E Ink forecasts loss as ebook device demand falls

[QuantumIguana]

Originally Posted by faithbw

While it's great for you that you love e-ink readers, you are part of what is becoming a minority. For now, the Kindle is still the more popular e-reader but what are people buying when they want to replace their Kindle?

Perhaps e-ink readers will be in the minority, but that doesn't mean they will go away. Amazon doesn't seem inclined to cease production of e-ink Kindles anytime soon. Phones haven't driven MP3 players from the market and haven't driven digital cameras from the market. You can still get film cameras if you want. MP3 players haven't driven CD players from the market.

Originally Posted by cfrizz

Those of you who love your einks have at it, but the flimsy excuses that you give for not using anything else are kind of lame.

No one is making excuses. What is so difficult in understanding that other people have their own preferences, and that no one needs your approval?

[OtterBooks]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

Those of you who love your einks have at it, but the flimsy excuses that you give for not using anything else are kind of lame.

The excuse is that it's similar to print. There's nothing lame about that unless you don't care much for the visual quality of print. If you do, there is nothing else. Not that there isn't anything better, but there isn't anything at all. Your tablet, your phone, they don't do worse; they don't do it. The other stuff like battery life and isolation from other features are just additional similarities to the experience of reading a printed book.

This isn't a zero sum game, anyway. The devices all use the same ebook content. Not sure why anyone cares how many different options there are.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by crossi

I bought a Fire HD a couple years after I bought my Kindle. I really hate using it even for web surfing. It's too heavy for me to be comfortable carrying it around and for reading. The touch screen and small screen size is inferior to my big screen computer and mouse for web surfing and I prefer movies on my big screen TV. The Fire for me is only for emergency web access somewhere a real computer is not available. Doesn't come up very often. So I really hope eink doesn't go away since I use my kindle constantly.

Isn't there anyone else who hates using tablets? Any tablet any size?

The only time I use my tablet is for reading magazines when traveling. And last time I flew, I didn't even bother taking it. I used to use it more, until I realized I didn't really like it that much. These days I use the Zinio Desktop Reader for magazines on my laptop instead.

I can certainly see why a lot of people use them, but it just doesn't fit my usage patterns or preferences. Even my android phone - handy in a pinch, but the most-used app on it is the calculator. Most of the things these mobile devices are good at are things I don't need, or at least not in a mobile form factor.

[faithbw]

Originally Posted by QuantumIguana

Perhaps e-ink readers will be in the minority, but that doesn't mean they will go away. Amazon doesn't seem inclined to cease production of e-ink Kindles anytime soon. Phones haven't driven MP3 players from the market and haven't driven digital cameras from the market. You can still get film cameras if you want. MP3 players haven't driven CD players from the market.

I guess we'll see. At this point, e-ink could go either way. Maybe e-ink will be like 8tracks or maybe they'll be like vinyl. I think the vinyl analogy is the best e-ink can hope for though and that will depend on how much demand exists for their technology.

[QuantumIguana]

Originally Posted by faithbw

I guess we'll see. At this point, e-ink could go either way. Maybe e-ink will be like 8tracks or maybe they'll be like vinyl. I think the vinyl analogy is the best e-ink can hope for though and that will depend on how much demand exists for their technology.

Or maybe e-ink is like CD, falling behind MP3 downloads, but still viable. The advantages of e-ink are real, while the advantaged of vinyl are largely imaginary. My wife has a tablet, she has to plug it in just about every day, while I can go several days without charging. It's also lighter than a tablet and easier to read in sunlight. As for vinyl, it's questionable whether or not people can actually tell the difference between a high-quality vinyl record and a CD. I used to have an 8-track player, and 8-track had little advantage over cassette. You got over cover art on the 8-track, I suppose. But songs would be cut off in the middle as the device changed tracks. There's enough of an advantage to e-ink to keep a viable market for it. E-ink is too young a technology, the stuff of sci-fi just a few years ago to write its epitaph so soon. Before we would see an end to e-ink readers, we would likely see Amazon slowing down the release of new e-ink Kindle models.

[robko]

Originally Posted by faithbw

I guess we'll see. At this point, e-ink could go either way. Maybe e-ink will be like 8tracks or maybe they'll be like vinyl. I think the vinyl analogy is the best e-ink can hope for though and that will depend on how much demand exists for their technology.

I really don't think these are valid analogies. Since e-ink readers can use the same file as you would use on your tablet or phone, there is still going to be lots of NEW consumable content out there. Demand for the devices may fall, but falling demand for the reader isn't going to kill the demand for the content so it doesn't become a negative feedback loop (i.e. more people started using CD's vs vinyl, so the amount of vinyl demand goes down to a point where it starts "forcing" people to CD's because the content they want isn't available on vinyl (only on CD's) which reduces vinyl demand more, which means that eventually there is a tiny market and constantly declining demand for vinyl "readers" (record players) because there is constantly reduced NEW content available). Since e-readers will be able to consume the new content there will be some migration to new devices (tablet/phone) BUT there will still be a viable MAINSTREAM niche market for e-ink because there will continue to be NEW content available so mainstream users wont' be "forced" to a new type of device to consume. Vinyl has a niche market still but it could be hardly called a mainstream niche since there is limited new content available (you can't get most new mainstream artists vinyl).

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by robko

...Since e-readers will be able to consume the new content there will be some migration to new devices (tablet/phone) BUT there will still be a viable MAINSTREAM niche market for e-ink because there will continue to be NEW content available so mainstream users wont' be "forced" to a new type of device to consume...

That recent kerfuffle over ADE 3 shows that this isn't necessarily so. Most of the e-ink devices today wouldn't be able to read that content. If publishers insist on that being the only format for sale at some point in the future, then people with those devices are going to have to get new devices if they want to buy new ebooks.

The specs for vinyl records and CDs are fixed. Ebook DRM specs aren't.

[Namekuseijin]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

Those of you who love your einks have at it, but the flimsy excuses that you give for not using anything else are kind of lame.

Last I heard you can put any tablet or phone into airplane mode thereby silencing the phone, or notifications that come through, and tablets and phones come in different sizes and weights for just about anyone.

Don't blame the machine for your lack of discipline. It's amazing how many people just forget that machines are here to serve us at our convenience, NOT the other way around.

We all managed to survive just fine without all of it before it came along. My phone stays in airplane mode all the time unless I am traveling or turn on wifi a couple times a month to check for updates.

No one is putting a gun to your head to drop everything right now to answer your phone or check emails.

I used to think just like this. I used to read a lot on my smartphone, but it's not just that you know the battery is being drained away every minute, it's not just the glare, it's not just the temptation to do something else with your do-it-all device, the temptation of games, web surfing: it's just that the kindle just feels like a book.

No thinking about battery. No eye strain. Just the right size, weight and a good grip. And foremost: no temptations besides other books. Feels just like a book.

funny thing is that my smartphone remains in my pocket while I'm reading and I feel no temptation to reach for it, aside perhaps to answer email or to choose another song.

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by Namekuseijin

I used to think just like this. I used to read a lot on my smartphone, but it's not just that you know the battery is being drained away every minute, it's not just the glare, it's not just the temptation to do something else with your do-it-all device, the temptation of games, web surfing: it's just that the kindle just feels like a book.

No thinking about battery. No eye strain. Just the right size, weight and a good grip. And foremost: no temptations besides other books. Feels just like a book.

funny thing is that my smartphone remains in my pocket while I'm reading and I feel no temptation to reach for it, aside perhaps to answer email or to choose another song.

Cool. I solve the battery problem with a charger at work should it drop too low if I forget to charge it over night, but I could easily use it for two days without charging.

For me the wrapper doesn't matter so long as I'm able to read my books. The bottom line, eink readers are going anywhere anytime soon but neither are tablets/smartphones.

So all you worry warts need to take a pill and relax. Read on whatever you like. There is no right or wrong choice when it comes to reading our books now.

[meeera]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

Those of you who love your einks have at it, but the flimsy excuses that you give for not using anything else are kind of lame.

Last I heard you can put any tablet or phone into airplane mode thereby silencing the phone, or notifications that come through, and tablets and phones come in different sizes and weights for just about anyone.

"Excuses"? *eyeroll*

I have and love my iPad Mini Retina. And yet, I much prefer to read novels on my Kobo Aura.

But I'm sure you'll be rushing back to explain exactly which six inch tablet is just as light as the Aura, and has weeks of battery life and excellent readability in outdoor light.

[robko]

Originally Posted by rkomar

That recent kerfuffle over ADE 3 shows that this isn't necessarily so. Most of the e-ink devices today wouldn't be able to read that content. If publishers insist on that being the only format for sale at some point in the future, then people with those devices are going to have to get new devices if they want to buy new ebooks.

The specs for vinyl records and CDs are fixed. Ebook DRM specs aren't.

That's true, BUT the new ADE doesn't preclude a new e-ink reader (or firmware update to fix old ones) that will make it work. A CD is never going to be able to be played on a record player. And you'll still be able to read the same file on a new e-ink ereader as a tablet, so it doesn't kill the market for ereaders.

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by robko

That's true, BUT the new ADE doesn't preclude a new e-ink reader (or firmware update to fix old ones) that will make it work. A CD is never going to be able to be played on a record player. And you'll still be able to read the same file on a new e-ink ereader as a tablet, so it doesn't kill the market for ereaders.

I hope so. In the thread on ADE3 here, it was stated that an always-on network connection was required for reading the content. If so, that will impact the market for e-ink devices, since battery life will drop through the floor when WiFi is continuously on, and one of the main advantages of the devices will be wiped out.

[AlbertaCowboy]

Originally Posted by rkomar

I hope so. In the thread on ADE3 here, it was stated that an always-on network connection was required for reading the content. If so, that will impact the market for e-ink devices, since battery life will drop through the floor when WiFi is continuously on, and one of the main advantages of the devices will be wiped out.

That won't bug me. As soon as ebooks go to an always network connected requirement, I'll go back to paper.

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by rkomar

I hope so. In the thread on ADE3 here, it was stated that an always-on network connection was required for reading the content. If so, that will impact the market for e-ink devices, since battery life will drop through the floor when WiFi is continuously on, and one of the main advantages of the devices will be wiped out.

I don't think it was stated by anyone who would know or even stated at all as a true fact, some people said it might happen but it is pretty doubtful IMO only.

Helen

[LovesMacs]

Originally Posted by faithbw

I guess we'll see. At this point, e-ink could go either way. Maybe e-ink will be like 8tracks or maybe they'll be like vinyl. I think the vinyl analogy is the best e-ink can hope for though and that will depend on how much demand exists for their technology.

I think a more accurate comparison is e-ink vs. lcd as similar to basic DVD player vs. Blu-ray. Blu-ray players are backwards compatible with ordinary DVDs much as smartphones and tablets are easily able to display anything that e-ink can.

This isn't to downplay the obvious differences in display quality and battery life.