confused by epub page numbering

[cybmole]

when I place files modified in sigil onto by sonyt e-reader, it tells me how many "pages" are in the book and allows "page number" to operate as navigation tool.

my prior understanding was that page numbers were computed from text character count within each xhtml, and thus were unaffecting by font resizing or other cosmetics.

But I have just tidied a 700+ page book that had come from MS word, and after removing all the word-related crud ( which appears in green or faint orange within code view ), the book now has only 400+ pages. but all the chapters & all of the text seem intact.

is that expected behaviour ?

if I had been paying close attention to the unedited version on my reader , would I have seen page numbers jump as each new chapter was opened i.e. as each new unneeded word styles, word font etc. definitions were skipped over ?

I cannot see anything within the sigil views that related to page number calculations, are the calculations taking pace within the sony firmware or are they stored somewhere within the epub structure ? ?

[HarryT]

The "page numbers" are generated by the Sony's ADE firmware, and are a count of units of 1024 characters in the compressed file. So yes, if you remove garbage from the file, whether visible or not, you will reduce the page count.

[Toxaris]

Yes is it expected. The character count also takes the xhtml code into account. HTML from Word has a lot of garbage, so a lot more additional code.

Sigh, HarryT beat me to it.

[Jellby]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The "page numbers" are generated by the Sony's ADE firmware, and are a count of units of 1024 characters in the compressed file.

Which also means that the page numbers change if you only change the compression level when zipping, too.

[cybmole]

thanks guys -

so "page numbers" are part of ADE spec, not epub spec; sigil does not "do" page numbers.

as for compression level when zipping - that is "under the bonnet" in sigil - not user configurable ?

moving onto garbage disposal then: as it severly impacts page numbers, & thus impacts my sense of how long a book is, I'll be wanting to get better at this.... so..

is it safe to assume that if sigil colors it green, then it can be safely zapped ?. is it practical to expect a "zap all that's green" button one day or will it always be a manual find/replace task.

ditto for all those word font definitions that appear in a washed out orangey colour ?

[sassanik]

Is there a specific reason why you are wanting page numbers?

Most ereaders do not display them when you are actually reading the ebook.

Amy

[cybmole]

Originally Posted by sassanik

Is there a specific reason why you are wanting page numbers?

Most ereaders do not display them when you are actually reading the ebook.

Amy

sony readers display them all the time at foot of screen no option to turn off.
ADE , when reading on PC, also shows them - I hate the way that ADE does it but again there is no option to disable.

so I've got used to seeing them & thus I want to understand how they are derived & make them comparable across different books from different sources

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by sassanik

Is there a specific reason why you are wanting page numbers?

Most ereaders do not display them when you are actually reading the ebook.

Amy

Actually most readers do display them. Which ones did you have in mind that don't?

[DaleDe]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Actually most readers do display them. Which ones did you have in mind that don't?

I would agree, the Hanlin and its clones do not (to have screen space for the book) but they are readily available at the press of a button anytime you want to see them. The small numbers do appear in the right margin as the page number changes.

Dale

[sassanik]

Harry you are right, most do display them. I was thinking that the numbering was auto generated, or some such thing.

I don't worry about page numbering when I make a epub file, though I am sure there are cases when controlling the numbering process would be helpful, I think it doesn't matter for most fiction.

Amy

[DaleDe]

Originally Posted by sassanik

Harry you are right, most do display them. I was thinking that the numbering was auto generated, or some such thing.

I don't worry about page numbering when I make a epub file, though I am sure there are cases when controlling the numbering process would be helpful, I think it doesn't matter for most fiction.

Amy

It is possible to control the page number. ADE has a non-ePub compatilble extension to add this capability however epub actually has a standard way to do this although there isn't much mention of it in the specs but it comes via the ncx file as an option from its DTBook roots. Unfortunately I know of no ePub reader than uses this feature directly. (Surprisingly Kindlegen can use it during the conversion process). See NCX in the wiki for more details.

Dale

[theducks]

Originally Posted by DaleDe

I would agree, the Hanlin and its clones do not (to have screen space for the book) but they are readily available at the press of a button anytime you want to see them. The small numbers do appear in the right margin as the page number changes.

Dale

I find this statement odd. (Astak PEz. ASTAK or Lbook FW)
The space on the bottom (about 20px) is never used for the book, only the status bar, which is hidden most of the time.

[DaleDe]

Originally Posted by theducks

I find this statement odd. (Astak PEz. ASTAK or Lbook FW)
The space on the bottom (about 20px) is never used for the book, only the status bar, which is hidden most of the time.

the space at the bottom is 40px and yes the text can protrude into that space at least a little, depending on how the page comes out and the font size. I have turned on the status bar and had it cover the bottom few pixels of a line of text.