No E-Books Allowed in This Establishment

[rcuadro]

My iPhone has a screen and requires batteries... Would I not be able to use it? The iPhone is more of a computer than the Kindle is. Same thing with my iPod Touch.

[Worldwalker]

Originally Posted by ficbot

Why don't they just set a time limit for table occupancy during peak hours?

Because that requires people to monitor and time table occupancy. It might not be practical in a place like that, especially if they have a small staff, and especially during noon rush. Also, asking someone to put their computer away is less confrontational than throwing them out of the place.

There are a lot of things they could have done, such as marking some tables as "express tables" (which would probably have been respected as well as express lines in supermarkets) but the solution they chose is not some kind of ebook holocaust or something. They just want to have the tables available at peak sales times, and when they identified the problem as people using their cafe as an extension of the office, they addressed that specific problem.

The root of the problem, again, is entitlement: "I bought a muffin so I'm entitled to sit at this table for three hours when they're busy." Me, me, me, me, me. People didn't want to feel restricted by the internal rules of politeness, so now they're restricted by the external rules of cafe owners and HOAs and everyone else who has or can claim rulemaking power. Personally, I liked politeness better.

[TereLiz]

I totally understand this logic, and don't see it as discriminatory. Bars have drink minimums, but somehow nobody ever thought to apply this practice to coffee shops once they were inundated with "customers" who linger long after their cup of coffee is gone.

I once hostessed at a restaurant where it was a part of my job to go around and kindly kick out those finished diners who were "lingering" when we had a line out the door. It's not pretty, but usually, neither are the lingerers who can see that there is a line. Entitlement IS the root of the problem, that's for sure.

[ski_power]

@TereLiz: Out of curiosity if I may ask, how would you get them to leave?
A few lines would be appreciated.

[J. Strnad]

It's always amusing to see how people miss the obvious.

Problem: People stay too long, taking up table space during lunch hour.
Solution: Set a time limit.

Instead, they say "No computers!" Is a Kindle a computer? Is a mobile phone a computer? Can you read on your mobile phone, or are people not allowed to use those, either? I saw in the comments that one guy was told he couldn't read his Kindle while waiting for his order!

People. Evolution still has a lot of work to do.

[brecklundin]

what is the difference in lingering over coffee or what ever, talking to another person or even sitting alone compared to sitting reading or web browsing? No difference...

Now, OTOH, something like talking on a cell phone will almost always increase ambient noise in an establishment, just sit in a coffee shop for a while and pay attention to the cycling of noise as people move in and out...to my observation the noise increases significantly when people are screaming into their cell phones, and it's even more obnoxious when it's one person. Our local Starbucks has the acoustics of Carnegie Hall and when the right confluence of customers is present it's near to impossible to read or even think quietly. Of course my home town's motto is "...every child left behind..." these days, and it's pretty obvious when out and about.

One of the funniest things I see, sadly on a regular basis, is a group of young adults or teens each sitting around a table with their individual MP3 players going AND talking to each other over the music...then one gets on the cell phone at the same time...it is seriously one of the funniest, from the point of exasperation and disbelief, behaviors I have ever witnessed and like I said I see it on a regular basis from different people...

[calvin-c]

Now I find the very idea of going to a coffee shop funny. And I'm from just south of Seattle. Yes, I drink coffee-but I make it myself for about $.75/16oz. vs. whatever they charge now-$5.75? I control the quality, no matter where I am. (I'm told that Starbucks makes very good coffee, but I suspect it does vary. I know that the quality of McDonalds' food varies despite their best efforts to assure uniformity. And it's harder to maintain a uniformly high standard than to maintain the 'adequate' standard that it seems like McDonalds sets.)

[kjk]

Originally Posted by calvin-c

Now I find the very idea of going to a coffee shop funny. And I'm from just south of Seattle. Yes, I drink coffee-but I make it myself for about $.75/16oz. vs. whatever they charge now-$5.75?

lol. Their 20 oz venti coffee is around 2 bucks here.

[brecklundin]

heck yeah, I agree about buying the $5 20oz "cups" of coffee but I don't buy those. I just grab a plain old coffee...a large coffee at anywhere from Starbucks to Seattle's best to McDonald's is ~$2...one just needs to past the whole "coffee shops are evil incarnate and expansive" idea...refills at SB $0.50, I don't believe you can get refills at MickeyD's though.

BTW, Starbucks coffee is in general mediocre but OK. Same for most of the chain store shops...they have to over roast their beans in order to get consistent taste from batch to batch. Once ya try some well roasted beans, wow, what a difference. I never would have believed it until I tried some home roasted vs. the same beans from SB's...I was in the coffee is coffee camp but it's apparently all in the grade of the beans but probably as much, it's in the roasting as well. mmmmmm....which I had an old original hot air popcorn popper that folks like to use to roast beans at home...but I just opened a bag of a new to me Starbucks Summer Blend that is super for the iced/cold coffee drink I keep around most of the year, I like iced coffee more than hot, unless nature needs some "help" in the AM...snickersnicker...

I actually brew up the coffee in a quasi-Turkish flavor/style but use a nice coffee maker that still puts out 200-degree hot water after almost 2-years. Just a plain Jane home model maker by Bunn bought at our local Walmart w/o any bells & whistles, still the best coffee maker I ever owned. Oh, here is the new coffee I have been enjoying because of the subtle citrus accents:
http://www.starbucks.com/coffee/whol...a/gazebo-blend

it's not the gazebo blend but rather the bag is labeled Summer Blend....

OK, sorry for the mini-jack, but these days coffee is about the most interesting thing in my day. I even experiment with tea/coffee blends with mixed degrees of failure.

[HamsterRage]

I'm just contrary enough to deliberately go there and whip out an ereader or laptop and then refuse to put it away. I'd invite them to call the police, if they liked, otherwise I'm using my computer and they can leave me alone.

Of course, I'd have to start all that silliness after getting my coffee or food. And make sure I didn't stay for extra long either.

May only be able to pull that off once though.

[sabredog]

I think the shop staff and perhaps the managers need a lesson in what is a computer and what is an ereading device. Perhaps then there might be a modification in policy due to increased awareness in the differences between the two.

[Metal Mick]

Originally Posted by rcuadro

My iPhone has a screen and requires batteries... Would I not be able to use it? The iPhone is more of a computer than the Kindle is. Same thing with my iPod Touch.

Hi all,

I immediately thought of my phone, which has a Kindle app. And would the shops allow someone to sit and read a newspaper; or take calls on their phone?

In Oz there are places that now request patrons to turn off phones or at least silenced whilst on the premises. And increasing numbers of places are refusing to serve people attempt to order whilst in the middle of a call.

Perhaps there is an issue of ettiquette here, and in the past there may have been others hammering away on their laptop/netbook and the clacking has proved a distraction.

Still, if I ran a coffee shop I don't think I'd consider asking people not to read, regardless of the device they were using, but in a peak time period, I'd still like seats turned-over reasonably promptly. Lingering over the last dregs of coffee to get to the end of a chapter isn't something I'd like to see. Communication with the patron in a polite manner might well work most of the time and serve a lit better than a blunt sign.

Cheers,

Michael P

[sabredog]

Originally Posted by Metal Mick

Hi all,
In Oz there are places that now request patrons to turn off phones or at least silenced whilst on the premises. And increasing numbers of places are refusing to serve people attempt to order whilst in the middle of a call.

Perhaps there is an issue of ettiquette here, and in the past there may have been others hammering away on their laptop/netbook and the clacking has proved a distraction.

Cheers,

Michael P

Could not agree more about mobile phones. My wife works at Woolworths and she will not serve a customer yakking on a mobile phone. She considers it to be the utter height of rudeness.

[Worldwalker]

Originally Posted by sabredog

I think the shop staff and perhaps the managers need a lesson in what is a computer and what is an ereading device. Perhaps then there might be a modification in policy due to increased awareness in the differences between the two.

Well, there's the problem: What if it's an iPad? Is that an ereader or a computer? Now they're stuck telling customers it's okay to read War & Peace but not catch up on their email. That's an even larger and squirmier can of worms.

Remember, the original problem is highly unlikely to have been people reading (pbooks, ebooks, or newspapers for that matter) and very likely to have been people spending an hour or two (or more) on their computer, doing office work outside the office. Trying to keep people from doing the latter without intruding on their privacy is next to impossible, and leads back to the only option being setting timers for each table, and kicking customers out when the timers expire. Or, just restricting the use of anything likely to be a time-sucking device at certain tables and certain times.

All they're trying to do, really, is make sure that their customers (y'know, people like you) don't have to eat and drink standing up in a corner because some inconsiderate schmuck is hogging a table and using the place as a branch office.

[SkyDream]

Originally Posted by J. Strnad

It's always amusing to see how people miss the obvious.

Problem: People stay too long, taking up table space during lunch hour.
Solution: Set a time limit.

Instead, they say "No computers!" Is a Kindle a computer? Is a mobile phone a computer? Can you read on your mobile phone, or are people not allowed to use those, either? I saw in the comments that one guy was told he couldn't read his Kindle while waiting for his order!

People. Evolution still has a lot of work to do.

Right. Why computer ?
I'll take a book and stay until it's finished buying only one small coffee.
I'll take a newspaper and stay until it's finished buying only one small coffee.
I'll have a 6-hour discussion about the universe buying only one small coffee.

No computer.
No books.
No newspaper.
No talking.
....
No customers.