Embedded fonts & italics

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by theducks

Fallback is a good idea unless you are 100% positive your font request will be honored

serif is the default. If your font is properly embedded it will be honored and if not, then serif is not gong to be honored either.

[Turtle91]

Wouldn't the 'default' be app/device dependent? Seems like providing a fallback is still a good idea, and it doesn't take up a lot of space...

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

Wouldn't the 'default' be app/device dependent? Seems like providing a fallback is still a good idea, and it doesn't take up a lot of space...

serif is the default. So by default, the fallback is serif. Minimalist code is best. Don't ad in things because you don't trust your code.

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

Wouldn't the 'default' be app/device dependent? Seems like providing a fallback is still a good idea, and it doesn't take up a lot of space...

Exactly

[Turtle91]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

serif is the default. So by default, the fallback is serif. Minimalist code is best. Don't ad in things because you don't trust your code.

lol. Yes I agree with minimalist code but I throw in some common sense. Having a fallback in case the device/app doesn't display the first (embedded) font - for whatever reason - is smart coding. To be minimalist, I would just remove the ';' at the end of the last item...

I would specify serif as the fallback just so someone's device/app doesn't set sans as their default when I, as the creator, want those particular letters to be serif. 7 extra letters to prevent a catastrophic meltdown is worth it to me.

[GrannyGrump]

@Turtle91 said

--- To be minimalist, I would just remove the ';' at the end of the last item...

I used to do that, and it bit me in the patoot many times -- when I would make a quick addition at the bottom of the css class, I would forget to add that colon, and then of course, the new line would be ignored.

@Psymon --- you are aware you need to buy a special license for that Larabie font if you want to embed it in an e-book? He doesn't let his fonts get re-distributed free of charge (can't really blame him, I guess). I've seen many of his fonts I wanted to use, but every single one needs that purchased license for e-book embedding.

[Psymon]

Pardon the belated reply here -- computer problems all weekend!

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I've since edited my post and removed the 100%. It is not needed. You may have wanted 124%, but you put in 100%. You don't want 124% either. You use option to change the font size. You cannot guarantee that others won't change the font szie, so you set the font at the default size and set other fonts size in relation to 1em.

Yeah, I normally wouldn't use anything other than 100% as my basefont, but this book I'm working on is rather a "fun," almost comicbook-like little piece, and I just thought it was nicer with a bigger font, it seems to fit this particular piece -- although it certainly doesn't "have" to be that way, of course.

Also, on a separate note...

Originally Posted by GrannyGrump

@Psymon --- you are aware you need to buy a special license for that Larabie font if you want to embed it in an e-book? He doesn't let his fonts get re-distributed free of charge (can't really blame him, I guess). I've seen many of his fonts I wanted to use, but every single one needs that purchased license for e-book embedding.

Oh, crap! That's what I get for not fully reading the EULA -- I saw "These fonts include a license that allows free commercial use" and stopped reading there (it would seem).

Well, that's a bummer. The style of this font perfectly suits the material I'm working with, and it's the fact that it has both bold and italic versions that were the clincher in choosing this one. Dang... guess I'll have to go searching for a different one now. It's REALLY hard to find free fonts that have the different weights, etc. one needs, though. :/

[GrannyGrump]

@Psymon --- yes, that phrasing of COMMERCIAL refers to use in print books and other created works that display a font without allowing access to the font "software". You need to look for the magic words "may be freely distributed" or "may be used on websites" or "may be embedded in e-books". Lots of font-makers say "free for commercial use" and they might even think that includes re-distribution --- I have heard of people who have contacted the maker and got permission to distribute (the maker just didn't know how to properly word their license).

To make sure you are getting a distributable font, try google fonts (almost everything is SIL OFL or CC or GNU license )https://www.google.com/fonts

Open Font Library is good also, all re-distributable https://fontlibrary.org/

font squirrel has a great selection, but check every license.

[Psymon]

Originally Posted by GrannyGrump

@Psymon --- yes, that phrasing of COMMERCIAL refers to use in print books and other created works that display a font without allowing access to the font "software". You need to look for the magic words "may be freely distributed" or "may be used on websites" or "may be embedded in e-books". Lots of font-makers say "free for commercial use" and they might even think that includes re-distribution --- I have heard of people who have contacted the maker and got permission to distribute (the maker just didn't know how to properly word their license).

Good point. I wish there was, like, at least one site out there that offered up ONLY "free for commercial use" fonts -- there's tons of free font sites out there, but it's such an ordeal to find ones that you can actually use "freely," and even harder to find free fonts that have various weights, styles, etc.

Don't suppose you, or anyone else, knows of a font site that's "free for commercial use" only like that?

[GrannyGrump]

@Psymon ---
The google fonts library and OpenFontLibrary fonts are ALL licensed for Distribution and Embedding --- Look for SIL OFL (Open Font License), GNU License, Creative Commons License.


Font squirrel offers almost all "Free Commercial", and many are ALSO DISTRIBUTABLE, and that is what you are looking for, right? You just must check the license for each font, and if they don't explicitly allow distribution or website/ebook embedding, you should avoid them to prevent hassles with the font creator.

Some other sources have great selections, but yeah, you have to check the licensing for each font. (daFont, FontSpace, the laTex catalog http://www.tug.dk/FontCatalogue/, etc. etc.

If you upload an image of a font you like to WhatFontIs (font identifying service), they often suggest free similar alternative fonts. Again, you have to research the licensing.

[Freeshadow]

re:licensing That's what I really don't understand: where's the fecking difference between a font used in e.g. PDF (thus partially embedded) and the same subsetted and thus also (only) partially embedded in an e-book?

[GrannyGrump]

@Freeshadow --- maybe because for many years there was no way to extract a font out of a pdf. Also, there is no guarantee that the book creator will actually subset the font (they might not care about file size) --- there is nothing to prevent embedding the complete font, and then the full font is available to the public.

Incidentally, I have actually seen on some of the less-reputable "free font" sites, uploads of partial fonts --- so we know the uploader extracted a subsetted font from somewhere, and illegally offered it for distribution.
I don't know why they would bother --- so many fonts are pirated and offered for free download --- you can get full sets of Adobe fonts with 9 faces from many different free font sites.

[Jellby]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

re:licensing That's what I really don't understand: where's the fecking difference between a font used in e.g. PDF (thus partially embedded) and the same subsetted and thus also (only) partially embedded in an e-book?

Especially since a PDF can include a full font too...

[dgatwood]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

re:licensing That's what I really don't understand: where's the fecking difference between a font used in e.g. PDF (thus partially embedded) and the same subsetted and thus also (only) partially embedded in an e-book?

I can't type "unzip filename.pdf" and then copy the font to my Fonts folder and start using it. Yes, it might be all in there, but it takes a lot more work to extract it.

[Freeshadow]

My point is: If it's subsetted (as it should be) then even the unzipping won't magically fill the gaps. So you hardly get a font worth to "start using it" in both cases, if done properly the digital product - be it PDF or epub - contains the characters used within and nothing else. Therefor the licensing terms for both should be equal.