;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std"*/
  font-size: 0.83em;
  margin: 1.82em 10%;
  text-indent: 0;
}

As you can see, font-family is there. The font name is the font used in the pBook.

JSWolf · 08-15-2022, 07:36 PM

Would it be OK to post the CSS from the ePub version or would that not be allowed?

jhowell · 08-15-2022, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Here is the same CSS class from the ePub version.

Code:

p.x06-Text-Message {
  font-family: monospace;
…

As you can see, font-family is there. The font name is the font used in the pBook.

OK. That confuses me even more. It looks like my previous guess about what is going on was wrong.

The KFX version of the book has that font family but the KF8 version does not. I now suppose the most likely explanation is that the EPUB source was provided by the publisher and Amazon stripped out the font-family properties from the KF8 version but left them in the KFX version. That behavior is new to me.

salty-horse · 08-16-2022, 05:04 AM

Since the ePub and AZW3 have the same commented fonts, I'm thinking maybe they couldn't include them in the ebooks, maybe due to rights issues...?

Maybe the monospace font is a later addition, when they noticed a problem with differentiating the computer text with regular text (which sometimes appear together in the same line). So they added the monospace style to the KFX and the ePub, but not to the AZW3...? Does Amazon's publishing system lets you edit these two formats separately?

JSWolf · 08-16-2022, 05:19 AM

Here is the CSS from the ePub version with a few changes. I removed the font size that makes the body text small. So now it's the default size. I added in my body style, and I removed the Widows and Orphans of 2 since my body style has them as 1. Other then that it's the same CSS.

font-size: 0.83em; as shown int he CSS snippet above is really annoying as it makes the base font size smaller. That means then having to adjust your font size and then when you open a new book that has the 1em font size, having to change it back.

So here is the CSS code you could try in the KF8.

Code:

body, div, dl, dt, dd, h1, h2, h3, h4, h5, h6, p, pre, code, blockquote {
  font-weight: normal;
  font-style: normal;
}
body {
  widows: 1;
  orphans: 1;
  margin-top: 0;
  margin-right: 0;
  margin-bottom: 0;
  margin-left: 0;
  text-align: justify;
}
p.x01-FM-Ack {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 0;
  text-indent: 1.67em;
}
p.x01-FM-Ack-FL {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 0;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Ack-Head {
  color: #9d9fa2;
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std Semibold Cond"*/
  font-size: 1.583em;
  font-weight: bold;
  margin: 15% 1.47em 2em 0;
  text-align: right;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Copyright-Text {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Times LT Std"*/
  font-size: 0.583em;
  margin: 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Copyright-Text-Space {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Times LT Std"*/
  font-size: 0.583em;
  margin: 1.14em 0 0 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Dedi-Body {
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Trade Gothic LT Std Cn"*/
  font-size: 0.833em;
  font-style: italic;
  margin: 15% 0 0 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Headnote-FL {
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Trade Gothic LT Std Cn"*/
  font-size: 0.917em;
  margin: 15% 0 0.36em 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Headnote {
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Trade Gothic LT Std Cn"*/
  font-size: 0.917em;
  margin: 1.2em 0 0.36em 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Quote {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  font-size: 0.854em;
  margin: 1.37em 0 0 0;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Source {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  font-size: 0.771em;
  margin: 0;
  text-align: right;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Subhead {
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Trade Gothic LT Std Cn"*/
  font-size: 0.771em;
  margin: 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x01-FM-Front-Sales-Title-No-Space {
  color: #9d9fa2;
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std Semibold Cond"*/
  font-size: 2.25em;
  margin: 0.67em 0 0 0;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x03-CO-Body-Text {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 0;
  text-indent: 0;
}
h1.x03-Chapter-Number {
  color: #c7c8ca;
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std Cond"*/
  font-size: 3.333em;
  font-weight: bold;
  margin: 15% 0.7em 1.5em 0;
  page-break-after: avoid;
  text-align: right;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x04-Body-Text {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 0;
  text-indent: 1.67em;
}
p.x04-Space-Break-FL {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 0;
  text-indent: 0;
}
div.x04-Space-Break-Orn {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  margin: 1em 0;
  page-break-after: avoid;
  text-align: center;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.x06-Text-Message {
  font-family: monospace;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std"*/
  font-size: 0.83em;
  margin: 1.82em 10%;
  text-indent: 0;
}
p.xCaption {
  font-family: serif;
  /*"Sabon LT Std"*/
  font-size: 0.438em;
  margin: 0 0 1.5em 0;
  text-indent: 0;
  text-align: center;
}
span._6-Text-Message-Inline {
  font-family: monospace;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std"*/
  font-size: 0.83em;
}
span.CO-and-SB {
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Trade Gothic LT Std Cn"*/
}
span.SCAP {
  font-size: 70%;
}
div.h100 {
  text-align: center;
  height: 100%;
  max-width: 100%;
}
img.h100 {
  height: 100%;
  max-width: 100%;
}
div.w30c {
  text-align: center;
  max-height: 100%;
  margin-left: 35%;
  margin-right: 35%;
}
img.w30c {
  max-height: 100%;
  width: 100%;
}
img.h2em {
  height: 2em;
}
img.h4em {
  height: 4em;
}
.x01-FM-Contents-FL {
  font-size: 1em;
  margin: 0 0 0 1.5em;
  text-indent: -1.5em;
}
.x01-FM-Contents-Space {
  font-size: 1em;
  margin: 1em 0 0 1.5em;
  text-indent: -1.5em;
}
h1.x01-FM-Head {
  color: #c7c8ca;
  font-family: sans-serif;
  /*"Briem Akademi Std Cond"*/
  font-size: 3.333em;
  font-weight: bold;
  margin: 15% 0.7em 1.5em 0;
  page-break-after: avoid;
  text-align: right;
  text-indent: 0;
}
hr.transition {
  display: block;
  border: none;
  margin: 0;
}

salty-horse · 08-16-2022, 06:38 AM

I'm sticking with the AZW3 (converted to epub) - I added the print book's text message font, and might change the body text size to normal.

JSWolf · 08-16-2022, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by salty-horse

I'm sticking with the AZW3 (converted to epub) - I added the print book's text message font, and might change the body text size to normal.

Take the KF8, swap the CSS, and then convert to ePub. You'll have a better ePub.

08-15-2022, 02:19 PM	#1
salty-horse Wizard Posts: 1,469 Karma: 16638560 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E	Mysterious font information in AZW3 file Reading a recently-purchased Kindle file in the Kindle app in KFX format, I see that "computer text" sections in the book are styled with "font-family: monospace". When I ask the Kindle software for the ebook in AZW3 format, those text sections are not monospace, but in the CSS file, the style definition for it contains a font name. Looking at a copy of the physical book, I see it uses this font for those sections. What's going on here? I assumed the KFX format is the "best" one provided by Amazon, as it includes embedded fonts. Why doesn't it include the actual fonts that the AZW3 file hints at? Is it a quirk of this particular ebook, something the ebook creation software left in? Or is this a case of information loss in the Kindle publishing system when it converts between formats?

08-15-2022, 05:03 PM	#7
salty-horse Wizard Posts: 1,469 Karma: 16638560 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E	The book is Planetfall by Emma Newman, ASIN B00SI0B65W A physical copy can be borrowed on the Internet Archive. The "computer text" is on the first chapter. Search for "come to the west gate". I'm using the Kindle app for Android and I don't see a "Publisher Font" option. The AZW3 CSS looks like this: Code: p.x06-Text-Message { /"Briem Akademi Std"/ font-size:0.83em; margin: 1.82em 10%; text-indent:0; }

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
AZW3 files have different font size	Buhaj47	Conversion	8	12-23-2021 11:40 PM
How to increase the font of the printed .PDF file from .MOBI file?	MGadAllah	Calibre	3	01-30-2021 06:08 PM
How to update meta information for an ebook file?	lifanxi	Calibre	2	10-27-2010 10:22 AM
ttc font file can't be put into font folder	droople	Sigil	2	08-21-2010 10:05 AM
File System Information	Adam B.	iRex	0	10-29-2008 08:46 AM

08-15-2022, 02:23 PM	#2
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 74,015 Karma: 129333114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	When I see font names in the CSS that are not embedded, I change the code to use the same sort of font type when possible. For serif, I just delete the line as I use serif anyway. For sans serif, I use font-family: sans-serif; For monospace, I use font-family: monospace; For some other type, what I use depends on the font and what it's used for.

08-15-2022, 02:25 PM	#3
salty-horse Wizard Posts: 1,469 Karma: 16638560 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E	I added the relevant font to the file, myself. Looks much better now, just like the print edition. But where are those commented font names coming from?

08-15-2022, 02:40 PM	#4
Quoth the rook, bossing Never. Posts: 11,164 Karma: 85874891 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper11	AZW3 / KF8 also can have embedded fonts. Download for USB transfer to to get that instead of KFX. You do have to go to Aa menu and select Publisher. if the fonts are declared properly you'll get some sort of built-in monospace, even with mobi-KF7 format or azw3/KF8 without any embedded monospace. KFX uses different rendering and more DRM. I'd not call it the best Amazon format. Even big publishers often code / format ebooks badly, using inept people with very expensive packages, whereas free Calibre or Sigil from a properly formatted MS Word (or LO Writer via extra docx Save As) can produce a near perfect epub for upload to Amazon. Amazon then convert that to at least 3 formats and send the one they think is appropriate.

08-15-2022, 04:45 PM	#6
jhowell Grand Sorcerer Posts: 6,498 Karma: 84420419 Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Tampa Bay, Florida Device: Kindles	I have seen books that call for a font that is not actually present either because the publisher failed to include it or because Amazon stripped it out. Also KF8 and KFX deal differently with embedded fonts. In KF8 you usually need to choose the Publisher Font option in the Aa menu in order to see them. It would be helpful to know the ASIN of the book in order to be able to research this issue.

08-15-2022, 07:19 PM	#8
jhowell Grand Sorcerer Posts: 6,498 Karma: 84420419 Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Tampa Bay, Florida Device: Kindles	Thanks for sharing the ASIN. There is something strange going on with that book. Usually KF8 format is closest to what the publisher originally provided and KFX format is derived from the same source. That does not seem to be the case here. For this book KFX contains formatting elements that are not present or are broken in the KF8 version. I have never seen this before and I don't know how it could happen. My best guess is that the publisher (Penguin) provided the book to Amazon in an unusual format (perhaps Adobe InDesign) that was then converted to both KF8 (badly) and KFX (better) by Amazon.

08-15-2022, 07:36 PM	#10
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 74,015 Karma: 129333114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	Would it be OK to post the CSS from the ePub version or would that not be allowed?

08-16-2022, 05:04 AM	#12
salty-horse Wizard Posts: 1,469 Karma: 16638560 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E	Since the ePub and AZW3 have the same commented fonts, I'm thinking maybe they couldn't include them in the ebooks, maybe due to rights issues...? Maybe the monospace font is a later addition, when they noticed a problem with differentiating the computer text with regular text (which sometimes appear together in the same line). So they added the monospace style to the KFX and the ePub, but not to the AZW3...? Does Amazon's publishing system lets you edit these two formats separately?

08-16-2022, 06:38 AM	#14
salty-horse Wizard Posts: 1,469 Karma: 16638560 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E	I'm sticking with the AZW3 (converted to epub) - I added the print book's text message font, and might change the body text size to normal.

Advert

Advert