Makes me glad my reader is not connected

GntlmnBndt · 07-17-2009, 04:34 PM

http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/17/a...s-unpersons-r/

So, the company selling the books decides they don't want to anymore, so Amazon is unselling them? And taking the books back remotely?

If you look off in the distance, there in that shimmer off the pavement, you can see Orwell pointing and laughing his dang head off.

The Bandit

rcuadro · 07-17-2009, 04:37 PM

That is why I...
1. Keep Wispernet off unless I know a book is waiting for download or I know there is an update pending...
2. Download a copy of the book and keep it in Calibre

zerospinboson · 07-17-2009, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcuadro

That is why I...
1. Keep Wispernet off unless I know a book is waiting for download or I know there is an update pending...
2. Download a copy of the book and keep it in Calibre

3. hope for alternatives to Amazon?

PGP_Protector · 07-17-2009, 04:43 PM

Was just reading about this.
Glad I've got a Sony, I like the Kindle, but remote deletion ? that's just sad.

cvkemp · 07-17-2009, 04:51 PM

I am glad I have the EZreader for the same reason. Plus I can shop around for what firmware I want to use.

Chuck

rcuadro · 07-17-2009, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zerospinboson

3. hope for alternatives to Amazon?

For me Amazon is the best deal going around. My sis is not computer literate so being able to just have a book sent to her through Wispernet offsets the negatives like this remote delete thing that has happened

richman · 07-17-2009, 05:34 PM

We just don't know how much amazon is seeing what you are doing on your kindle, if it is anything like Amazon's site, they track everything I do on that site, and gear there ads to things I check out. Now if you just have amazon stuff on your kindle and no personal stuff and you get refunded anything they remove , kindle 2 would be good for you, as others seem to feel.

griffonwing · 07-17-2009, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Update: According to commenters on Amazon, this message was sent out from the company's customer service department:

The Kindle edition books Animal Farm by George Orwell. Published by MobileReference (mobi) & Nineteen Eighty-Four (1984) by George Orwell. Published by MobileReference (mobi) were removed from the Kindle store and are no longer available for purchase. When this occured, your purchases were automatically refunded. You can still locate the books in the Kindle store, but each has a status of not yet available. Although a rarity, publishers can decide to pull their content from the Kindle store.

It's one thing to simply remove an item from the Kindle store if a publisher changes their mind about selling kindle versions, but it's another thing entirely to delete all copies that were sold.

At the time they were bought, they had an agreement to sell them. They were legal copies, in every way. Just because someone changes their mind about how they are distributed, does NOT mean that all copies that were sold are removed from legitimate purchases.

Illegal Ayn Rand books are one thing, simple changes of mind are something totally different.

Amazon stepped WAY out of line on this one.

phenomshel · 07-17-2009, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by griffonwing

It's one thing to simply remove an item from the Kindle store if a publisher changes their mind about selling kindle versions, but it's another thing entirely to delete all copies that were sold.

At the time they were bought, they had an agreement to sell them. They were legal copies, in every way. Just because someone changes their mind about how they are distributed, does NOT mean that all copies that were sold are removed from legitimate purchases.

Illegal Ayn Rand books are one thing, simple changes of mind are something totally different.

Amazon stepped WAY out of line on this one.

I have to agree. There for a while I wanted a Kindle to go with my EZ reader. I thought it'd be the best of both worlds, so to speak...Access to Amazon's selection but (unless the files were Topaz) able to be read on either device (after some not to be mentioned tinkering). All the talk about Amazon disabling access to ebooks people had bought, removing content from Kindles via Whispernet, etc. has changed my mind. Yes, I'd still like to have access to Amazon's selection, there are things there you can't get anywhere else (Like the Stephen Lawhead Robin Hood trilogy). But it's simply not worth it to me to take that kind of risk. Once I buy it, it's mine. You don't get to come to my house without an invitation and take it back. Neither do you get to access my device without permission and delete it.

Abecedary · 07-17-2009, 07:22 PM

I'm glad I don't have to worry about this crap. And while I understood where they were coming from with the Rand situation (though I didn't necessarily agree with it), this is just plain wrong.

As for alternatives, let's hope that Google does a good job with their ebook store. They're one of the only companies (aside from Amazon) I can think of that has the clout to nudge publishers in the right direction.

Patricia · 07-17-2009, 07:30 PM

A double-plus ungood decision, I think.

moz · 07-17-2009, 07:40 PM

Why the fuss? Amazon sold people a license to use the content in a limited set of ways, then withdrew that license. It's just like a rental car company ringing you to say the car you got isn't safe and sorry they don't have a replacement available. Kinda tough on you, but better than discovering exactly how unsafe it is. Getting whacked for a million bucks or so for each book (RIAA numbers) would hurt way more than losing access to a book.

I look at DRMed books as rentals. You don't own anything other than a restricted right to access the book in a narrowly restricted set of ways. Just like renting a video or anything else. Any time the seller likes they can yank the content. That's never been a secret, it's happened before and it will happen again. If you don't like it, don't rent books.

Musicman · 07-17-2009, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moz

Why the fuss? Amazon sold people a license to use the content in a limited set of ways, then withdrew that license.

I look at DRMed books as rentals. You don't own anything other than a restricted right to access the book in a narrowly restricted set of ways. Just like renting a video or anything else. Any time the seller likes they can yank the content. That's never been a secret, it's happened before and it will happen again. If you don't like it, don't rent books.

No...
Just don't buy a Kindle or any other hardware you do not have complete control of.

fugazied · 07-17-2009, 08:06 PM

Grrr this is madness. They are trying to take us from a model where we buy a paper book to which they own the copyright for (the ability to press more copies) to a model where we 'rent' a virtual item that we don't have full control over and which they can take back?

Sorry Amazon, this is just ridiculous. Please let there be an Apple tablet with less draconian/ludicrous DRM and copyright enforcement.

slayda · 07-17-2009, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcuadro

For me Amazon is the best deal going around. My sis is not computer literate so being able to just have a book sent to her through Wispernet offsets the negatives like this remote delete thing that has happened

Obviously the point here is, "Easy come, easy go!"

Or perhaps pushing things a bit further, "Amazon giveth and Amazon taketh away. Blasted be the name of Amazon!"

07-17-2009, 04:34 PM	#1
GntlmnBndt Zealot Posts: 135 Karma: 142 Join Date: Jul 2008 Device: iPod Touch, iPad	Makes me glad my reader is not connected http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/17/a...s-unpersons-r/ So, the company selling the books decides they don't want to anymore, so Amazon is unselling them? And taking the books back remotely? If you look off in the distance, there in that shimmer off the pavement, you can see Orwell pointing and laughing his dang head off. The Bandit Last edited by GntlmnBndt; 07-17-2009 at 04:36 PM.

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07-17-2009, 04:37 PM	#2
rcuadro Wizard Posts: 1,686 Karma: 874275 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Device: Kindle DX	That is why I... 1. Keep Wispernet off unless I know a book is waiting for download or I know there is an update pending... 2. Download a copy of the book and keep it in Calibre

07-17-2009, 04:43 PM	#4
PGP_Protector Enthusiast Posts: 44 Karma: 208 Join Date: Jan 2009 Device: PRS-505	Was just reading about this. Glad I've got a Sony, I like the Kindle, but remote deletion ? that's just sad.

07-17-2009, 04:51 PM	#5
cvkemp Loving life Posts: 1,412 Karma: 7991496 Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Hot Springs Village, Arkansas Device: PaperWhite 5,iPhone 13, IPad, MacBook Air	I am glad I have the EZreader for the same reason. Plus I can shop around for what firmware I want to use. Chuck

07-17-2009, 05:34 PM	#7
richman Addict Posts: 269 Karma: 58 Join Date: Jul 2009 Device: sony prs-505 BLUE,itouch,netbook	We just don't know how much amazon is seeing what you are doing on your kindle, if it is anything like Amazon's site, they track everything I do on that site, and gear there ads to things I check out. Now if you just have amazon stuff on your kindle and no personal stuff and you get refunded anything they remove , kindle 2 would be good for you, as others seem to feel.

07-17-2009, 07:22 PM	#10
Abecedary Exwyzeeologist Posts: 535 Karma: 3261 Join Date: Jun 2009 Device: :PRS-505::iPod touch:	I'm glad I don't have to worry about this crap. And while I understood where they were coming from with the Rand situation (though I didn't necessarily agree with it), this is just plain wrong. As for alternatives, let's hope that Google does a good job with their ebook store. They're one of the only companies (aside from Amazon) I can think of that has the clout to nudge publishers in the right direction.

07-17-2009, 07:30 PM	#11
Patricia Reader Posts: 11,504 Karma: 8720163 Join Date: May 2007 Location: South Wales, UK Device: Sony PRS-500, PRS-505, Asus EEEpc 4G	A double-plus ungood decision, I think.

07-17-2009, 07:40 PM	#12
moz Addict Posts: 370 Karma: 1553 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Melbun Device: Kobo H2O	Why the fuss? Amazon sold people a license to use the content in a limited set of ways, then withdrew that license. It's just like a rental car company ringing you to say the car you got isn't safe and sorry they don't have a replacement available. Kinda tough on you, but better than discovering exactly how unsafe it is. Getting whacked for a million bucks or so for each book (RIAA numbers) would hurt way more than losing access to a book. I look at DRMed books as rentals. You don't own anything other than a restricted right to access the book in a narrowly restricted set of ways. Just like renting a video or anything else. Any time the seller likes they can yank the content. That's never been a secret, it's happened before and it will happen again. If you don't like it, don't rent books.

07-17-2009, 08:06 PM	#14
fugazied Wizard Posts: 1,305 Karma: 1958 Join Date: Jan 2009 Device: iPod Touch	Grrr this is madness. They are trying to take us from a model where we buy a paper book to which they own the copyright for (the ability to press more copies) to a model where we 'rent' a virtual item that we don't have full control over and which they can take back? Sorry Amazon, this is just ridiculous. Please let there be an Apple tablet with less draconian/ludicrous DRM and copyright enforcement.