Do Americans have it better?

ficbot · 07-23-2009, 07:08 PM

Between the Kindle and the new USA-only Barnes & Noble venture, it's hard not to worry about the state of ebooks outside the USA. Do the publishers even realize that people in other countries might want in on this? Do they care? I get jealous sometimes about all the cool Kindles and gadgets the Americans have which are USA-only, and it annoys me when people refer to the Kindle as the 'market leader' and seem to forget that the 'market' is much more than just America, and the Kindle is a restricted item.

Here in Canada, we don't have the Kindle or Barnes & Noble. I seem to be getting by just fine with Fictionwise and my Sony, but I worry that things are just going to get more and more American, and I may be left behind if all these new products are only USA.

BUT...here in Canada we still have life+50 copyrights, so there are all sorts of things we can get for free that Americans can't

So I am curious, if you had to choose between 'Kindle and related products' OR 'life+50 copyright' which would you choose? Do Americans really have the better deal?

ahi · 07-23-2009, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ficbot

Between the Kindle and the new USA-only Barnes & Noble venture, it's hard not to worry about the state of ebooks outside the USA. Do the publishers even realize that people in other countries might want in on this? Do they care? I get jealous sometimes about all the cool Kindles and gadgets the Americans have which are USA-only, and it annoys me when people refer to the Kindle as the 'market leader' and seem to forget that the 'market' is much more than just America, and the Kindle is a restricted item.

Here in Canada, we don't have the Kindle or Barnes & Noble. I seem to be getting by just fine with Fictionwise and my Sony, but I worry that things are just going to get more and more American, and I may be left behind if all these new products are only USA.

BUT...here in Canada we still have life+50 copyrights, so there are all sorts of things we can get for free that Americans can't

So I am curious, if you had to choose between 'Kindle and related products' OR 'life+50 copyright' which would you choose? Do Americans really have the better deal?

I am actually astonished how little stuff there is in North American eBook stores that I couldn't care less about, particularly in contrast with how much good public domain stuff there is freely available.

Life+50 copyright definitely... until a vastly higher percentage of the North American eBook market becomes worth reading (from my questionably humble perspective).

- Ahi

Stitchawl · 07-23-2009, 08:00 PM

As an American, I am appalled at the nationalist attitudes and policies of my native country. Having lived outside the US for the past 20+ years and seen the USA through the eyes of the rest of the world, I can only say that we need to get our act together and stop relying upon our memories of what was, and plan for what will be!

I was shocked to discover that we were not #1. It went against everything I was taught to believe, and I'm sure my comments will raise the ire of many Americans here in MR. (I'm sorry. It's not my intention to offend. It's my intention to state facts.) I can't close my eyes to what I see every day. There is a very big world outside of the US that impacts every single economic, ecological, and political issue of our future.

Having closed markets will not destroy the industry. It will destroy America's ability to interact with the rest of the world. If this is a move to revert back to the Monroe Doctrine, it will be a good beginning. If it's part of a plan to help stem the flow of people traveling in or out of the US, it's a good beginning.

Amazon is NOT the only book seller. It's just the most advertised. Outside the US, Americans learn that there are many other retailers besides Sears, besides Walmart, besides Amazon. How many Americas have ever shopped at (or even heard of) a Tessco or a Carrefour? 7-Eleven is wide-spread but so is Sparr.

There is an entire world outside of Amazon. Outside of Sony-USA and its sales restrictions. Outside of "we don't ship outside CONUS." This is not going to affect the rest of the world's buying habits. It's going to teach that there are plenty of other avenues available.

I'll get off my soapbox now. Sorry for the rant.

Stitchawl

Gideon · 07-23-2009, 08:12 PM

This is just where an enormous amount of media and industry is centered. The countries are far from nationalistic, but many of them are based here. Amazon and B&N for instance.

I don't think ascribing nationalism to them is useful or accurate.

There greed will reach out and touch everyone soon enough.

ahi · 07-23-2009, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

I was shocked to discover that we were not #1. It went against everything I was taught to believe, and I'm sure my comments will raise the ire of many Americans here in MR. (I'm sorry. It's not my intention to offend. It's my intention to state facts.) I can't close my eyes to what I see every day. There is a very big world outside of the US that impacts every single economic, ecological, and political issue of our future.

May God have mercy on your soul if DixieGal's hometown lost another soldier today!

On a serious note though... I think the problem is that the anglophone publishing industries have a fairly insular focus. Yes, there is a lot of foreign stuff available in absolute terms... but, in fact, lots of considerably smaller national publishing industries out there give access and focus to a wider breadth of international literature at the expense of a thousand new cookie-cutter novels by unknown and untalented authors every week.

- Ahi

Sonist · 07-23-2009, 08:17 PM

Bleh, why bother selling ebooks outside of the US?

Everyone knows, that those people people can't read. Heck, most of them can't even speak, but just make some unintelligible sounds that don't make no sense.

Stitchawl · 07-23-2009, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonist

Bleh, why bother selling ebooks outside of the US?

Everyone knows, that those people people can't read. Heck, most of them can't even speak, but just make some unintelligible sounds that don't make no sense.

It would be even funnier, but a couple of years ago I was walking in downtown Kyoto and I overheard two American tourists (NY accents,) one saying to the other; "Look Helen, they even have a branch of "Takashimaya" here!!"

There is no doubt that many of the sales policies are generated by licensing agreements with publishers, manufacturers, and suppliers. These do make sense when there are external outlets for the same products in other countries and the originator needs to protect their clients. They do NOT make sense when there aren't!

Amazon's refusal to sell products outside the USA is too often (but not always) little more than internal policy. It extends to far many products from Amazon that can be obtained from other American outlets. When I click on a product in Amazon, the larger percentage of time I get a message 'this product can not be shipped to your location.' When I can get the same product from B&H in N.Y., I have to accept the fact that it is Amazon, and not the supplier, making the rule.

Stitchawl

kazbates · 07-23-2009, 08:49 PM

Why does it always come down to a question of the US versus everyone else? I'm an American and love my country. It has it's faults, just as I have mine. There are things about my country that I am enormously proud of and things that completely distress me. I would imagine most people feel the same about their countries. One of the many things I like about MR is the friendly international spirit that is represented by it's members. I can relate to posters in Paris, the UK, Australia, etc., and feel that life and all it's foibles is the same no matter where we live.

Having said all that, I can understand non-Americans' frustration with not being able to purchase some of the technology that is available here in the US. I'm sure their are a whole host of reasons why these things are not sold outside of the US yet. I have theories as to why, but since I am not skilled in market analysis, trade agreements, technology transfer, etc., they are probably pretty basic. I just hate to see this turn into yet another we vs. them.

ficbot · 07-23-2009, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kazbates

Why does it always come down to a question of the US versus everyone else? (

I can't speak for 'always' but in this case, I think it's fairly clear why and I think I pose a legitimate question

rixte · 07-23-2009, 10:16 PM

Well, I have to say, personally I'm envious of some of the devices we're seeing for release in Korea. And I'd kill to get that Pocket 360 I've seen linked to!

HansTWN · 07-23-2009, 10:22 PM

No need to get all excited about this. Yes, thinks tend to be cheaper in America because it is very big market, the competition is immense, and Americans are extremely price sensitive. But there are ways around these restrictions.

Well, Americans pay the price elsewhere. Lousy to mediocre cell phone service at ridiculously high prices. Expensive and slow internet and cable TV. The world's worst air lines. Long work hours. All evens out in the end.

Gideon · 07-23-2009, 10:24 PM

And a horrid lack of decent health care!

griffonwing · 07-23-2009, 10:27 PM

I'm not impressed with anything in the ereader field that is America-only. America has to have "it slices, it dices, it marinates your chicken WHILE it debones the bird..." and it's all proprietary-this, and exclusive-that. It's frustrating.

Like when Dell (and not JUST dell, Compaq, HP, Gateway2000) came out with their PCs, you couldn't change anything, you had to send it back to the company and have a proprietary mobo put in, or a specific kind of RAM. Now that they've made a name for themselves, they've opened up to the universal formats.

I do not see the Topaz or BBeB format lasting too much longer. I also don't see Amazon and B&N being USA-only too much longer either. Once the companies in the US get their eyes open and their respective heads from out of their arses, we might see some progress.

I just wish our US govt would get their heads out of THEIR arses and actually listen to the people of this nation. Maybe then we'd start to get back some respect in this world. I stand proud of America, but shameful of my country's political machinations.

HansTWN · 07-23-2009, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gideon

And a horrid lack of decent health care!

I tried to be diplomatic and not mention this sensitive issue, lest I provoke a storm of outrage.

Gideon · 07-23-2009, 10:46 PM

Yeah, I shouldn't have said it either.. lol....

(but seriously, I would so trade!)

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07-23-2009, 07:08 PM	#1
ficbot Wizard Posts: 2,409 Karma: 4132096 Join Date: Sep 2008 Device: Kindle Paperwhite/iOS Kindle App	Do Americans have it better? Between the Kindle and the new USA-only Barnes & Noble venture, it's hard not to worry about the state of ebooks outside the USA. Do the publishers even realize that people in other countries might want in on this? Do they care? I get jealous sometimes about all the cool Kindles and gadgets the Americans have which are USA-only, and it annoys me when people refer to the Kindle as the 'market leader' and seem to forget that the 'market' is much more than just America, and the Kindle is a restricted item. Here in Canada, we don't have the Kindle or Barnes & Noble. I seem to be getting by just fine with Fictionwise and my Sony, but I worry that things are just going to get more and more American, and I may be left behind if all these new products are only USA. BUT...here in Canada we still have life+50 copyrights, so there are all sorts of things we can get for free that Americans can't So I am curious, if you had to choose between 'Kindle and related products' OR 'life+50 copyright' which would you choose? Do Americans really have the better deal?

07-23-2009, 08:00 PM	#3
Stitchawl Opsimath Posts: 12,344 Karma: 187123287 Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chiang Mai, Northern Thailand Device: Sony PRS-650, iPhone 5, Kobo Glo, Sony PRS-350, iPad, Samsung Galaxy	As an American, I am appalled at the nationalist attitudes and policies of my native country. Having lived outside the US for the past 20+ years and seen the USA through the eyes of the rest of the world, I can only say that we need to get our act together and stop relying upon our memories of what was, and plan for what will be! I was shocked to discover that we were not #1. It went against everything I was taught to believe, and I'm sure my comments will raise the ire of many Americans here in MR. (I'm sorry. It's not my intention to offend. It's my intention to state facts.) I can't close my eyes to what I see every day. There is a very big world outside of the US that impacts every single economic, ecological, and political issue of our future. Having closed markets will not destroy the industry. It will destroy America's ability to interact with the rest of the world. If this is a move to revert back to the Monroe Doctrine, it will be a good beginning. If it's part of a plan to help stem the flow of people traveling in or out of the US, it's a good beginning. Amazon is NOT the only book seller. It's just the most advertised. Outside the US, Americans learn that there are many other retailers besides Sears, besides Walmart, besides Amazon. How many Americas have ever shopped at (or even heard of) a Tessco or a Carrefour? 7-Eleven is wide-spread but so is Sparr. There is an entire world outside of Amazon. Outside of Sony-USA and its sales restrictions. Outside of "we don't ship outside CONUS." This is not going to affect the rest of the world's buying habits. It's going to teach that there are plenty of other avenues available. I'll get off my soapbox now. Sorry for the rant. Stitchawl

07-23-2009, 08:12 PM	#4
Gideon Wearer of Pants Posts: 1,050 Karma: 7634 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Norman, OK Device: Amazon Kindle DX / iPhone	This is just where an enormous amount of media and industry is centered. The countries are far from nationalistic, but many of them are based here. Amazon and B&N for instance. I don't think ascribing nationalism to them is useful or accurate. There greed will reach out and touch everyone soon enough.

07-23-2009, 08:17 PM	#6
Sonist Apeist Posts: 2,126 Karma: 381090 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: The sunny part of California Device: Generic virtual reality story-experiential device	Bleh, why bother selling ebooks outside of the US? Everyone knows, that those people people can't read. Heck, most of them can't even speak, but just make some unintelligible sounds that don't make no sense.

07-23-2009, 08:49 PM	#8
kazbates Wizard Posts: 2,627 Karma: 406616 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Northern Virginia Device: SurfacePro, SurfaceBook 2	Why does it always come down to a question of the US versus everyone else? I'm an American and love my country. It has it's faults, just as I have mine. There are things about my country that I am enormously proud of and things that completely distress me. I would imagine most people feel the same about their countries. One of the many things I like about MR is the friendly international spirit that is represented by it's members. I can relate to posters in Paris, the UK, Australia, etc., and feel that life and all it's foibles is the same no matter where we live. Having said all that, I can understand non-Americans' frustration with not being able to purchase some of the technology that is available here in the US. I'm sure their are a whole host of reasons why these things are not sold outside of the US yet. I have theories as to why, but since I am not skilled in market analysis, trade agreements, technology transfer, etc., they are probably pretty basic. I just hate to see this turn into yet another we vs. them.

07-23-2009, 10:16 PM	#10
rixte Addict Posts: 300 Karma: 396757 Join Date: Nov 2007 Device: new oasis, paperwhite, ipad, kobo	Well, I have to say, personally I'm envious of some of the devices we're seeing for release in Korea. And I'd kill to get that Pocket 360 I've seen linked to!

07-23-2009, 10:22 PM	#11
HansTWN Wizard Posts: 4,538 Karma: 264065402 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Taiwan Device: HP Touchpad, Sony Duo 13, Lumia 920, Kobo Aura HD	No need to get all excited about this. Yes, thinks tend to be cheaper in America because it is very big market, the competition is immense, and Americans are extremely price sensitive. But there are ways around these restrictions. Well, Americans pay the price elsewhere. Lousy to mediocre cell phone service at ridiculously high prices. Expensive and slow internet and cable TV. The world's worst air lines. Long work hours. All evens out in the end.

07-23-2009, 10:24 PM	#12
Gideon Wearer of Pants Posts: 1,050 Karma: 7634 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Norman, OK Device: Amazon Kindle DX / iPhone	And a horrid lack of decent health care!

07-23-2009, 10:27 PM	#13
griffonwing Suave Swabby, Savvy? Posts: 1,602 Karma: 520350 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Harrison, ARrrr, USA - southern Ozark mountains Device: Slate Blue PEZ (Astak Pocket Pro), CVSCX-9300 Quad-band watch phone	I'm not impressed with anything in the ereader field that is America-only. America has to have "it slices, it dices, it marinates your chicken WHILE it debones the bird..." and it's all proprietary-this, and exclusive-that. It's frustrating. Like when Dell (and not JUST dell, Compaq, HP, Gateway2000) came out with their PCs, you couldn't change anything, you had to send it back to the company and have a proprietary mobo put in, or a specific kind of RAM. Now that they've made a name for themselves, they've opened up to the universal formats. I do not see the Topaz or BBeB format lasting too much longer. I also don't see Amazon and B&N being USA-only too much longer either. Once the companies in the US get their eyes open and their respective heads from out of their arses, we might see some progress. I just wish our US govt would get their heads out of THEIR arses and actually listen to the people of this nation. Maybe then we'd start to get back some respect in this world. I stand proud of America, but shameful of my country's political machinations.

07-23-2009, 10:46 PM	#15
Gideon Wearer of Pants Posts: 1,050 Karma: 7634 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Norman, OK Device: Amazon Kindle DX / iPhone	Yeah, I shouldn't have said it either.. lol.... (but seriously, I would so trade!)

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