I need to learn more about encryption and DRM

jbcohen · 10-20-2010, 08:20 AM

The maker of my ebook reader has told me that I can not use ebooks sold by Barnes and Nobles because their books are encrypted for use by the Nook and Pandigital Novel. They went further to say that Sony and Amazon do the same thing. Does this mean that these three companies use DRM? I take it to mean that I can not buy ebooks from Amazon, Barnes and Nobles and Sony unless I have their reader. They went further to inform me that I can buy books from any company that does not encrypt their products, is the company using the term encryption as a synonym for DRM? Would someone please list some web store sites that do not encrypt their products. I have seen the thread on this forum that gives some links to such sites already.

treetotree · 10-20-2010, 08:52 AM

http://www.bewrite.net/

http://www.smashwords.com/

http://blog.threepress.org/2009/11/1...ee-publishers/

Amazon books only work on a Kindle. B&N books will only work on their suported readers. I think you can get books at Borders and Kobo. They use Adobe epub drm. I think that works on an, Aluratek. Maybe someone else can confirm this.

I like Bewrite Books and Smashword for DRM free books.
Hope this helps.

GeoffC · 10-20-2010, 08:57 AM

Some sources of books available in my sig. line .... ( DRM stinks, but can be removed :coughs: ).
Not all purchased books carry DRM, the multiple-format range at fictionwise (for example).

you are correct, DRM = encryption

It's not the end of the World, just a long road to travel, via a mountain, two streams and an avalanche crossing. You can ( I am told) download from Amazon to the "kindle-for-pc" software [similarly for others]
and take the resultant books 'apart' and read them on other readers.

Not all of us have a kindle/iPad etc....

jbcohen · 10-20-2010, 09:10 AM

I ahve noticed that there are a lot of ebook stores that talk about which format you want to use. Does this mean that their products are not DRM?

HarryT · 10-20-2010, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbcohen

I ahve noticed that there are a lot of ebook stores that talk about which format you want to use. Does this mean that their products are not DRM?

The overwhelming majority of eBook stores sell books in ePub format with Adobe's ADE DRM mechanism. B&N use their own DRM mechanism for ePub, so their books can only be read on a nook. Amazon use a completely different format (again with DRM) for the Kindle.

What formats does your reading device support? It's one that I'm unfamiliar with.

jbcohen · 10-20-2010, 11:04 AM

epub and PDF. Most people are not familar with my Aluratek, I bought it becuase its a great quality reader at $100 price tag. Don't get me wrong I am not against the Kindle or Sony, its that Aluratek sold me the reader for the price I wanted to pay for it.

MrPLD · 10-20-2010, 11:10 AM

A lot of the big publishers / distributors do still use DRM, however many authors have also opted out (eg, on Amazon, when we upload our eBooks we get to choose if we turn DRM on or off).

Also many independent authors provide DRM-free content. So, if you're looking for DRM-free content then you may find yourself spending more time amongst the independent writers, at least for the next few years.

Paul

jbcohen · 10-20-2010, 11:14 AM

Probably won't worry about this much it seems that Borders tends to be the lowest cost provider for the type of books that I tend to read and the ereader that I have came from Borders. However, I am rather interested in widing the range of competant bidders (government speak for a provider who can provide the product you want). If you want a kindle and the store offers a Sony that's not a competant bidder.

MaggieScratch · 10-20-2010, 12:23 PM

I think the Aluratek can be flashed with the Jetbook firmware, which will allow you to read books from Barnes & Noble. Also you should be able to read books from every other bookstore except Amazon (in other words, Adobe Digital Editions).

TallMomof2 · 10-20-2010, 04:33 PM

I have an Aluratek Libre and can purchase and read books from Sony, Kobo, and Borders just to name a few. If your local library has ebooks they will use the Adobe DRM and can be read on the Libre.

bill_mchale · 10-20-2010, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

The overwhelming majority of eBook stores sell books in ePub format with Adobe's ADE DRM mechanism. B&N use their own DRM mechanism for ePub, so their books can only be read on a nook. Amazon use a completely different format (again with DRM) for the Kindle.

What formats does your reading device support? It's one that I'm unfamiliar with.

A quick correction. Jetbook and Pandigital also support the eReader DRM. Furthermore, Adobe supports it as well... many readers (Sony, Kobo, Pocketbook, Bookeen most prominently) that otherwise support Adobe, have not yet opted to support the eReader DRM option.

--
Bill

bill_mchale · 10-20-2010, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoffC

you are correct, DRM = encryption

To expand on that idea a little.

DRM, at least modern DRM is based on the encryption. Essentially the book is encrypted, often for the specific reader you are using, and then the ebook reader (or in the case of B&N ereader DRM you) provides the decryption key which allows you to ultimately read the book.

Now, this also points out why DRM is never going to be effective at stopping pirates. The decryption key needs to be available to whoever purchased the book. Unless a company can completely hide the method of decryption (exceedingly unlikely) there is no way that a good programmer will not be able to develop a tool to permanently decrypt the ebook.

--
Bill

BWhite · 10-20-2010, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill_mchale

A quick correction. Jetbook and Pandigital also support the eReader DRM. Furthermore, Adobe supports it as well... many readers (Sony, Kobo, Pocketbook, Bookeen most prominently) that otherwise support Adobe, have not yet opted to support the eReader DRM option.

--
Bill

Ah, this is disappointing news.

I was of the impression if you introduced a PC into the equation, a PC running Adobe Digital Editions, that you could purchase a B&N eBook, bring it into your Adobe DE running on your PC, and then side-load the B&N eBook onto the Sony Reader via USB.

I got that impression from this page
http://blogs.adobe.com/digitalpublis...ported-devices

wallcraft · 10-21-2010, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWhite

I was of the impression if you introduced a PC into the equation, a PC running Adobe Digital Editions, that you could purchase a B&N eBook, bring it into your Adobe DE running on your PC, and then side-load the B&N eBook onto the Sony Reader via USB.

No. It is the other way around. If you buy an Adobe DRM ePub you can side-load it onto a Nook. In other words the Nook supports both B&N DRM and Adobe DRM for ePubs.

The good news is that Adobe and B&N and Kindle DRM can all be defeated. This is probably legal in the US providing you only do it for personal use (e.g. to read ebooks you bought on a different device). See Apprentice Alf's Blog for a summary of the state of play. Note that Kindle for PC is the best way for an ePub reader to get access to Kindle AZW (MOBI) ebooks. Once DRM-free you can format shift them via Calibre, and there is a Calibre plug in to strip the DRM from K4PC ebooks.

whitearrow · 10-21-2010, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treetotree

Amazon books only work on a Kindle.

And on Kindle for PC, or Mac, computer software. And iPhone, Blackberry, and Android phones.

Kindle books only work on supported Kindle software, which is available on a number of different platforms.

10-20-2010, 08:20 AM	#1
jbcohen Wizard Posts: 3,025 Karma: 11196738 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Piper College Device: Samsung A21	I need to learn more about encryption and DRM The maker of my ebook reader has told me that I can not use ebooks sold by Barnes and Nobles because their books are encrypted for use by the Nook and Pandigital Novel. They went further to say that Sony and Amazon do the same thing. Does this mean that these three companies use DRM? I take it to mean that I can not buy ebooks from Amazon, Barnes and Nobles and Sony unless I have their reader. They went further to inform me that I can buy books from any company that does not encrypt their products, is the company using the term encryption as a synonym for DRM? Would someone please list some web store sites that do not encrypt their products. I have seen the thread on this forum that gives some links to such sites already. Last edited by poohbear_nc; 10-20-2010 at 08:27 AM. Reason: cleaned up some spelling mistakes

10-20-2010, 08:57 AM	#3
GeoffC Chocolate Grasshopper ... Posts: 27,600 Karma: 20821184 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Scotland Device: Muse HD , Cybook Gen3 , Pocketbook 302 (Black) , Nexus 10: wife has PW	Some sources of books available in my sig. line .... ( DRM stinks, but can be removed :coughs: ). Not all purchased books carry DRM, the multiple-format range at fictionwise (for example). you are correct, DRM = encryption It's not the end of the World, just a long road to travel, via a mountain, two streams and an avalanche crossing. You can ( I am told) download from Amazon to the "kindle-for-pc" software [similarly for others] and take the resultant books 'apart' and read them on other readers. Not all of us have a kindle/iPad etc.... Last edited by GeoffC; 10-20-2010 at 09:01 AM.

10-20-2010, 11:04 AM	#6
jbcohen Wizard Posts: 3,025 Karma: 11196738 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Piper College Device: Samsung A21	epub and PDF. Most people are not familar with my Aluratek, I bought it becuase its a great quality reader at $100 price tag. Don't get me wrong I am not against the Kindle or Sony, its that Aluratek sold me the reader for the price I wanted to pay for it. Last edited by jbcohen; 10-20-2010 at 11:06 AM.

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10-20-2010, 08:52 AM	#2
treetotree Connoisseur Posts: 61 Karma: 346 Join Date: May 2010 Location: Florida Device: Jetbook Lite, Kindle DXG,prs-350, wife k3	http://www.bewrite.net/ http://www.smashwords.com/ http://blog.threepress.org/2009/11/1...ee-publishers/ Amazon books only work on a Kindle. B&N books will only work on their suported readers. I think you can get books at Borders and Kobo. They use Adobe epub drm. I think that works on an, Aluratek. Maybe someone else can confirm this. I like Bewrite Books and Smashword for DRM free books. Hope this helps.

10-20-2010, 09:10 AM	#4
jbcohen Wizard Posts: 3,025 Karma: 11196738 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Piper College Device: Samsung A21	I ahve noticed that there are a lot of ebook stores that talk about which format you want to use. Does this mean that their products are not DRM?

10-20-2010, 11:10 AM	#7
MrPLD Author's pet-geek Posts: 933 Karma: 1040670 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: North Queensland, Australia Device: Kindle 3 Wifi, Onyx Boox M96	A lot of the big publishers / distributors do still use DRM, however many authors have also opted out (eg, on Amazon, when we upload our eBooks we get to choose if we turn DRM on or off). Also many independent authors provide DRM-free content. So, if you're looking for DRM-free content then you may find yourself spending more time amongst the independent writers, at least for the next few years. Paul

10-20-2010, 11:14 AM	#8
jbcohen Wizard Posts: 3,025 Karma: 11196738 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Piper College Device: Samsung A21	Probably won't worry about this much it seems that Borders tends to be the lowest cost provider for the type of books that I tend to read and the ereader that I have came from Borders. However, I am rather interested in widing the range of competant bidders (government speak for a provider who can provide the product you want). If you want a kindle and the store offers a Sony that's not a competant bidder.

10-20-2010, 12:23 PM	#9
MaggieScratch Has got to the black veil Posts: 542 Karma: 2144168 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Southeastern Pennsylvania Device: Kobo Aura One, Kindle Paperwhite 2	I think the Aluratek can be flashed with the Jetbook firmware, which will allow you to read books from Barnes & Noble. Also you should be able to read books from every other bookstore except Amazon (in other words, Adobe Digital Editions).

10-20-2010, 04:33 PM	#10
TallMomof2 Kindlephilia Posts: 2,017 Karma: 1139255 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Snowpacolypse 2010 Device: Too many to count	I have an Aluratek Libre and can purchase and read books from Sony, Kobo, and Borders just to name a few. If your local library has ebooks they will use the Adobe DRM and can be read on the Libre.