Privacy - Is it just me?

[Greg Anos]

Originally Posted by sianon

Have you ever stopped to consider that it is rather an egocentric point of view to think that Amazon would consider you as an individual to be worth specifically monitoring what you read. For heavens sake, you are accessing the internet and every site you visit is being recorded by your ISP and can be accessed if required.

Not really. The power of automation....

For example, what if, say JK Rowling wanted all copies of her titles deleted off all Kindles everywhere. Convince Amazon, plug in a data string, punch a button and there you go. Nothing personal, everybody got hammered...

That's the point of the Kindle setup. You grant a push window for amazon to do basically anything they wish. Now they may not wish much, but it's their choice, not yours. Nor do you have to be singled out, you just have to be in the target zone (sic).

[suecsi]

Originally Posted by ChrisC333

NO! NO! NO! Don’t wear the tinfoil hat - that’s exactly what THEY want you to do! They don’t protect your brainwaves at all! Our research has proved that they actually act as RECEIVERS for the multi-national thought manipulating cartels.


Think about it. What do they call those little tracking doodads that they sneak onto your computer - Cookies. And what do some people use tinfoil for baking - yes, it’s Cookies again. Coincidence? I think not.....


The only way to use your KIndle or (brain) Kurdle as THEY call it - is to wear one of our fully organic head protectors - made from 100% natural cow-dung and adobe, using a recipe passed down for centuries by really cosmic old dead dudes from ancient times. Just remember - iPad is an anagram of Dipa - which means “brain-invader” in Ancient Dead Dude Language. It all adds up! Buy a brain screen hat now while stocks last. Coming soon to a paranoiac near you...


Or you could just act as if it really doesn’t matter a damn if some computer somewhere is mindlessly crunching through billions of bytes of dross about which books people clicked on just so that they can send you an automated email saying:

Greetings Zordan the Insignificant,

People like you have been buying “101 Ancient Dung and Adobe Brain Hat Recipes” by Wise Dead Dude” - would you care to cough up for a copy?

P.S. Our server loved your porn collection - it found a couple of clips it didn’t have yet.


You have been warned.

Personally, I'm relaxed about this....

But then I’m pretty strange.


They know that, you know....

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Not really. The power of automation....

For example, what if, say JK Rowling wanted all copies of her titles deleted off all Kindles everywhere. Convince Amazon, plug in a data string, punch a button and there you go. Nothing personal, everybody got hammered...

That's the point of the Kindle setup. You grant a push window for amazon to do basically anything they wish. Now they may not wish much, but it's their choice, not yours. Nor do you have to be singled out, you just have to be in the target zone (sic).

I don't think it can work that way. as I said earlier, if you have done your own scanning, you are fully within your rights to put that copy on your Kindle and Amazon can't do anything about it. sure, they retain info on the stuff you buy, but I don't think they have the ability to read anything on your Kindle that didn't come from them

[DawnFalcon]

Under the agreement which you've signed up to, though, they have the right to.

[TGS]

I accept that some people are not concerned about what Amazon might or might not do with their Kindles. Thats's fine - I don't feel any need to question their sanity or cast aspersions on their personalities. What I don't accept is that those same people question my sanity and cast aspersions on my personality because I do have concerns.

Neither I, nor I suspect the pro-Kindle contributors to this thread, apparently actually know what Amazon can do, has done or will do with the data on Kindles. But attempting to ridicule both the concerns and the people who have them is singularly unhelpful. What would be useful is information about Amazon's capabilities to interact with devices and evidence about how they have exercised any such capability.

[vaughnmr]

Originally Posted by TGS

I accept that some people are not concerned about what Amazon might or might not do with their Kindles. Thats's fine - I don't feel any need to question their sanity or cast aspersions on their personalities. What I don't accept is that those same people question my sanity and cast aspersions on my personality because I do have concerns.

Neither I, nor I suspect the pro-Kindle contributors to this thread, apparently actually know what Amazon can do, has done or will do with the data on Kindles. But attempting to ridicule both the concerns and the people who have them is singularly unhelpful. What would be useful is information about Amazon's capabilities to interact with devices and evidence about how they have exercised any such capability.

What's kinda tickling my funny bone, is that you've singled out Amazon. No mention of Apple, or B&N, or any of the other sites that could sell you ebooks. Not to mention any of the other web related, government related, or any other commercial related sites (banks, insurance, medical records, drivers license, IRS, Social Security) need I go on... You are too late, they've already got your a**! How about sharing news about the information THOSE sites either sell or share? Or is this just a Amazon bashing thread?

[DawnFalcon]

Okay, which of the other online bookstores has an agreement involving this level of tracking?

Also, this is a books site, which you may not have noticed, so...yea, discussing booksellers.

Simply because some records are out there does not excuse a company from being overly broad in the details it records about you. You mention things like banks and medical records...where there are laws specifying tight access and security parameters for storing the data. Amazon has none of those. You're smokescreening on an issue some people feel strongly about.

[vaughnmr]

Originally Posted by DawnFalcon

Okay, which of the other online bookstores has an agreement involving this level of tracking?

Also, this is a books site, which you may not have noticed, so...yea, discussing booksellers.

Simply because some records are out there does not excuse a company from being overly broad in the details it records about you. You mention things like banks and medical records...where there are laws specifying tight access and security parameters for storing the data. Amazon has none of those. You're smokescreening on an issue some people feel strongly about.

Ok, so list the privacy terms of all the other booksellers, and how they differ from Amazon. Include Apple, in another week they will also be involved. All I've heard so far is talk, innuendo. Actually nail the companies down and get them to list the privacy issues, specifically list out your concerns and how they differ from Amazon.

Amazon removed the books from Kindles at the request of publishers, in the case of "1984", due to a copyright issue, and in my mind they did the right thing, but not in the right method, and they learned from that. Probably no other bookseller will repeat that.

[Greg Anos]

Originally Posted by vaughnmr

What's kinda tickling my funny bone, is that you've singled out Amazon. No mention of Apple, or B&N, or any of the other sites that could sell you ebooks. Not to mention any of the other web related, government related, or any other commercial related sites (banks, insurance, medical records, drivers license, IRS, Social Security) need I go on... You are too late, they've already got your a**! How about sharing news about the information THOSE sites either sell or share? Or is this just a Amazon bashing thread?

Some things you can't help, but why open the door for everybody as a matter of policy?

What level of paranoia do you want to be at?

I keep locks on my doors. They won't stop a pro thief, I know that. I'm just discouraging the amateurs. It might be more convenient (to use an old example) to give the milkman the key to the house so he puts the milk directly in the fridge, instead of on the doorstep, but for security reasons, I'll pick it up myself. Nor do I think that this concept is being overly paranoid.

Your mileage may differ...

What I find interesting is the number of people who really don't care who economically (or legally) stalks them. I just hope they don't get their eyes opened the hard way....

[tirsales]

Well .. do you strip in public? Would you read your diary (provided you are keeping one) out loud on a marketplace? Do you want your neighbors, colleagues and your boss to listen to every phonecall you are doing, reading every email you write, etc?
Answered "no" to any of the questions above? Then you SHOULD value your privacy.

[TGS]

Originally Posted by vaughnmr

What's kinda tickling my funny bone, is that you've singled out Amazon. No mention of Apple, or B&N, or any of the other sites that could sell you ebooks. Not to mention any of the other web related, government related, or any other commercial related sites (banks, insurance, medical records, drivers license, IRS, Social Security) need I go on... You are too late, they've already got your a**! How about sharing news about the information THOSE sites either sell or share? Or is this just a Amazon bashing thread?

I've got absolutely nothing against Amazon - in fact I've just ordered £130 worth of pbooks from them because i can't get them as ebooks, and I can't get the pbooks cheaper elsewhere. And I do acknowledge that other book sellers will keep information about my purchasing and probably browsing activity. But I on this occasion I wasn't looking at Amazon to buy a book, I was looking at Amazon with a view to buying a device for reading books. If all that Amazon required me to agree to was for them keep details of my purchases of ebooks I would have no more grounds for complaint than I do against other ebook sellers. But they don't - they require of me that I agree to them having continued and ongoing access to the device after I have bought it, at times and for purposes they deem fit. Their intentions might be entirely innocent but I have no way of telling because I don't know what their intentions are - but even whilst not knowing this I am required, as a condition of buying a Kindle, to agree to them having that access. So, for me, that is a condition I'm not willing to accept.

And I don't own any Apple devices, so have now idea what access they would require to them if I did.

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by DawnFalcon

Under the agreement which you've signed up to, though, they have the right to.

prove it

[Ben Thornton]

For me, it would be messing about with the content that would be the worry, rather than recording purchases. I'd hate to be half-way through reading something and have it disappear. The practical answer would be to remove DRM etc. and squirrel a copy away, I suppose, were that legal.

[DawnFalcon]

Originally Posted by vaughnmr

Amazon removed the books from Kindles at the request of publishers, in the case of "1984", due to a copyright issue, and in my mind they did the right thing

If you support an action which should of seen a criminal case and a considerable fine against them, well, lecture time then I'll ignore you in this thread:

Just because you're happy, as Sanya Thomas put it, hanging your ass out online, doesn't mean everyone is. People are different, and what you dismiss is very important to other people. Cavalierly dismissing people's objections on privacy because of your own views is closed minded.

[DawnFalcon]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

prove it

Read the agreement.

"information related to the content on your Device and your use of it"

Not "content you have bought from us", "content on your device". Remember, I am not talking about what Amazon does, I am talking about what the agreement allows them to do.