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Old 04-13-2015, 06:43 PM   #16
Katsunami
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So why are people more averse to young people being portrayed as being able to do things they couldn't/wouldn't actually be able to do, but not adults being portrayed as being able to do things they couldn't/wouldn't actually be able to do?

Don't get me wrong; it's no real skin off my back, but it seems YA fiction is often held to a higher "realism" standard than regular A fiction is. There's no real shortage of adults doing impossible things in adult fiction is there?
It's not the problem that the youngsters can do impossible things.

The problem is in the fact that all those 14-15 year old kids behave, think, reason and act as if they're at least 5-10 years older.

As a comparison, take Stephen King's IT. OK, it's fantasy/horror, and not young adult, but the book still features kids that do some serious stuff.

The difference with most YA fantasy novels is that the kids actually come across like kids, instead of adults in a kid's body; to me, at least.

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Old 04-13-2015, 07:19 PM   #17
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I get what you're saying--it makes sense. I guess I just don't see why it should matter all that much in fiction ... especially fantasy. To me, it's just as weird and unrealistic (but still quite fun at times) that an adult would strap on a world-saving hat and throw themselves at demons and monsters and aliens for the good of all mankind. Instead of saying, you know ... "meh, not my problem."
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:19 PM   #18
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http://www.audiemurphy.com/

Take a long hard look at any list of the top warriors of any war.
Totally reckless.
Usually end up dead. And those are trained soldiers.

In YA stories the reckless kids get into messes trained soldiers would run away from. Screaming.
The kids survive.
Which is fine for story purposes.

(But it seems to annoy some.)
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:30 PM   #19
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I get what you're saying--it makes sense. I guess I just don't see why it should matter all that much in fiction ... especially fantasy. To me, it's just as weird and unrealistic (but still quite fun at times) that an adult would strap on a world-saving hat and throw themselves at demons and monsters and aliens for the good of all mankind. Instead of saying, you know ... "meh, not my problem."
Depends on the writer.
Some do address the situation by providing the character with proper incentives and justification. Katniss Everdeen being an experienced hunter and trapper, for example.

(One recent read of mine concerns a soccer mom that gets caught in the machinations of a demon-raising cult. Self-preservation and her religious devotion combined with the mythology of the story universe explains everything. A fun read, too. Soccer mom being a martial arts monster and all...)

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Old 04-13-2015, 07:36 PM   #20
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Totally reckless.
Usually end up dead. And those are trained soldiers.

In YA stories the reckless kids get into messes trained soldiers would run away from. Screaming.
The kids survive.
Which is fine for story purposes.

(But it seems to annoy some.)
The reckless ones do end up dead, but they don't accomplish anything and quite properly nobody gives them any awards.

Sound judgment does not require cowardice.

Kids can survive a lot.
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Old 04-14-2015, 11:56 AM   #21
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The reckless ones do end up dead, but they don't accomplish anything and quite properly nobody gives them any awards.

Sound judgment does not require cowardice.

Kids can survive a lot.
Sure.
Random examples can be found for everything.
But statistically, teenagers are more reckless than adults (just look at car insurance rates, teen pregnancy rates, etc). The kids that do survive unharmed are precisely the ones who don't engage in risky behavior at all.

Which is the joke behind the O.P.

Real world teenagers are not typically heroic world saviors any more than adults are. It's no big deal but it does lend itself to some cute jokes.
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Old 04-17-2015, 10:51 PM   #22
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Could be because being truly heroic requires making wise choices in challenging situations, something under-25's are notorious for *not* doing. Could be the "extreme commonality" in settings and plots.

Or it could be the popularity of the subgenre.

I recall watching a Top Gear Episode where The UK Government wanted to ban 18-25 year old adults from driving at night or something and Clarkson brought up the fact that a WW2 was on the most part fought by 18-25 year old adults.

I tend to think if it happened today we would have lost.
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Old 04-17-2015, 11:13 PM   #23
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I recall watching a Top Gear Episode where The UK Government wanted to ban 18-25 year old adults from driving at night or something and Clarkson brought up the fact that a WW2 was on the most part fought by 18-25 year old adults.

I tend to think if it happened today we would have lost.
Well, then and now it hasn't been all or random 18 to 25 year olds.
It has been screened and mentally conditioned 18 to 25 year olds.

And the less capable retained personnel get shuffled of to wash pots or shuffle papers under close supervision so the damage those troops can do is restrained.
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Old 04-18-2015, 07:52 AM   #24
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Well, then and now it hasn't been all or random 18 to 25 year olds.
It has been screened and mentally conditioned 18 to 25 year olds.

And the less capable retained personnel get shuffled of to wash pots or shuffle papers under close supervision so the damage those troops can do is restrained.
In good armies.
In other armies, the young ones are told they are "chosen one" and sent to clear minefields. Iran-Iraq war, for one.
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Old 04-19-2015, 01:33 PM   #25
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So why are people more averse to young people being portrayed as being able to do things they couldn't/wouldn't actually be able to do, but not adults being portrayed as being able to do things they couldn't/wouldn't actually be able to do?

Don't get me wrong; it's no real skin off my back, but it seems YA fiction is often held to a higher "realism" standard than regular A fiction is. There's no real shortage of adults doing impossible things in adult fiction is there?
I could believe that a 30-40 something year old could save the world through skill, wisdom, and experience. A 15 year old kid? Not so much. It just stretches my suspension of disbelief too far.
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Old 04-19-2015, 01:36 PM   #26
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Age-ist.
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Old 04-19-2015, 02:28 PM   #27
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I could believe that a 30-40 something year old could save the world through skill, wisdom, and experience. A 15 year old kid? Not so much. It just stretches my suspension of disbelief too far.
^ This ^

Because of this, I often get the urge to just stop reading and switch to a different book, as soon as I discover that the protagonist / world savior / super-hero is a kid... again.

For some weird reason I never do though, as if I like to torture myself or something :X
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Old 04-20-2015, 07:32 AM   #28
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^ This ^

Because of this, I often get the urge to just stop reading and switch to a different book, as soon as I discover that the protagonist / world savior / super-hero is a kid... again.

For some weird reason I never do though, as if I like to torture myself or something :X
I don't understand this. You read fantasy. You have no problem believing in orcs, trolls and elves, but...a competent teenager is so unbelievable it's annoying?

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Old 04-20-2015, 07:42 AM   #29
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I don't understand this. You read fantasy. You have no problem believing in orcs, trolls and elves, but...a competent teenager is so unbelievable it's annoying?

Shari
Well, the only rule in fantasy is self-consistency, a test most teenagers fail regularly.
Different tastes, different thresholds of disbelief. Some things, not even fantasy can accommodate.

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Old 04-22-2015, 05:37 AM   #30
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but...a competent teenager is so unbelievable it's annoying?
I find it unbelievable that teenagers have non-monosyllabic dialog.
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